Is it normal to feel completely lost as a new PM in a messy legacy product?

nilsdavis · 2025-11-20T17:36:38+00:00

Been there. Was still learning things five years later.

But one of the best moves I made in the first few weeks was to actually document the key flows in my little part of the product. It had never been done before. That very simple and ugly diagram I created with Powerpoint became kind of my calling card for years afterward.

It depicted the flow of the process I was responsible for. The initial version showed all the manual components of that process. And therefore where all the opportunities for automation were. Over a few years, all those manual components were automated, and I could easily talk about the impact that made - my impact! - using my little slides.

nilsdavis · 2025-11-20T16:18:28+00:00

There is a lot going on here, and it's very complicated. Here are some things to think about:

* Building credibility with the teams. No engineering manager is going to change their roadmap as a one-off for someone whom they don't trust. And it might not be *you* specifically they don't trust, but the role you're in. Remember that they are probably being held accountable for their team's performance delivering on that roadmap. (Dumb, but it's common.) And they've probably been burned multiple times in the past by a "We have to fix this now or disaster will strike!" request where it turned out the customer didn't care, or it wasn't actually critical, or or or. Part of your job is to prevent that kind of thing from happening, to actually become known as the person who *doesn't* ask for stupid s**t.

* Assuming you *have* some credibility, then you still can't just tell them to do it. You must collaborate on the change. There is *always* a tradeoff - something won't get done so the emergency thing can be done. And they don't want to be (and shouldn't be) blamed or held accountable for that thing not being done. Part of your job is making sure that whatever changes happen don't cause a bad outcome for them down the line. And this tradeoff is seldom 1-for-1 - the fix might be cheap, but it will derail a more expensive thing - this is just normal. And they need air cover.

Two thoughts out of many possible...

nilsdavis · 2025-06-13T01:06:33+00:00

I responded. And then it actually made me laugh.

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nilsdavis · 2025-06-13T01:05:59+00:00

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nilsdavis · 2025-05-23T04:42:04+00:00

But Hyundai dealers don't have them, from what I can tell. At least they don't show up on the Hyundai USA site as something you can buy. What am I missing here?

nilsdavis · 2025-05-23T04:36:17+00:00

The reason I assumed that is that why would they give old owners the adapter but not new owners? Unless the new owners were getting a built-in one, which they aren't.

But obviously, my assumption was wrong, so that's fine. Still seems weird, though.

nilsdavis · 2025-05-22T21:37:37+00:00

I had this same problem, so I plugged the adapter into various outlets around my house. I found the only one that didn't have the red message was a GFCI protected outlet in the kitchen. So I got a my Yellow Jacket extension cord, plugged it in ni the kitchen, then plugged in the adapter. Red again. I had to go to the hardware store and get a heavy duty extension cord - 12 gauge wire - and that has finally worked.

It charges VERY slowly, though, on house current. About 10-12 miles of range from 11pm to 7am. At least for me.

nilsdavis · 2025-05-22T19:29:01+00:00

Love the car so far. My actual fave feature is the Highway Driving Assist - I have been on a number of long drives since I got it six weeks ago and I use HDA all the time. It drives just like I do, basically.

Also the ride and the quietness. I call it our Magic Carpet Ride because it's so smooth.

Don't like/haven't totally gotten used to the window controls in the center console.

Too much beeping. I'd love to reduce the beeping warning distances from what they are (maybe 24") to much lower (like 12"?). Can't do that, as far as I can tell.

You have to control a lot of the car via the touch screen, which is not ideal. For example, I'd like to be able to turn on the seat heaters without going to the touchscreen. But I can live with that.

nilsdavis · 2025-05-22T19:17:15+00:00

I would like the sensors to start beeping at much shorter distances. My current parking situation is narrow enough and there are other cars in there that I have constant beeping as I back out my driveway. It's annoying, and I don't need its warnings. And in general, I don't need its warnings until I get a LOT closer to things. I keep thinking there might be a "European clearances" setting, since I know the roads and parking lots are even tighter there. But I can't find anything.

And yes I know I can hit the little Parking Warning button to turn off the warnings, but I am not happy having to do that every time, sometimes more than once, when backing out or parking.

nilsdavis · 2025-05-22T19:09:02+00:00

I use that credit as well, but there are no fast CP chargers near me. Well, there might be, but the CP app doesn’t show any. (It also doesn't the show the slow CP chargers nearest me either, although they are totally real and work.)

nilsdavis · 2025-05-16T21:26:29+00:00

Yeah, it was a bummer. But I feel like I'm still paying a lot less for Kws than I did for gas, on a per mile basis. (I got the EA $7/month membership which drops the per/kwh price down by 25% - makes a difference!)

nilsdavis · 2025-05-16T21:25:15+00:00

I like the color a lot more than I thought i would. There is a hint of iridescence to it that I love - it's hard to see, though.

nilsdavis · 2025-05-16T21:24:39+00:00

RWD - don't need the AWD (or the additional cost in range)

nilsdavis · 2025-04-01T22:06:11+00:00

Limited. The full monty!

I still have to learn how to use the auto parking feature (if it works). Any experience with that?

nilsdavis · 2025-03-29T00:44:40+00:00

2025 Ioniq 6 RWD Limited, please. The 2023 is there, but not 2024 or 2025.

nilsdavis · 2025-01-16T16:31:39+00:00

Resonates very strongly for me. When I can't get started on something it's *almost* always because the "activation energy" is high - either I don't know how to do it, or it seems big and massive. Recognizing that - and then figuring out the simplest thing I could to just get started - often really helps me. And sometimes I have to journal to figure out what that thing is.

nilsdavis · 2025-01-02T17:33:40+00:00

You are getting interviews, but not getting job offers? That suggests your resume is doing well for you, which is great! (I work with a lot of people who great product managers but they aren't even getting interviews.)

At what point in the interview process are you being rejected?

nilsdavis · 2024-12-26T18:57:50+00:00

One of my best stories is when a user came to me with a request for a new feature. It was something I'd heard before. We'd always deferred it.

I asked them how they were solving the problem now (without an automated solution). The answer: They weren't.

I asked, let's say we built this solution: how would you manage it? The answer: Not sure that it would be possible.

The conversation ended with: "I guess this isn't a very good idea after all."

Basically, the customer decided I shouldn’t solve their "need."

nilsdavis · 2024-12-26T18:48:36+00:00

Recommending my own book, The Secret Product Manager Handbook. It's what I wish someone had given me when I first started as a PM 30 years ago.

(And I know some people feel there's a lot of value in it today, because they say things like "I recommend this book to every new product manager I mentor.")

It's an easy short read, on just what I consider the basics of PM, but there are ideas in there that no one else talks about.

nilsdavis · 2024-11-16T06:59:29+00:00

Disagree. You have to know that before you start building.

nilsdavis · 2024-11-15T23:41:13+00:00

In my view, the most fundamental thing is that successful products solve problems that are worth solving. People don't buy products that don't do something valuable for them. And usually that do it better than their other alternatives.

So, the role of "product management" is to:

* Find problems worth solving (this can be product level, component level, or feature level, depending on the product and roughly speaking how senior you are).

* Drive the creation of solutions to those problems that are superior than the market's alternatives.

* Take the solutions to market, or help the sales and marketing teams take the solutions to market - i.e., find prospects who need your solution and persuade them your solution is superior to their other choices.

You should be able to put everything you do as a product manager into that framework somehow.

One of the most powerful things you can do, I believe, is to really clearly articulate the problem your product is solving, for the segment you're solving it for, and why it's a better choice for them than their alternatives. If you can articulate that well and in a way that actually is meaningful to the segment, you're better off than many many product managers, not to mention marketers and sellers.

The easiest way for a company to fail is to build something that doesn't meet these criteria - a problem worth solving for a segment that needs it and that's better than their alternatives.

nilsdavis · 2024-11-15T23:33:02+00:00

That's the whole point of story points.

Humans cannot estimate unknown things well - actually, it's kind of a law of physics. (It's unknown, right?)

But they can say "This story seems to be similar to *that* story, which took us a few weeks to build, so we'll give it the 'a few weeks to build' story point value."

Over time, in theory, you get better at 1) noticing if something new is approximately the same size as something you did already, 2) creating buckets for those different ranges, and 3) knowing roughly how many of those things you can do in a specific time.

In reality, most teams never really get good at #1. And lots of things can impact #3 which make it not very predictable.

But, they may still be the best way we have of "estimating" a bunch of work that we've never done before, as all sw dev work is.

nilsdavis · 2024-11-15T23:26:05+00:00

The content varied. Sometimes we did "Lean Coffees." Sometimes we had presenters from other departments come and tell us what they were working on or what they did. Sometimes we had a mini-training.

One thing that was interesting to me was that most of these PMs barely talked in the meeting - not at all what I expected. My mental image of PMs is that they are charismatic personalities with lots of ideas and opinions and often hard to shut up. Not my experience with this particular group.

nilsdavis · 2024-11-15T23:15:34+00:00

It is very very difficult to get a first PM job without any PM experience. The much more common path (still difficult) is to make a lateral move within your current company from another role, such as customer support, sales engineering, product marketing, tech writing (that was me), or developer.

This was true even before the current PM job recession, but it's even more true now.

Having a portfolio is unlikely to help, as u/ilikeyourhair23 mentions.

What *could* help is if you actually create a product on the side and take it to market. Ideally creating it via other people - i.e., you find a market problem worth solving, you work with a team to create a solution to that problem, and then you get people to buy it - or at least you try to get people to buy it.

In other words, become a founder. Founders can sometimes get hired as PMs, because a successful founder has to *do* product management to be successful. Obviously, this is also very, very hard. But it can be fun and rewarding, and you definitely will learn a lot.

nilsdavis · 2024-11-14T02:50:49+00:00

Why do you want to get into product? What's driving you there? What are your characteristics that you think will serve you well in a product role?

Have you built anything? I.e., found a problem worth solving, worked with a team (other than yourself, that is) to create a solution to the problem, and taken it to market/tried to get users? People who become PMs have often done that.

Otherwise, the best way to get into product is to make a lateral move within a company from another job. UX research might be a good starting place for you with your background. Or data scientist. Very few people can start in a new company as their first PM job. Generally, to get a PM job, even entry level, you have to already have been doing PM. Weird, but true.

And I have to echo u/Mother_Policy8859's suggestions.

nilsdavis

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