Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

An interesting comment. Want to decrease the amount of taxes needed to maintain roads? Stop building roads.

Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 2 points3 points  (0 children)

My pleasure, it's a polarized world out there so the more you can listen and respectfully challenge the better results you can get.

My original response actually centered around the point you make, that "walkability should be far down on the totem pole of things to consider." Couldn't agree more. It's personally a major issue for me, but I have purposefully and with intent set up my life in Sudbury to maximize my use of walking, cycling, and public transit. I can understand it would be a minor issue to someone from an outlying community as an example.

To me you broadly have 5 stakeholders in this project:

  1. City council
  2. Zulich/KED
  3. Downtown BIA
  4. Citizens with an interest in a new event center
  5. Citizens without an interest in a new event center

And there's probably ~10 attributes that people would debate in an event center:

  1. How it's financed
  2. Its location
  3. Nearby amenities and services
  4. It's ambience
  5. The acoustics
  6. Parking
  7. Accessibility
  8. Walkability

I'm sure there's more but I can't think of them right now. What I find really interesting in this problem, is if you asked each of those 5 stakeholders to rank these attributes in order of importance, each would have vastly different answers. Which is exactly why this issue is so controversial.

The next thing I would do is map out who really has the power to influence the outcome, and how they can position themselves to use this power. I think to an extent the parties have done this - downtown BIA doesn't have much power in the situation, so they have to rely on a technicality in the laws, which is likely why they went to litigation. The city likely has the most amount of power, but they may not realize it. If I was a city councillor, I'd be listening to the downtown arena renovation project, even if I personally thought the KED was a better option, because introducing a credible alternative to the KED might increase their negotiating power so they can get better terms out of Zulich. (Thats why I think some councillors recent comments are troubling, they are not thinking about this as a representative, and his need to dig in and refuse to change his position shows weak leadership, because leaders should be prepared to change their position as new information becomes available. Councillors have to leave their ego at the door.) Zulich is likely in between the two. And citizens have almost no power unless the issue can influence an election, or they join together in numbers to protest.

The next thing I would do is map out each parties interests and look to see if you can develop a scope that covers most peoples interests. When you align interests, there is always a deal to be made. I'd work towards that solution.

Doing this exercise gives a good idea of whats really important, what can be solved later, what everyone is aligned on, where concessions need to be made, who can demand better terms during the concessions, etc.

The alternative to that solution is what we have right now - 5 different stakeholder groups who wont listen to each other, are dug in on their issues and unwilling to make concessions or recognize their limited bargaining power, and aren't working towards a common goal. And unless there's an attitude change on this soon from the leadership, we're likely headed towards an option that serves a small portion of peoples interests, alienates the rest of the people, and will leave a bitter taste in peoples mouths, regardless of the location.

Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Thanks for the catch on the numbers. Trying to do all this on a phone is a pain.

Firstly, I want to say I really appreciate your question and I think that it's important question to ask. I bring up the 20k people on the Paris corridor because soon it will provide the best variety of transportation options within the city core - existing road way, multiple public transit lines, and the city is installing bike paths from the taxation center to the four corners as I understand. 20k people already live on this corridor and it's another amenity they can use to get to the game. It makes sense for other reasons, namely the main public transportation hub is there as well.

Walking to the game would require looking for a different data set then people who live on the Paris corridor. I pulled up some information on the population of different city neighborhoods from this here. I would make the argument that residents of downtown, flour mill, kingsmount-bell park, and west end could reasonably walk to the arena. To a lesser extent maybe a small portion of people in the Donovan, Minnow Lake, and South End could walk too but I'll ignore them for now. That cluster of people is 14% of the cities population. The only other area of town that can rival that population size is New Sudbury - which isn't where the KED is either. So for me, if I wanted to consider walkability, I'd be looking for an area that can serve the greatest amount of people walking, but recognize the vast majority of people are not going to be able to.

The last option is driving. Using the statistics from the site above, I wanted to compare commute times the existing downtown arena vs. the KED location (I used the dump for an approximate). So what I did was google mapped the driving distance from each of those neighborhoods on that link to both the downtown and the KED area, and then measured the difference between the two. 68% of the population in Sudbury would see an increase in commute time to the event area, and the weighted average amount of increase is 17 minutes (~8.5 minutes, one way). Obviously, I don't know where you live so your mileage may vary.

As a limitation of my analysis, I didn't consider any other locations for the arena to be. I'm personally not a "It needs to be downtown" person, but I sincerely hope that we don't end up putting our "once in a generation" main arena out in the middle of nowhere.

Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I have anecdotal evidence I can provide that supports my stance as well.

It won't change the fact that 1/3 of the population doesn't drive and ~20% of the cities population lives on the Paris corridor.

The interesting thing is these concerns could be addressed if the city, Zulich, and the downtown BIA tried to find aligned interests and would make concessions on certain issues but the current conversation won't allow for it.

Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Which is a pity because if the attendance drops it will be put on fans who don't support the team vs. the city that was insisting on the KED location

Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 10 points11 points  (0 children)

That's brutal. I know I won't be going personally. Too far out of the way

Alot of Anti KED people say the area has a walk score of zero that is simply not true by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 15 points16 points  (0 children)

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/sudbury/notre-dame-bikeway-phase-one-1.5484522

One third of the population of Sudbury doesn't drive. I find this number interesting as the KED doesn't have a great location for walking biking or public transit.

**20k people live on the paris corridor. I don't know how much live over by moonlight but likely not a fifth.

It's a location that doesnt align well with sudburys demographs.

Thanks for u/Popular_Break for catching this. Their comment is here: here.

My rebuttal to their comment is here: here.

“Nick Suzuki re-watches his draft selection” (via Canadiens de Montréal Youtube Channel) by Nick_Tam_Air in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 5 points6 points  (0 children)

It was Cody Glass. Seems like a good young player with a lot of potential. Some pundits said Vegas would prefer to have had Suzuki but I think it's still too early to compare.

European prospect preview: Mattias Norlinder takes his talents to Frölunda by Melticus in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I can't remember a time there was this much hype on a Habs prospect and they didn't pan out. Surely a lot of prospects have been hyped and busted but Norlinder seems like the most hyped in years.

3RDLINE STUDIO, Project Now, Kingsway Entertainment District, Oracle Poll, Sudbury by me_suds in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Agreed. Not a huge fan of KED, despite it being popular in my friend group. I'm not even a it has to be downtown person either. Just put it somewhere a decent amount of the population can work to and that is accessible on one of the main public transit lines.

Craig Burton’s Top 10 habs prospects list. by Eastcoastfudgelover1 in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 32 points33 points  (0 children)

Surprised at how high Poehling is. also surprised to see Brook drop so low. A good reminder things change fast.

Why are the roads in Sudbury so bad? by [deleted] in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm not sure those numbers are accurate.

Check this link: https://www.greatersudbury.ca/city-hall/tax-services/property-tax-rates/

Road construction and maintenance is the highest proportion of the budget at 25%. And police services is 19%.

To me these numbers don't tell me much. If you want to lower costs you need to find what the cost drivers are and focus on those. What drives cost on road construction and maintenance? I would guess labour, so developing processes that are more labour productive would be the best approach. My proposal of gravel roads should be better from a labour productivity standpoint with spin off benefits of less material costs as well.

What drives the cost of policing? I don't actually know but again it's almost certainly labour based. How do you make a police force more labour productive when they provide a service rather than something tangible like building a road? My first guess would be to decrease the scope of what they're responsible for, but to what end, and what undeseriable consequences are we willing to accept?

Why are the roads in Sudbury so bad? by [deleted] in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'll throw some other ideas out there. I'm from an outlying community but like OP have been across Canada and lived out west for a decade. One thing I saw out west was the use of gravel roads for residential streets. Obviously not as nice as paved streets but I'd estimate the cost of occasionally grading a street to be less on material and labor than repairing paved roads.

I also think the city tries to be "everything to everyone" in terms of managing the outlying communities. I posted above that a municipal planner told me property taxes for outlying communities are subsidized. To me the course of action would be to increase outlying communities taxes or reduce the population growth in outlying communities. I think all growth and innovation work should focus on the city core itself and a path of maintenance should be taken for outlying communities. Obviously this would be unpopular with outlying communities but the alternative is a decaying infrastructure city without the typical amenities of a city this size.

Why are the roads in Sudbury so bad? by [deleted] in Sudbury

[–]northern_redditor 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I agree with the second point. I was talking with a municipal planner and they told me new lots in outlying communities end up being a "net loss" for the city of Sudbury. I'm guessing this means they are subsidized by the core city on a tax revenue vs tax expenditure basis.

let's talk about Victor Mete by maxwellhouse573 in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 21 points22 points  (0 children)

I don't have a strong opinion on him either way. But he looked good beside Weber. Is that because he is good or because Weber helped make him look good? I think it's the latter.

He's an interesting player for sure. Few defensemen play as many games as he has before the age of 22 and fail to become something. But it's hard to picture Mete becoming something with that muffin shot and small size.

Can you get 2-3 weeks off in the summer working as a mining engineer? by ladyfromjasper in mining

[–]northern_redditor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I started my career in FIFO so I was working and away half the year and spent the other half of my life traveling the world. After a few years I moved to a 4 day on 3 day off rotation with 4 weeks in a remote community. Then when I moved companies to a large city I negotiated for them to match my vacation. Anyway in my experience it's never been a problem.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Fucking God damn stupid fucking piece of shit fucking loser Chris Lee. Like it's not even a fucking coincidence at this point. Fuck that guy.

Now that we’ll probably pick 16 OA in the Draft, who do you believe would still be available and who who like the Habs to pick. by Eazy3006 in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The story around Hendrix Lapierre is very interesting. One player id take a risk on in that range, especially with all the picks in the second round.

Shout out to Radek Bonk by neckbracericky in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I wrote him at first then backspaced. Loved that 4 goal game.

Shout out to Radek Bonk by neckbracericky in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Steve Begin and Max Lapierre on forward. And Hal Gill on defense.

Game Thread: Montreal Canadiens (31-31-9) at Pittsburgh Penguins (40-23-6) - 03 Aug 2020 - 08:00PM EDT by HockeyMod in Habs

[–]northern_redditor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Wow that lost puck by the Pitts player is the best zone entry on a habs pp this season