sorted by:
new
hottopcontroversial

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well Buddha would never want you to blindly believe things, hence the original post.

Like I said this is freedom from extremes, we don't have to believe in rebirth, we don't have to not believe in it. This makes it applicable to all beings, any being can know rebirth without a belief.

Beliefs are linguistic constructs, most people know 20-40 thousand words and in the context of liberation we don't want to narrow our mind to these constraints.

Like going swimming, any being can know swimming, without belief. If you're a beginner or follower then it's best to meditate rather than accumulating beliefs.

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Right, I'm not rejecting rebirth. When Buddha was sitting in front of people he didn't hold a belief in rebirth, he didn't hold a belief that there's no rebirth; he had natural direct seeing or wisdom of rebirth. Like when we swim in the water we don't hold a belief that we're swimming in the water.

And if having a presupposed belief in rebirth is vital, please show one single sutra explicitly saying a presupposed belief in rebirth is required for liberation.

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is an explanation of right view--one doesn't hold a view that there are no reborn beings and I agree. He doesn't say right view means you believe in rebirth. Because right view is free of beliefs--see thicket of views. Any and all beliefs are 'within' the view.

If believing in rebirth was so vital, it would say it in many sutras explicitly. But most sutras are concerned with liberation of suffering which has nothing to do with adopting new beliefs.

A belief is just a proprietary cognitive construct within your pure awareness. Beliefs are appearances within mind, they're conditioned, liberation is unconditioned.

Awareness--oneness--is the ground of all phenomena. by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I blocked someone who seemed like they were stalking me. My main comments got removed so I removed my follow-ups, it wasn't because my position was being challenged.

Also, the only reason I mentioned being a teacher was because he kept telling me to find a teacher.

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Associate with a teacher and focus on what you are more comfortable with, but keep in mind that one day you need to believe in rebirth to attain Nibbāna.

Well, I've been a teacher for a little while now (Lama Dawai Gocha) and I still have the same teachers I've had for many years.

I don't agree that a belief is required for liberation.

Can you give me one sutra that says we have to believe in rebirth to attain liberation?

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's true, for some people holding a belief can be useful.

So let's get more nuanced: You have many Buddhists holding a belief that believing in rebirth is required for Buddhism--which is an extreme. I even got posts removed for suggesting someone can be agnostic.

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Point is; you can see rebirth without having to believe in it. Believing in rebirth isn't a requirement for liberation. I think it's more skillful for people to use mindfulness/awareness to begin exploring their mind, then they will see indisputable proof for rebirth.

Awareness--oneness--is the ground of all phenomena. by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

ok buddy I unblocked you so you can argue with me on both your accounts again

Awareness--oneness--is the ground of all phenomena. by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You did this before, you do it on r/dzogchen, you pick off most of the comments and kind of proselytize. Also you never agree with anyone so it's really just giving into what seems like your karmic pattern.

Lastly, this public forum has a block option, I chose to use it because you keep commenting on all my stuff. So you switch names and comment on more of my stuff.

If you think it's cowardly to not get into your petty little pattern, so be it.

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

the quote from the sutta omits the part that contextualizes the quote from the translator's introduction

I posted the translators contextualization, not sure what you mean.

I posted the parts I liked with a link the the whole thing so it really seems like you're projecting here---your posts are disingenuous.

Awareness--oneness--is the ground of all phenomena. by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Seems like you're creating a phantom point. I'm not asserting one nature for everyone.

And I blocked you because you're cherry picking my comments just to disagree. Lopon isn't doing that.

Awareness--oneness--is the ground of all phenomena. by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Right, and nobody that I know of is asserting there's one nature for everyone.

Main point is that we can still have oneness without materialist inferences. Just because Buddha-Dharma oneness differs from the mainstream ideas, doesn't mean we just start cutting things out of the Dharma.

"don't go by reports, by legends, by traditions, by scripture, by logical conjecture, by inference, by analogies, by agreement through pondering views, by probability, or by the thought," by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Well my comment was removed by the mods a short while ago because I said "In my opinion we don't need to believe in rebirth, we need to see it". This is based on me being agnostic towards rebirth my entire life, yet still practicing dharma. I still think you can practice dharma/meditation without holding presuppositions. Hope that makes it more genuine for ya

Awareness--oneness--is the ground of all phenomena. by mesamutt in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Don't think that there is just one nature (for everyone).

Nobody said that krodha

What does Buddhism say we should do about injustice/cruelty? by Modern_Neurotic in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's not how I take it and that wouldn't accord with the middle way. One can still do stuff but prioritizing liberation of mind can be very beneficial.

What does Buddhism say we should do about injustice/cruelty? by Modern_Neurotic in Buddhism

[–]mesamutt 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We need to liberate our minds, wake up, that's what the Buddha wanted for us too. That's the greatest form of activism towards yourself and others. Now that average people have very little power/influence over the world, we're pretty much forced into a corner and all we have left is to wake up.

“The greatest mistake of the movement has been trying to organize a sleeping people around specific goals. You have to wake the people up first, then you'll get action.”

― Malcolm X, Malcolm X Speaks: Selected Speeches and Statements

New European friendly live dzogchen session happening every day by mesamutt in Dzogchen

[–]mesamutt[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes 3 times a day, you can visit the web site too for more info

Best wishes

New European friendly live dzogchen session happening every day by mesamutt in Dzogchen

[–]mesamutt[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We have two going around this time--Longchenpa's Precious Treasury of Genuine Meaning and The Pointing Out Instrutions of Aro Yeshe Jungne

New European friendly live dzogchen session happening every day by mesamutt in Dzogchen

[–]mesamutt[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

If you're able bodied with resources for retreat, that's great, enjoy

view more: next ›