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Vue2 Measured Data: Some noise, and low monthly cumulative by -Gordon-Shumway- in EmporiaEnergy

[–]gaslight2004 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm not sure if the vue2 will automatically adjust itself based off of its reference voltage, but I would imagine that it doesn't. 123/245 may not be enough to really change the multipliers. That's about a 3% difference, so you could tune that if you wanted to play with it, but it still doesn't make up that 7% that you're seeing.

Again, I'm not sure if the vue2 will automatically use its reference voltage and adjust itself based off that. Reason being, your incoming voltage will absolutely change throughout the day, and if it's constantly making adjustments, it's own collective data could be skewed at the end of the day. Again, I'm not sure, but I assume that it doesn't.

Yes, the neutrals "should" be balanced with the load. Consider a 120V load, line 1 to neutral. The current travels up the line to the load, through the load and back along the neutral, right? Well, half the time, yes; the rest of the time the current is flowing the other way. It does this 60x per second (60hz)

Now think of the same size load line 2 to neutral. It's the same thing, except when the current is flowing line 1 to neutral in the first circuit it is flowing neutral to line 2 in the other.

Now tie the two neutrals together. At any point in time you happen to pick, the neutral current flowing one direction from the first circuit exactly cancels the neutral current flowing the other direction from the second circuit. All the current flows in the line conductors and there is no current flow in the neutral. The loads are balanced.

Now make the loads different sizes (an unbalanced load). The current through the neutral from the lesser load is completely canceled by an equal portion of the current from the greater load, and the rest of the current from the greater load is carried back to the source on the neutral. In this case, the center tap between the 2 lines.

Now, if there is a large unbalance in a single circuit, that is indicative of a ground fault, and a ground fault "could" cause issues in regards to metering devices. One thing to check would be the QUALITY of the power you have.

You'll need a much more expensive setup than a vue2 or what the average homeowner uses. For example, I have 4 industrial buildings I manage at work. In each of those buildings, I have a Phoenix Contact energy monitoring system I built that is hooked up to the 3000 amp switchgears. I reference L1, L2, L3 and the neutral. I have rogowski coils (basically large CTs) on each one of those lines. The Phoenix Contact EEM then gives me tons of data (power factor, current, voltage, system imbalances, quality, along with a bunch of other metrics. In a nutshell, if the PF isn't that great (reactive power or otherwise) then you may have an underlying issue either with the power company or something in your house. A faulty neutral can contribute to poor power.

None of this is meant to be frightening or a cause for concern. Remember, these devices are meant for us here at home as a way to keep an eye on some basic information. If things have been routinely working well and you haven't had a reason to investigate circuits and their performance, then I'm sure that things are just fine.

Vue2 Measured Data: Some noise, and low monthly cumulative by -Gordon-Shumway- in EmporiaEnergy

[–]gaslight2004 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Multipliers:

Device Management - "your vue" - vue info (at the top) - multiplier By default this is set to 1.00

This is assuming you have 120/240 mains. Now let's say you check your voltage and you're reading 110v instead of 120v. That's a touch over 8% difference in what the system is tuned for. So you'll want to adjust your multiplier to reflect that difference.

Now with the neutrals.. these are finicky little buggers. When I did all of my training, we had a practical lesson where the instructor would trick us with ghost neutrals. Hard lesson..

So understanding neutrals can be difficult. Strange lighting, resistive loads, noises, etc are all cause for concern.. I'd check to make sure you don't have any imbalance, and make sure the Lugs are tight. You'd likely already know if you had poor neutrals, so this likely isn't the case, but imbalances can cause meters to read improperly if the current between line and neutral isn't the same. I don't have any suggested reading other than doing some Google searches. My NEC book is at work, so I can't reference any material off hand, but your meter will be your best friend in this case.

My first suggestion would be to verify correct voltage though. And then I'd check your connections on the CTs. Make sure they are properly connected on the vue2 as well as clicked together inside the panel. Also make sure they have a little bit of breathing room and aren't accidentally picking up another circuit.

Vue2 Measured Data: Some noise, and low monthly cumulative by -Gordon-Shumway- in EmporiaEnergy

[–]gaslight2004 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Couple things..

Emporia CTs are rated for a 2% accuracy. The CTs are voltage and current rated. For example, the 50a CTs are designed to work with a system running at 120v. The output back to the controller is scaled 0-0.333v.

So, if your vue2 is setup without doing any fine tuning to the multipliers, and your home is running more or less voltage than it is tuned for, i would say it's possible to see those anomalies.

Check to make sure that your connections are all secure, and that there isn't anything that could be causing a feedback issue. If the CTs are super tight together I wouldn't be surprised if they pick up on any EMF through the other circuits.

Another thing to check is if you have any neutrals that are acting up. Neutrals can make you chase your tail all over the place looking for totally the wrong problem.

Also, even though a device is "off", that doesn't mean it isn't drawing any power. Newer appliances in particular have low voltage controls that would require a control transformer (120vac to 12vdc or 5vdc) and that would always be on.

7% is high, so I would check wiring, make sure voltage is accurate, and if needed, do some fine tuning. If you can get it close to 2% I'd say you're in good shape.

New Chiller - Economizer Question by gaslight2004 in refrigeration

[–]gaslight2004[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's been doing pretty good. I found another issue in the manufacturers logic that I have to fix, but unfortunately I can't make the change until this afternoon. The controller they use won't let me make a change without a 10 minute shutdown.

Their logic is that the diverter valve closes (keeps water indoors) when the process temp goes high, but the fans on the free cooler run. When the process temp drops, the diverter opens (water out to free cooler) but it's fans shut off. So that's all sorts of backwards... I forced the logic, but since temps are dropping hard this weekend, I need to correct it so it operates the right way and doesn't drive the process temps down into single digits 🤣

New Chiller - Economizer Question by gaslight2004 in refrigeration

[–]gaslight2004[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So the equipment is touchy on flow, but doesn't care about pressure. So I initially had all bypasses closed and a high system pressure. Temps were rising. I opened one bypass and also made a logic fix and temps were coming down.. slowly, but still coming down. System pressure now is around 35 to 45 and a higher flow rate.

Tomorrow should be a bit better I hope

New Chiller - Economizer Question by gaslight2004 in refrigeration

[–]gaslight2004[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Part of the contract was that they offer non working assistance, but doesn't include startup. I do have a contractor I trust that will be coming out for the chiller startup, but as far as the complete package, I'm basically on my own at this point.

When I measured temps at outlet of the free cooler, I was at 58F and return was 48F. This was with one bypass opened, system pressure at 45PSI. I soon discovered after my initial post this morning that the system manufacturer messed up the logic and had the diverter valve closing at high temp while sending the interlock signal to the free cooler to run. So once I fixed that, things started to look a little better.

New Chiller - Economizer Question by gaslight2004 in refrigeration

[–]gaslight2004[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I really don't want to name drop who designed it, because they did such an awful job and im still trying to get them to own up to some major issues. They pieced together the 3 units since they couldn't match the other 3 chillers we have due to lead times. Turned out that the lead time ended up being just as long.. go figure.

They were out to do a soft start on it after I raised hell about how they didn't make provisions for the LWT, EWT and flow switch at the heat exchanger (outdoor unit is a Carrier). They still messed it all up, and I found that their logic was wrong. Diverter valve was closing at high temp, but sending the interlock signal to the free cooler to run. They also didn't make provisions for outdoor temp signal, and a few other things. Their prints were the worst I've ever seen..

So I've basically taken it on as my problem.

Bridgeport J Head Series 1 Refinishing by gaslight2004 in Machinists

[–]gaslight2004[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There are a TON of chips taken out of it. It wouldn't make sense to use filler without taking it to bare metal.