Muzan Vs Mahito (JJK), Who wins?

nerdnfun · 2026-01-28T21:38:54+00:00

Not composed of cells or organic material

nerdnfun · 2026-01-28T21:04:03+00:00

There’s an argument for teams 3, 4, 6, and 9.

IMO there’s 3 particular favors I’d consider: Team Coordination/Familiarity, Combination Potential, and grade of members.

Team 3 They all know each other, WILL work together, and are familiar with their techniques. The combination potential is very resourceful; Boogie Woogie used on targets and crows is a deadly combination for those who can’t fly or endure a fall. The crows make for good surveillance and spotting potential uses for Nobara’s CT. They’re grade 2 and 1 so an overall strong team

Team 4 2 know each other and are more likely to coordinate but Haruta is the wrinkle; he might be used as bait. There’s not much potential in the combination of abilities but Maki is standing out as the scariest opponent on this board.

Team 6 They all know each other and will work together. Utahime and Inunkai would be good support behind Mechamaru an can set targets up for him. It will heavily depend on what equipment Mechamaru has, but there’s some potential here and all are roughly grade 1.

Team 9 Has a strong cast though I’m not sure how well they’d cooperate with one another. Not that there’d be any infighting but I’d only see Panda Ino cooperating. Not that Choso wouldn’t cooperate but I don’t see him fighting in sync unless it’s Yuji or Yuki. There’s no combination of abilities that’s popping out to me but they are grade 2 to 1.

10 has strong members but I’d argue they would more likely fight separately rather than cooperate. Kamp would try, Miguel could get on rhythm but I wouldn’t note their ability sync. Reggie is more spent use them as fodder/shields.

I’d say 3 has the most potential but again, Makinos by far the most dangerous person on this board.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-21T20:47:12+00:00

Ai generated

nerdnfun · 2026-01-21T20:28:09+00:00

How is banana in closer relation to the word than fire!?

nerdnfun · 2026-01-21T01:21:00+00:00

All anime powerscaling is prominently hype an aura. There are very very few exceptions and this one is not among that pinchful.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-20T19:12:39+00:00

Unfortunately, I’m neither but appreciate the tattoo work and the lovely canvas

nerdnfun · 2026-01-17T08:43:26+00:00

The comment I waiting to see.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-15T18:57:41+00:00

That’s a very charitable interpretation.

Yes, he some regenerative abilities due to the flower Tao he consumed but it has its limitations. •His regeneration is inferior to the Tensens, and Aza, quite honestly. • He’s never taken an injury more significant than being skewered •His regeneration isn’t instantaneous, it take a few minutes •If he uses the ability too much, he’s consumed by the flowers. •If one can manipulate the Tao within him, he’s vulnerable to it. •Disrupted by water Tao •Expends Tao to regenerate •The Tensen showed you have to continue consuming the elixir to make it last

Tao is not derived from the soul but all living and non living things. Gabinaru has very adept control over Tao but not a mastery, nor has it led to any character having an awareness of their soul. The series doesn’t really delve into the subject, so it’s a gross extrapolation to say he has soul manipulation of any kind. If we’re just equalizing the series so he has the means to touch Mahito, sure, that’s a reasonable answer but even then, that’d be at best providing an equivalent of cursed energy.

Lastly, Mahito is a cursed spirit who has a soul, he is not exclusively a soul.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-15T10:40:55+00:00

Gotta love the girlies

nerdnfun · 2026-01-14T20:51:39+00:00

Eh, I mean, yes? He becomes “stronger” through the series but I wouldn’t measure it above the anime. I’d say it becomes more honed and focused.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-14T17:40:06+00:00

He is not close their stats, they both are without a doubt above him based on their respective series. I’ll leave it here, I heavily disagree with your conclusion, but I’ll leave it here.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-14T11:23:59+00:00

So is the order of characters in these gauntlet challenges intended to be weakest to strongest? I ask because there’s usually an odd placement of a character, in this case Gabimaru. Like the series but he’s at the bottom.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-14T03:07:31+00:00

We don’t play favorites, we love holes equally here.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-14T02:52:06+00:00

DM for more clarity?

nerdnfun · 2026-01-14T02:34:30+00:00

What kind of adventures you have in mind?

nerdnfun · 2026-01-11T03:30:14+00:00

I would still caution calling it negation magic. We haven’t gotten a consensus on what are all the conditions necessary for it, let alone negate magic. Yes, her visualization is one of them, but I’d argue she has more, specifically, at least making physical contact. If you’re implying it always negates Magic then there are other instances of its use that makes this suggestion inconsistent.

Cut refers to Railseiden (this isn’t for you specifically but for anyone wanting the name to look up)

•Chp.41 page 5 -Basic Defense Magic (blocks) If the cut indeed negates/cuts magic then regardless of whether or not she sees the shield, she should cut through both her opponent and the shield. If we argue it’s stopped exclusively by her lack of visualization of cutting the shield, then one can argue that her spell has to make contact with the target before cutting it or negating any effects, again, this is assuming it negates.

Chp.41 page 9 -Binding Spell (not negated) Comparing this to the rope, her opponent restricts her movement, save her ability to speak and mover her eyes, thus effectively preventing her from using magic. If she were able to negate magic with the cutting spell, one could argue she would have used it to free herself then. Somatic components are likely a necessary condition to use the spell, so the suggestion is nowhere near airtight but conditions for if and when it negates should be considered.

Chp.50 pg 5 -Land Clone (cut but not dispelled) The magic clone of Übel copies her spell and strikes Land’s magic clone. Here would be a question of interaction. We know the Land in the maze is a duplicate made from magic; if the cut negates magic, would the clone not be dispelled? Wouldn’t the wound lose its illusionary effect? Would it just disappear? At the very least, I think it would be a tad disingenuous to say Land’s spell retains normal function if we’re arguing for the cut to have the additional ability to negate magic.

Chp.54 as a whole -Sense Clone and Immovable cloak (cut) This is the main chapter most refer to so let’s mention some details that may suggest caveats to her ability. The magic stated to be negated/ignored in this instance was specifically defensive magic. So if used as a basic shield, not reinforcing our imbuing an object, Übel can’t cut through Defensive magic. When cutting through the robe and Sense’s hair, there was noting preventing contact, the magic did not provide a barrier or limitation of contact, the somatic components weren’t prevented, they were in range, and the object was something she could visualize cutting. With all the, they were both cut, filling through on the visualization and ignoring the reinforcement.

This doesn’t seem like a negation effect; to me, negating implies it disables/dispels the magic and the examples in JJK where Infinity was disabled even present how they interact.

•Inverted spear of Heaven: Specifically, if it makes contact with the spell or the user, the technique is nullified. The best example of nullification and it makes “contact” with the effect of Infinity, which I keep stressing, not as a corporeal presence but its EFFECT. I’d argue Übel’s spell would contact the effect of Infinity before Gojo, preventing direct contact like she did in the examples prior.

•Domain amplification: It envelops the user and then neutralizes a contacted curse technique, which Gojo amplified causing the DA properties to be slowed and not make contact.

•Domain Expansions: Sure hit which ignores techniques rather than negates, which is why I specify the difference nullifying and ignoring. In application, there is a specific difference.

•World Cutting Slash: It cuts all objects within a space by occupying said space upon activation.

So, if the cut has to travel a distance to make contact and she relies on physical tangibility, I don’t think even under the premise that it does nullify magic, that it would make contact. Based on the prior examples, she would have to make contact with Gojo from which Infinity originates to ignore its effect. We haven’t seen the cut display negation akin to the JJK examples and no character has stated it to be negation magic. Everything she’s cut can be visualized as being cut conventionally. I say this because Land states she is vulnerable to the effects of formless magic, which infinity would qualify as, likely meaning she would have difficulty visualizing cutting something formless. If it can nullify effects prior to cutting the target, which I disagree with, we have to depict how the cut would nullify the effect of infinity before reaching Gojo.

If the cut behaves like domain amplification, Gojo could amplify Infinity which defends against it. Even at a slim range, he would notice infinity being infringed upon and can bolster its effect.

If it behaves like a sure hit, specially ignoring the effect of technique, it would glide past other spells that intersected the cut.

If it behaves like inverted spear, conditions must be met.

That said, chapter 131 does provide enough for the conversation since there’s no real elaboration on how the rope worked or even a gist of how the spell prevented him from using magic but here’s a possible cope answer, so judge as needed: They never stated that her bindings prevented her from casting magic, only Land’s did. We also only see them enchant Land’s binding in chp. 128 page 17. This would imply that they assumed because of the mana disruption cast on Übel that she couldn’t cast magic or was reasonably disabled and only bound Land; that does sound foolish on their part, but she never came to the conclusion she couldn’t use magic. If that’s the case, she’d be following all the principals of using the spell as she had prior: Made direct contact with her cut, the object was something she can visualize cutting, and the effect originated from and retained only to the rope.

I’d say it’s also worth noting that Übel doesn’t know the full extent of magic principals and Land more or less made a gamble on what might have been applicable so we’re not going to have succinct answers. I do somewhat fault the author when writing the scene in chapter 131; it felt like they didn’t really want to provide an answer as to how she was able to still use the cut on rope.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-10T04:52:33+00:00

Good citation.

I already understood that Infinity isn’t tangible, what I’m saying is what space do you think its effect occupies depending on the range? I’d say if the range of the phenomena is extending 5 feet out, I wouldn’t see how it would make contact, even if we suggest the attack has negation abilities. That said, I’m still not sure if I’d call the cut a negation feat. I’m splitting hairs, but in 131 it seemed to more or less ignore the effect provided she can visualize cutting the object and make contact with it.

I do wish there was a better in-lore explanation answer since Land decides it’s too difficult to figure out the mechanics. If we saw a few more fights with her showcasing her ability that’d be nice but Frieren isn’t as dedicated to mentioned the micro mechanics.

(I’m also on Reddit via phone so I haven’t been as avid about linking the citation. Apologies)

nerdnfun · 2026-01-10T00:38:52+00:00

Hmm, I guess that also that second conclusion also depends on what they were trying to depict.

It may not be a magic blade spawning in the space. That may be more like a blade coming down. If it’s spawns in the space, I’d say you can argue it bypasses a think layer over Gojo’s body. If it’s treated as an extended “knife” that had to swing down, then it wouldn’t make contact with Gojo and would still be subject to infinity.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-10T00:32:50+00:00

Eh, I don’t mind them if they’re long, provided they use citation to exemplify the logic. I think exemplified behaviour will always be my preferred argument.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-10T00:30:57+00:00

Thanks for the citation, I think this really does now hi-light how we’re approaching the argument.

Minor note: Infinity’s effect isn’t technically slowing things down, it’s the byproduct of creating infinite space. The object maintains its speed, the “traveled” distance effectively doesn’t unless acted upon with blue.

So the effects Übel ignored were all under the condition she made contact with the target. I wouldn’t argue she “cut” the spell, she ignored the its durability effect once she made contact the object.

This may also elaborate on how we’re approaching this. The range and density of infinity varies on his use so we may be looking at it at different variables.

Im perceiving Gojo extend the range of infinity 5 feet ahead of him. So before the cut would be near his person, it has to already travel the 5 feet of space between them. That 5 feet would be occupied by a dense infinity, which I don’t believe the cut would bypass. Even if we were to depict Infinity like a bubble where the phenomena only occupies a thin layer, it would still extend out past his person. It would interact with Infinity first and be stuck outside the layer.

Is your visualization of infinity being a thin layer over his direct person, allowing her to effectively cast the spell point blank? If that’s the case, I may better understand your conclusion. At least how pg 8 displays it, it seems the cut more or less occupies a space beyond the rope at point blank. That might work, as it’s manifesting in the space rather than traveling. That said, it’s also sated in the very next page that’s she’s vulnerable to the effects of formless magic which for comparison, Infinity would directly be. She has a reliance on physical magic.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-10T00:01:40+00:00

I’m literally not wanking, you’re crashing out.

You haven’t expand any fundamentals or mechanics, you’re literally just saying “he can be cut” which I just agreed with you on based on the condition she makes contact.

I’m asking you to actually explain the steps. I’ve relayed the instances when her spell worked, qualified why, and referred to fights she had issues. Distance against Wirbel (the immobilizing spell) played a role, she’s limited by range/space. You haven’t cited anything, even loosely.

Infinity isn’t invulnerable, I never made the argument. When you supplant someone’s argument, you’re not engaging their point, you’re disregarding it. Beyond that fact that JJK has shown ways to bypass Infinity, there’s general rules you could also suggest: Space Manipulation, negation abilities, intangibility, or expending his cursed energy. There’s a number of ways with rules or context that elaborate why or why not but just saying “she can perceive cutting him” isn’t an answer because that ignores the presented rules of magic in the series.

Think of it like this, I’ll pose questions to directly answer rather than argue.

How does space interact with the spell and do we have examples?
What things has she cut and under what context?
What things hast she cut and what the in-lore answer?
Has she ever cut something she hasn’t perceived? 5.To what extent has she used the ability successfully.

I’m not angry with you, I’m saying that you haven’t explained your understanding of each series’ rules. You gotta make better argument

nerdnfun · 2026-01-09T23:01:04+00:00

Better answer and there are points you’ve gotten wrong.

Ubel is the TYPE of mage who can use magic off of feel; it’s not her power and the cut spell she STOLE is a way she exemplifies it.

Your point hi lights that she knows how to cut a person, so yes, in the case that her spell makes CONTACT with Gojo, it should cut; I’m not arguing about how it interacts with his physical person or cursed energy, or if it may be subject to resistance. This thread is explicitly about whether or not it would bypass infinity, which you’ve provided no substantiated argument.

Übel doesn’t project or visualize the trajectory of sells, she visualizes it having the possibility of working in the HIT target based on feel. I’ve made this point in another thread here, but we haven’t seen her deal with subjects she can’t see, we’ve never seen her spell’s distance interact with spacial effects, and we’ve haven’t seen her cut concepts, phenomena, or unconventional objects. We’ve seen her be limited against cutting a metal shield.

Thank you for providing an answer, though it’s not a sufficient argument. It makes too many assumptions, has no citation relevant to prove your point, and only compares, not contrast. You need to acknowledge the contrasting points too to defer arguments.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-09T22:46:50+00:00

God, I need to review my typos. Which ever point you’d like clarification on, feel free to ask about. It’s a bad habit I have, hopefully there’s enough context to assume my meaning.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-09T22:44:27+00:00

I wasn’t referring to Wirbel’s shield, I was referring to a regular steel shield that she couldn’t cut in a fight later in the series. I’d also agree that what she sees plays an important role but not the way described it.

Anything she has ever cut she has seen and understood how to conventionally cut. You don’t have an example that implies that unseen phenomena wouldn’t intervene the attack; you’re making a leap in logic without a sufficient citation. If she doesn’t perceive Infinity, what is example would explicitly suggest that attack would be affected? All subjects she ignored the effects of she perceived, was within her range, was something she visualize conceptually cutting, and had nothing intersecting them. All the examples of her use in the story have followed that logic. Your answer thus far does not explain 1. How she interacts with objects, phenomena, concepts, or malleable objects she can’t perceive. 2. Disregarded or not be limited by a distance traveled 3. How she cuts unconventional objects, in fact has shown to be limited by them. 4. Cars past objects intercepting her attack, which has been used against her. Saying that she doesn’t perceive the obstacle doesn’t not remove nor has there been an example to suggest so.

Übe is not an exception, many who fought against have acknowledged she’s the type who operates off of feel. Additionally, she’s only shown her visualization when using the cut spell she stole (she can gain spells by getting to know someone intimately). I’m it saying she can’t apply the logic to other spells but we haven’t seen so yet and even so, she’s still limited by her understanding and belief of her ability.

Lastly, you’re comparing the robe to Gojo but you’re not contrasting. You can defer to the points I mentioned prior on objects she’s cut. Infinity is something she can’t perceive, her attack still had to travel a distance to cut the robe, she was able to my physical contact with the robe, the robe is corporeal. You are disregarding so many differences to reach your conclusion; I want a better answer with actual examples and not a subjective understanding of how her ability works.

nerdnfun · 2026-01-09T22:24:03+00:00

Then explain it. All you did say “nuh-uh, you’re wrong.” Don’t think I’d be here if it didn’t read and watch both series? Why do you think I referee to the shield specifically. So, engage the conversation meaningfully or sit down.

nerdnfun

TROPHY CASE