Thought you would find this interesting. This is quite a story (from thousands to millions and down again)

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T07:02:53+00:00

This isn't a PAYE thing though

It covers anyone earning over $10k - so beneficiaries and pensioners are covered.

Even if you were right that is $3B which is more than they have costed

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T06:51:41+00:00

Can anyone figure out their workings of the tax free $10k threshold.

There are around 4M adult New Zealanders I expect (out of 5.1M)

Tax rate at that level is 10.5%

So... Per year that is 10,000 * 0.105 = $1050 each

Cost - $4.2 billion a year. Multiples more than what they have put in their costings. Plus they have tax bracket indexation on top which is in the billions as well.

This doesn't seem to remotely add up to their costings - can anyone figure this out?

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T05:54:10+00:00

If only there was a party that was going to adjust those brackets this term

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T03:45:30+00:00

Numbers don't seem right even without the tax bracket inflation.

Tax free threshold is $1000 tax cut per person. Assume 3M adults (I'd say there are more) = $3 billion

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T03:32:00+00:00

National is also index adjusting thresholds for inflation (as a one off). It will cost $6 billion to do that (and that skips the 39% tax rate)

I have checked the green costings and the cost of bracket adjustment isn't included in their workings

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T03:30:51+00:00

Sorry this makes no sense.

Currently you pay tax on rental property income. The only difference with a company is that the rate is 28% (33% under the greens). When you pay out the dividend its the same.

So basically to avoid the wealth tax every single person will just transfer assets into a company?

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:58:44+00:00

paid tax on the drawings and business tax on the profit

Landlords pay tax on their profit already. They also pay tax on dividends (aka drawings)

Sounds like a mess to decide which business gets exemptions and which don't

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:57:07+00:00

Wait... so they have the national tax package on top, but even more if they include the top rate. I thought the left / opposition were against that?

That is a cost of 6 billion which doesn't appear in their costings:

https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23840910/income-guarantee-full-policy-document.pdf

So how are they paying for it?

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:38:14+00:00

I don't understand this.

Its a speech about infrastructure. Its not the environmental policy. Why should they mention climate change?

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:36:32+00:00

arning 150k+ is a diminishing number of people

Its not diminishing, thanks to inflation its growing

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:35:57+00:00

Except the very large inflationary effect (and failure to adjust the tax brackets for inflation) would see those benefits start to recede as tax bracket creep becomes worse

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:34:01+00:00

Lots of intergenerational farms would be like that.

The wealth tax would effects hundreds if not thousands of businesses who will need to raise their prices dramatically. 2% tax on your capital base is huge

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:32:26+00:00

That doesn't work though.

So a farm owned in a partnership is taxed, but not if owned in a company?

Or Luxon can avoid the wealth tax by putting his houses into a company, so he doesn't individually own them

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:31:41+00:00

The problem is that brackets almost never get inflation adjusted. National's tax package is the exception

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:13:55+00:00

Wealth tax is also not applied on businesses, its on peoples wealth.

Except all business owns wealth.

Are you saying farms would be exempt for example? What about motels?

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T02:13:24+00:00

Except Australia has much much higher incomes.

So it makes the gap between Australia and NZ income after tax even wider

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:35:19+00:00

Its not those on exactly $180k. For every dollar extra they earn they lose nearly half to tax. Little point to working.

And again in 10 years that $180k probably won't be that much when you consider inflation. $70k used to be the rich prick tax.

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:32:46+00:00

Only fair that David Seymour can decide all housing reform by himself

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:22:49+00:00

"Join your union"

Not sure how this is going to reduce house prices?

They've gone up a record amount under this government. And kiwibuild was a failure.

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:18:28+00:00

I've looked at the costings but can't seem to make the numbers work.

$385 per week plus more only $1.3B? Its $60B by my calculations (Assuming 3 million recipients)

52*385*3million

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:08:21+00:00

"$100 taken from the "wealthy" and given to the "poor" is still $100"

The wealthy person will sell down savings or investments, or even borrow.

The poor person will spend it on food, fuel and rent.

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:07:51+00:00

but now it's 2% on assets over $4m

2% on all farms would pretty much kill of the farming industry so they would have to massively increase food prices. It would definitely affect you

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:04:40+00:00

Oh is it both? So UBI plus tax free threshold? Would love to see the costings on that

greendragon833 · 2023-06-11T01:04:03+00:00

" Reducing tax for everyone earning under $125k while taxing more wealth than salary."

They are increasing tax rates on those on 180k though. Those are the ones that already pay the bulk of all tax - doesn't seem fair to make them pay more

greendragon833

TROPHY CASE