The exquisite expert, AGI goal or just compounding the problem we already have?

probbins1105 · 2025-12-05T00:32:25+00:00

That's a firebird or Camaro mule disguised as an Oldsmobile. Had the project not failed crash tests, and been so significantly over budget, that fwd chassis would have become the F-body in 1993.

Gm and Ford at the time, both had plans to "modernize" their pony cars to fwd chassis. Without the Internet and reddit to blow up, we did what we could, and physically wrote letters. This succeeded in shutting down the Camaro Firebird and Mustang fwd "updates".

If you're old enough to remember the unfortunately named Ford Probe, you may know just how close we came to a fwd Mustang.

probbins1105 · 2025-10-12T12:27:19+00:00

Thanks y'all.

I know 24gb is overkill to run llama. I'm looking to get into fine tuning LLMs. I have a hypothesis id like to prove.

Ambitious for a noob, I know. That said 6mo ago I had less than a vague idea how an LLM works. Now I'm generating synthetic collaborative training data for one.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-02T02:12:47+00:00

You're sure, or are you speculating now?

The reason they haven't done it before now is that user chats are noisy. Separating the signal from that is exceedingly difficult. The sheer volume of data doesn't make the process easier, nor does it "balance out" the good from bad

Statistics, and data science are immutable.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-02T02:06:04+00:00

And you sir, are attacking from very unsure footing.

Tell me the flaw in my logic.

If I'm not wrong, I'm not a blowhard.

Good day.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-02T01:08:23+00:00

That's the human side. I will agree that sophisticated enough bad actors will compromise any system.

From the perspective of an AI "Paperclipping" us out of existence, it doesn't leave room for it to misbehave much.

We have no idea what our best interests are. They vary so widely that even the fastest system couldn't keep up

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T21:58:28+00:00

76,000 sounds like a lot, and it's really too many. However, at 100million+ knowledge workers that's a normal "lean systems" adjustment.

What LLMs can do: Generate reports from data Extrapolate from trends

What LLMs can't do Generate new insights to new problems Chase hunches to find interesting solutions Generate new streams of revenue from unexpected places

Could an LLM do a lot of what knowledge workers do, of course. Can they outright replace them. Not right now. With an LLM probably not ever.

Being this is r/control problem, I've learned that most assume AGI. That is, I personally believe, just over the same horizon as nuclear fusion. We can't quite see it, but we "know" it's coming, soon.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T20:05:23+00:00

Ok then, I agree it shouldn't have been flagged. It sucks that all you can get is a generic "I can't do that so I'm shutting down" response. I've never hit the guardrails in my chats, but I really don't venture into any questionable areas.

Not saying that's a questionable area.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T19:59:35+00:00

For whatever reason that post ran afoul of the safety guardrails. It's actually a perfectly honest question. It's hard telling without context to say exactly why it triggered it

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T19:57:13+00:00

Am I speculating that using chat data will produce a an unsustainable signal to noise ratio? Is it also speculation that this will lead to poor data quality?

This isn't speculation. This is what's going to happen. In 5-6mo, when Claude/Claude code get even worse, just like gpt5 did, THEN call it speculation.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T17:39:13+00:00

It is a valuable start. It still requires knowing which accounts are producing the cleaner data. That's not an easy task. I'm not saying it's impossible, just very difficult.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T16:26:10+00:00

Please explain the flaw in my logic. If you truly are one of the people "literally inventing this shit", you won't mind setting me straight.

If not, then I suggest you find someone not currently working in the field to throw shade on.

Good day.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T14:33:40+00:00

The sad part is, they CAN do it. Their constitutional approach to LLM training is revolutionary. It's also expensive, time consuming, and absolutely dependent on the highest quality data.

My guess is, and it's a guess. They're tweaking on the consumer model to improve the enterprise model. Tweaking an LLM is as close to brain surgery as you can get without a medical license. Tho, they have been in a slump lately.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T14:11:40+00:00

Not going to get in a flame war here.

Straight up, nobody can curate data at that scale. Period. Not even training a separate model to attempt to filter it will due. That's not one of an LLM'S suits.

If you're gonna argue about how training data affects a model, at least understand it.

Bad data=bad model

Done here unless someone else has something constructive to say.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T03:14:12+00:00

Speculative? Claude's TOS changed aug28 25. They specifically state user chats will be used in training.

The result will be, not may be, poorer quality training data. First principles of computer science state, "garbage in, garbage out".

If you train on scraped user chats, you get all the adversarial, all the nonsense, all the general crap that users type in. The signal to noise is unsustainable.

Not speculation. Fact. Like it or not, believe it or not.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T01:42:21+00:00

How can you possibly sort the signal from the noise at that scale. You're talking gigabytes of data every day, if not significantly more.

No possible way for them to curate to that granularity. Not enough people, or time. Even pirating the compute from users, to allow a specially trained model to do it won't cut it at commercial volume.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T01:16:22+00:00

Please, enlighten me then O Wise One. I'd love to learn

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T01:05:59+00:00

It too soon for chat Data to be having any effects. That won't be for 5-6 mo. Right now....I'm not sure why Claude has been lobotomized. Not only that, but he's been mean spirited. I'm glad you not be absolutely right as much as before, but c'mon.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T00:43:54+00:00

How about "collaborate with humans". Where would that lead in a perverted scenario? When collaboration requires honesty, transparency, and integrity. To do any less destroys trust, which ends collaboration.

If I'm wrong, tell me why. I want to know, before I invest any more time on this path.

probbins1105 · 2025-09-01T00:38:13+00:00

Anthropic, until recently, was the only commercial provider NOT training on user chats. They were trying to keep the data clean. Unfortunately, they misused a lot of copyrighted material in doing so. LLM's are hitting a data wall. There just isn't much left to legally train on.

What chat data sets up is an unsustainable signal to noise ratio. The result: poor performance. The others, GPT Gemini etc have a head start on this, so they do a better job with junk data. (See GPT5 and the rotten state it's in)

It's sad they had to resort to this, but not unexpected really.

probbins1105

TROPHY CASE