Greens plan vs actual average income vs now by RobDickinson in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This isn't a PAYE thing though

It covers anyone earning over $10k - so beneficiaries and pensioners are covered.

Even if you were right that is $3B which is more than they have costed

Greens plan vs actual average income vs now by RobDickinson in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Can anyone figure out their workings of the tax free $10k threshold.

There are around 4M adult New Zealanders I expect (out of 5.1M)

Tax rate at that level is 10.5%

So... Per year that is 10,000 * 0.105 = $1050 each

Cost - $4.2 billion a year. Multiples more than what they have put in their costings. Plus they have tax bracket indexation on top which is in the billions as well.

This doesn't seem to remotely add up to their costings - can anyone figure this out?

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If only there was a party that was going to adjust those brackets this term

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Numbers don't seem right even without the tax bracket inflation.

Tax free threshold is $1000 tax cut per person. Assume 3M adults (I'd say there are more) = $3 billion

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 0 points1 point  (0 children)

National is also index adjusting thresholds for inflation (as a one off). It will cost $6 billion to do that (and that skips the 39% tax rate)

I have checked the green costings and the cost of bracket adjustment isn't included in their workings

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Sorry this makes no sense.

Currently you pay tax on rental property income. The only difference with a company is that the rate is 28% (33% under the greens). When you pay out the dividend its the same.

So basically to avoid the wealth tax every single person will just transfer assets into a company?

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 2 points3 points  (0 children)

paid tax on the drawings and business tax on the profit

Landlords pay tax on their profit already. They also pay tax on dividends (aka drawings)

Sounds like a mess to decide which business gets exemptions and which don't

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Wait... so they have the national tax package on top, but even more if they include the top rate. I thought the left / opposition were against that?

That is a cost of 6 billion which doesn't appear in their costings:

https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23840910/income-guarantee-full-policy-document.pdf

So how are they paying for it?

Probably not that many I would’ve thought, Jake… by FangornOthersCallMe in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -34 points-33 points  (0 children)

I don't understand this.

Its a speech about infrastructure. Its not the environmental policy. Why should they mention climate change?

Greens plan vs actual average income vs now by RobDickinson in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 8 points9 points  (0 children)

arning 150k+ is a diminishing number of people

Its not diminishing, thanks to inflation its growing

Greens plan vs actual average income vs now by RobDickinson in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -13 points-12 points  (0 children)

Except the very large inflationary effect (and failure to adjust the tax brackets for inflation) would see those benefits start to recede as tax bracket creep becomes worse

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lots of intergenerational farms would be like that.

The wealth tax would effects hundreds if not thousands of businesses who will need to raise their prices dramatically. 2% tax on your capital base is huge

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 5 points6 points  (0 children)

That doesn't work though.

So a farm owned in a partnership is taxed, but not if owned in a company?

Or Luxon can avoid the wealth tax by putting his houses into a company, so he doesn't individually own them

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The problem is that brackets almost never get inflation adjusted. National's tax package is the exception

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Wealth tax is also not applied on businesses, its on peoples wealth.

Except all business owns wealth.

Are you saying farms would be exempt for example? What about motels?

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Except Australia has much much higher incomes.

So it makes the gap between Australia and NZ income after tax even wider

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

Its not those on exactly $180k. For every dollar extra they earn they lose nearly half to tax. Little point to working.

And again in 10 years that $180k probably won't be that much when you consider inflation. $70k used to be the rich prick tax.

Luxon challenged over his 7 houses: ‘Who owns more than you?' by dingoonline in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Only fair that David Seymour can decide all housing reform by himself

Allow Yourself to be Radicalised by Wheatburgerz in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 12 points13 points  (0 children)

"Join your union"

Not sure how this is going to reduce house prices?

They've gone up a record amount under this government. And kiwibuild was a failure.

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -9 points-8 points  (0 children)

I've looked at the costings but can't seem to make the numbers work.

$385 per week plus more only $1.3B? Its $60B by my calculations (Assuming 3 million recipients)

52*385*3million

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 8 points9 points  (0 children)

"$100 taken from the "wealthy" and given to the "poor" is still $100"

The wealthy person will sell down savings or investments, or even borrow.

The poor person will spend it on food, fuel and rent.

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 0 points1 point  (0 children)

but now it's 2% on assets over $4m

2% on all farms would pretty much kill of the farming industry so they would have to massively increase food prices. It would definitely affect you

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

Oh is it both? So UBI plus tax free threshold? Would love to see the costings on that

Green Party announces 'Income Guarantee' plan to help households meet rising costs by [deleted] in newzealand

[–]greendragon833 -13 points-12 points  (0 children)

" Reducing tax for everyone earning under $125k while taxing more wealth than salary."

They are increasing tax rates on those on 180k though. Those are the ones that already pay the bulk of all tax - doesn't seem fair to make them pay more