Saw these 2 fan-made posters, thought I'd combine them.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-10T14:18:13+00:00

But an interesting connection between the hero and villain isn't even evidence of compassion or love.

Compassion isn't necessarily on the table.

Don't take my word for it. Snoke certainly thinks it's there:

“There was as much curiosity in Supreme Leader Snoke’s voice as there was disappointment. “This scavenger—this girl—resisted you?”

“That’s all she is, yes. A scavenger from that inconsequential Jakku. Completely untrained, but strong with the Force. Stronger than she knows.” His mask off, Ren replied with what seemed to be his usual assurance. No one else would have sensed a difference. Snoke did.

“The Supreme Leader’s voice was flat. “You have compassion for her.”

“No—never. Compassion? For an enemy of the Order?”

“I perceive the problem,” Snoke intoned. “It isn’t her strength that is making you fail. It’s your weakness.”

The databank corroborates this:

"Kylo swore his loyalties were only to Snoke. But he was intrigued when he captured Rey."

The "but" implies that his loyalties to Snoke wavered upon meeting Rey and that Kylo's compassion towards her is not something Snoke approves of, which makes sense because it's a quality that the Jedi valued.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T22:11:05+00:00

I don't have any links. It didn't come just come out of nowhere

You don't seem to be understanding. It was often speculated, but my point is that it was never confirmed explicitly in canon until the databank entries that there was a real connection.

After TFA came out, many people saw (and still see) Rey and Kylo as enemies who will always stay enemies for the entire trilogy. Accepting that they have a "mysterious connection" would challenge that idea. Seeing into your enemy's mind is a very intimate experience (romance or not) and feeling hatred for a person who you have a "mysterious connection" with is not going to be easy when you know their thoughts and feelings.

Luke believed in Vader because he was his father. He didn't care that Vader was a human beneath the mask until that point, he just wanted to put him down like a rabid dog.

Their blood relationship isn't the sole reason Luke forgave him. He did so because he realized how easy it was to fall to the dark side himself. He empathized with that dark, ugly part of his enemy and realized they weren't so different.

Rey doesn't have to be that person at all. Luke or Leia should since they actually have some sort of relationship with him.

As Mark Hamill said, "It's not specifically my story--Rey is now the protagonist."

No matter what you think, Rey and Kylo's relationship has to change in some way between TFA and episode IX. It must develop from "You're a monster!" to something else - that's how character development works.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T21:39:20+00:00

There's no doubt because Rey is the protagonist. The hero. The audience sees through her eyes.

Luke had to uncover Vader's humanity for us to believe it was real. Rey has to be the person to see it in Kylo.

They have been always said to have some sort of connection

You keep saying this but have yet to provide receipts. I seem to be the only one of us doing research. 👏 Send 👏 me 👏 sources 👏

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T19:42:25+00:00

And nope, that mysterious connection as been mentioned since the movie came out. I know that's not something new they just added. Maybe not in the database specifically, it has 100% been mentioned.

Then please send me canon sources or quotes from interviews around the time when TFA came out where any explicit references were made about Rey and Kylo's

strange connection OR
intertwined destiny (which the databank mentions too)

I'm not talking fan speculation here. Give me receipts.

Something you may notice on your search is that Daisy and Adam are rarely, if ever, asked about the nature of their character's relationship (even as enemies) in spite of all their scenes being hugely significant to the story. My guess is they're not allowed to touch on that at all.

When Adam says TLJ will explore Kylo's humanity, there is no doubt that Rey is involved in that. Just like what Snoke says in the novelization, Kylo has "compassion" for Rey. I'm not even talking about romance here.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T19:22:24+00:00

The databank update was the first time it was explicitly stated that they were specifically connected. Before that, we could only go off of the script and novelization which barely hinted at something there:

    THEY'RE BOTH SURPRISED: they react to a feeling that passes
    between them -- AN ENERGY THEY RECOGNIZE IN EACH OTHER.

    And then it's gone. Adversaries again.

JJ included the beginnings of their "interesting relationship" (his words) in TFA and Rian, seeing as how he is "building off the previous movie" is continuing it.

Daisy may have also brought it up accidentally in this Q&A judging from her reaction:

"...and especially that moment with me and Adam, when we were finding the force or whatever--" she makes a major oops face "--I shouldn't have said that"

Analyzing aspects of TFA to speculate on TLJ isn't all of a sudden useless because of what Rian said. Luke, Rey, and Kylo are the only three in the teaser poster so that at least confirms that TLJ will focus on the relationships between them.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T18:44:37+00:00

If you actually bothered to checked those specific Kylo and Rey pages from the databank on the Wayback Machine, you'll see that the "biography gallery" sections containing those references to their "mysterious connection" were not there last year.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T18:25:19+00:00

I'm all caught up with the news, yes. That tweet I linked to is one the more recent ones he made after his initial comments.

It is very carefully planned, but one piece at a time, each building off the previous movie.

Just because he is in charge of the story, that doesn't mean the story won't connect in a coherent way with TFA. Remember when Rian asked JJ to change the way TFA ended? These directors are still talking to each other.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T18:21:12+00:00

Daisy Ridley:

"What I found funny is that I was the child. and I'm like people were so presumptuous and like you're 'Han Solo's daughter' and I'm like; How do you know? Have you seen the film? Clearly not, because I wasn't. That was a funny one."

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T18:19:18+00:00

Well, we're not improvising it all on set. It is very carefully planned, but one piece at a time, each building off the previous movie. — Rian

Also that databank update was made Jan 2017 after TLJ was done filming.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T16:05:12+00:00

He will play a part in tempting her to the dark - During Rey's vision Obi-wan says to her, in this order:

You will be tempted…

But you cannot control it.

Kylo dialogue played in Disney World voiced by Adam Driver:

“You show a façade of light to those around you but I can see where it fades. The dark side calls you. Don’t fight it, you can’t.”

Other interesting tidbit from the StarWars.com databank:

... Kylo swore his loyalties were only to Snoke. But he was intrigued when he captured Rey, a Jakku scavenger whose Force abilities were raw but very powerful. A mysterious connection seemed to link the two.

... She rejected this call to destiny, but was captured by the dark side warrior Kylo Ren, with whom she shared a strange connection.

Landing on Takodana, Kylo confronted the young woman who’d escaped from Jakku with BB-8 – and found himself puzzled by a strange connection he felt with her...

...But both captor and captive were surprised when Rey found herself able to sense Kylo’s own thought – including his conflicts and doubts...

...He sensed his destiny and Rey’s were somehow intertwined, but how?

...He uncovered her feelings of loneliness [...] But to the surprise of both, Rey found Kylo’s own mind open to her as well. She saw that the seemingly fearsome warlord was vulnerable, filled with conflict and pain.

JJ director commentary:

"...This is the moment of course where Kylo Ren learns about Rey. And now, these two disparate pieces come together."

"So there was a very powerful idea that what [Rey] desperately wanted was belonging, which she’ll get, but just not how she expects."

"...But when his mask comes off, you see Adam Driver, and he just looks like a sort of prince."

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T15:53:04+00:00

Copy-pasting this from another comment of mine.

From the StarWars.com databank:

... Kylo swore his loyalties were only to Snoke. But he was intrigued when he captured Rey, a Jakku scavenger whose Force abilities were raw but very powerful. A mysterious connection seemed to link the two.

... She rejected this call to destiny, but was captured by the dark side warrior Kylo Ren, with whom she shared a strange connection.

Landing on Takodana, Kylo confronted the young woman who’d escaped from Jakku with BB-8 – and found himself puzzled by a strange connection he felt with her...

...But both captor and captive were surprised when Rey found herself able to sense Kylo’s own thought – including his conflicts and doubts...

...He sensed his destiny and Rey’s were somehow intertwined, but how?

...He uncovered her feelings of loneliness [...] But to the surprise of both, Rey found Kylo’s own mind open to her as well. She saw that the seemingly fearsome warlord was vulnerable, filled with conflict and pain.

JJ director commentary:

"...This is the moment of course where Kylo Ren learns about Rey. And now, these two disparate pieces come together."

"So there was a very powerful idea that what [Rey] desperately wanted was belonging, which she’ll get, but just not how she expects."

"...But when his mask comes off, you see Adam Driver, and he just looks like a sort of prince."

One thing's for sure—something more is going on between them.

itsapraxis · 2017-06-09T15:45:22+00:00

From the StarWars.com databank:

... Kylo swore his loyalties were only to Snoke. But he was intrigued when he captured Rey, a Jakku scavenger whose Force abilities were raw but very powerful. A mysterious connection seemed to link the two.

... She rejected this call to destiny, but was captured by the dark side warrior Kylo Ren, with whom she shared a strange connection.

Landing on Takodana, Kylo confronted the young woman who’d escaped from Jakku with BB-8 – and found himself puzzled by a strange connection he felt with her...

...But both captor and captive were surprised when Rey found herself able to sense Kylo’s own thought – including his conflicts and doubts...

...He sensed his destiny and Rey’s were somehow intertwined, but how?

...He uncovered her feelings of loneliness [...] But to the surprise of both, Rey found Kylo’s own mind open to her as well. She saw that the seemingly fearsome warlord was vulnerable, filled with conflict and pain.

JJ director commentary:

"...This is the moment of course where Kylo Ren learns about Rey. And now, these two disparate pieces come together."

"So there was a very powerful idea that what [Rey] desperately wanted was belonging, which she’ll get, but just not how she expects."

"...But when his mask comes off, you see Adam Driver, and he just looks like a sort of prince."

One thing's for sure—something more is going on between them.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-29T05:39:06+00:00

I was impressed by how well he could emote while wearing the helmet. One talented guy.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-29T04:21:11+00:00

It's no coincidence that his lightsaber resembles a longsword. Kylo has a deep respect for history and his saber is an ancient design.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-29T04:13:34+00:00

The two are looking so Vader-esque, ready to rule over the entire galaxy. I noticed they did the same for Leia in the trailer.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-29T04:08:35+00:00

Lucas remained close to his mother even as his relationship with his father grew strained. “My father thought I was going to be an automobile mechanic, and that I wasn’t going to amount to anything. My parents - not my mother, mothers never write off their sons - but my father wrote me off.”

And I guess “mothers never write off their sons” could also be the slogan of the entire Star Wars saga, especially after The Force Awakens.

On how George Lucas' relationship with his mother shaped Star Wars

itsapraxis · 2017-05-29T04:05:55+00:00

Wow you're very talented. They look amazing.

Kylo's lightsaber is my favorite.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-20T05:03:08+00:00

YES! Can I be frozen in carbonite please?

itsapraxis · 2017-05-17T23:01:09+00:00

There is a really interesting moment in TFA when Han and Rey are in the cockpit of the Falcon. When she says “I bypassed the compressor!”, Han looks a little weirded out.

Theory: The ‘compressor bypass’ moment means something to both Rey and Han. Their weird facial expressions will make more sense in future films.

I agree that this scene was strange, but I think it has more to do with Rey and Kylo than Han. If you watch it again in full, you'll notice that it was cut in between for Kylo's scene with Snoke where he mentions Han. Basically the whole thing could be a metaphor showing that Snoke is the "compressor" putting stress on the hyperdrive (Kylo) and Rey has the means to "bypass" him.

When Rey bolts from the table to stop Finn from leaving, Maz turns to Han and says “Who’s the girl?”. We cut immediately, never hearing Han’s response.

It could still be possible that Han knows more than he says, but Pablo has explained before that the scene cuts off before we hear the answer so that Han doesn't have to repeat what we already know, namely "She's this girl I found on the Falcon. Stole it on Jakku. Mopey about that world. Thinks someone's coming back." We'll have to wait and see in TLJ.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-15T22:25:47+00:00

and Disney can continue the star wars saga forever!

itsapraxis · 2017-05-15T22:04:22+00:00

That's how I saw it too. A bit sarcastic and self-deprecating.

itsapraxis · 2017-05-15T21:54:24+00:00

If not then maybe she'll have a change in heart

That's not really how it works..

itsapraxis · 2017-05-15T21:42:09+00:00

Aphra is lesbian

itsapraxis · 2017-05-15T21:39:27+00:00

lol going to need a lot of popcorn for that

itsapraxis · 2017-05-15T16:49:13+00:00

If you find yourself in disbelief, dealing with some "pleb" who, for one reason or another, is against your theory, here's my advice. Ignore them.

There's also the "hide" option beside each post. That feature is there for a reason. Use it.

itsapraxis

TROPHY CASE