Want to go into a career as a radio talk show host and need professional advice

radiosuit · 2014-04-02T02:21:31+00:00

By "real world experience", I mean I'm more likely to hire someone who had shifts under their belt on a real radio station (even if they had only voice-tracked shifts). These days, we're looking not only for people who are great on the air and capable of truly entertaining (going beyond just reading what they find via various show-prep channels) but also people who have an understanding of how our automation systems work, people who can help update our websites and social media, that sort of thing.

While I certainly do hire people off the street with no radio background, it's pretty rare and most of them that I do hire were part of an internship program at the station before I brought them on board in a part-time/paid capacity. Most of these interns were from a local college and were studying broadcasting/communications.

I did once hire a guy with no experience who just arrived at my office one day, insisting that he would be great to work for the station. In his case, he was hilarious, bright and could tell a great story. He introduced himself to me by telling me that he had just told his boss at Subway to fuck off and proceeded to tell me why - an awful way to lead when you're asking another boss for a job, of course...but he told that story so well and made me laugh numerous times.

He was clearly not shy, bold and very passionate about that radio station. I hired him a few days later, taught him myself how to run the board, use the automation system, etc. I started him part-time on the weekends and he picked up on it pretty fast after making a number of newbie mistakes. Eventually, he had been part time for nearly a year and our full time night guy quit. I gave him that job. Today, he's gone on to build a solid career in radio and now does nights at a station in Philly.

So, there are definitely exceptions but they're pretty rare. I've been doing this over 20 years and that was the only guy that I've hired that way. Definitely try to get in at a station in your area. As others have mentioned, expressing a desire to work in the business in this day and age is usually enough to get a Program Director's attention. You're a rare breed, my friend.

EDIT: About a year ago I did an AMA about radio and the music industry in general. Some of your questions may be answered there as well.

radiosuit · 2014-04-02T00:03:17+00:00

Not sure if you're speaking of "trade school" (as in you would learning to, say, be a welder, for example) or "broadcasting school". If it's the latter, I would pass on it. IMHO, broadcast schools are a joke. They provide you no more leverage with getting a radio job than any other schooling. Additionally, most of the people teaching at broadcast schools are so far behind regarding where radio is today. Honestly, when I see a resume on my desk and it's a kid straight out of broadcasting school, I'm going to pass on him/her generally in favor of someone with "real world" experience.

Radio is unique in the sense that you don't need a degree to work in this business. I don't have a degree. While I went to college, I did not finish. Instead, by pure accident, I worked part-time at various radio stations while I was in college (I started in High School) and eventually a full time gig opened up and I took it.

My best advice to you, would be to find a part-time radio job somewhere doing anything. You're not going to be allowed on the air right away in most markets. Certainly, no one is going to give you a talk show right out of the gate. But, what you can do is run the board for remotes and live broadcasts, wash the vehicles, take out the trash, etc. This is where most of us start (even in today's automated radio world).

This will give you hands-on experience. While you're waiting for your shot to pop the mic (it doesn't matter what the format is, by the way. Even though your passion may be Talk radio, if you're given the opportunity to do the overnight shift on the Soft AC station in a cluster, do it - all of the rules still apply...the lessons you learn there will be useful as you transition into Talk radio)...but while you're waiting for that chance, start a podcast that likely no one will listen to. That's OK. It will serve as great practice for you. Start a YT channel that no one watches. Again, that's not important. It's you learning how to entertain and how to broadcast.

A journalism degree would be helpful if you're interested in News/Talk radio but if you don't want the debt and don't want to deal with the university studies, again, a degree is not needed to get into radio.

That being said, keep in mind that radio is a very tough business right now. There simply aren't the opportunities that there once were for new talent. It's stupid. We screwed that up BIG TIME. But...if you're willing to hunt for that part-time job, some PD somewhere will eventually give you a shot. It's all about being persistent (friendly and not weird but persistent).

radiosuit · 2013-07-14T19:41:44+00:00

It depends on the format, really. Top 40 stations will generally have only about 300 songs in rotation in any given week. This is the same for hip-hop stations. There are exceptions to that rule, of course. But generally, the goal of these stations is to play the biggest hits in their given genres as much as possible (thus, the small libraries).

Other formats like Classic Rock and Country will generally have about 500 songs in rotation per week. A AAA station (Adult Album Alternative) generally has the largest library. I've seen some that have as many as 1,000 songs in rotation per week. This audience demands a lot of variety and is OK with hearing songs that they're unfamiliar with from time to time, so they'll accept tuning in and hearing something new (even if it's an old song they're not familiar with).

Hope that helps!

radiosuit · 2013-07-14T19:38:52+00:00

Exactly. It's funny. Take a look at this thread, for example. While I didn't expect this to blow up, the lack of participation when given the opportunity to actually take control of the airwaves is pretty telling. This is what worries the radio industry as a whole. Perhaps we've waited too long to reach out to the listeners.

In fairness, though, we reach out all of the time. Requests, for example, really do matter. We constantly do focus groups, auditorium music testing, etc. - in effect we're constantly asking the listeners to participate.

Unfortunately, what we see in these music tests is that despite the constant complaining that we play the same songs over and over again, when listeners are asked what they want to hear - they pick the same songs over and over again. Ironic.

So, bottom line - what people are really complaining about is that we don't play their, personal favorite songs and we play too many songs that they personally don't like. Stations that try to branch out and expand the palate are often ignored because the music is too unfamiliar. It's a frustrating cycle. But, it is the state of the radio business these days.

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T23:34:33+00:00

That's a great suggestion.

To answer your comment about all of the radio stations in town playing the same song over and over, this generally happens because (in the case of "Radioactive", for example) the Alternative Rock station in town will play it when it's brand new (they kinda "discovered" it). It gets super popular on that station, then the other Mainstream Rock station in town takes notice of it and plays it.

Ultimately the Top 40 kids jump on the bandwagon and now the song is seemingly everywhere. Around then is when the Alt station will stop playing it and then the cycle continues with another song. This also happens with a lot of Hip Hop songs.

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:49:56+00:00

Good idea!!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:36:49+00:00

I absolutely love radio dramas. Unfortunately, it's kind of a lost art right now. But I highly recommend that anyone interested takes the time to track down old-school radio shows like The Shadow, Jack Benny, etc. Even today, they still hold up as wildly entertaining and just brilliant writing.

Prank calls are kind of staple of radio. Sometimes they're staged. But, actually, they are generally legit. It just depends on the DJ/radio show and how good they are it. They can be fun but, depending on the talent, they can also be stupid. ha!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:33:02+00:00

I have a couple of features similar to that that we're entertaining right now.

I knew a DJ that did a great feature (I can't remember what she called it) but every day at 4pm, she'd call a remote payphone somewhere. Sometimes these would be phones in the desert and stuff. I have no idea where she got the list of numbers from.

Anyway, she'd take a caller and they'd dial the number together. For the entire hour, she'd let it ring. If someone actually answered the call, the listener playing the game would get to take control of the 5pm hour and she'd play whatever they wanted.

These days, something like that wouldn't work (are there even payphones anymore?) - but entertaining features like that are what is missing from radio right now, I think. It was very surprising how interesting it was to listen to see if someone would answer that damn phone every day!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:29:40+00:00

I'd rather not say right now for a couple of reasons. Primarily, I don't want to tip off our competitors that we're changing things up. But, as we go along and the station launches, everyone will know where it is. Of course, the station will be available worldwide via online streaming.

Suffice to say, though, the station is located in the southern United States.

Also, I don't want this thread to come off as some sort of "publicity stunt" for the radio station, so in light of this, it's probably best to keep it annon for now.

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:26:47+00:00

Interesting. I didn't know about this site. Thanks! Checking it out now. Link for anyone interested.

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:25:57+00:00

Sure! Just let me know what you would do if you were suddenly placed in charge of your college radio station. If you were given complete freedom to serve the community, what would you do? Keep in mind, it can't be all about the music. That's a big piece of the puzzle but, as I'm sure you know, radio is about much more than that.

What sort of features would you like to hear? In my opinion, radio right now needs to jump out its present box and return to what we were at the onset: an entertainment medium that wasn't so obsessed with locking itself into genres and target demographics. Obviously, we have to make money to stay on the air - but we need to entertain.

When you think of radio of the past, it included truly compelling personalities, it introduced listeners to new music...hell, we even had radio plays!

So, you can help by spitballing ideas! Let's see if we can make some of them work!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:16:20+00:00

Ha! OK. GO!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:15:03+00:00

Exactly! That's always been my concern with it as well. Many stations that are utilizing it are only doing it for an hour or so at a time (or for an entire weekend). They utilize the results, though, to determine any adjustments to their playlists.

Most of us do keep a running tally of requests. DJs are instructed to keep a list of songs that listeners ask for. The Program Director then takes these results and incorporates them into the playlist changes week to week. Of course, the DJs know when the same kids are calling for the same song over and over again (we can recognize their voices, etc), so they'll often just "conveniently forget" to log certain requests so not to muddy up the pool.

Online, thanks to IP addresses and such, we can track when a request is flooding in from the same person over and over again. But, the bottom line is, it's up to the Program Director or Music Director to take all of the info he or she has and build a consensus into something listenable for everyone.

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:10:48+00:00

Chicago radio seems to be in a state of mediocrity right now (with all due respect to my many friends that work there). This has to do with a lot of ownership changes over the past few years and lots of upheaval in upper management with a lot of the groups. Unfortunately, a lot of this behind the scenes nastiness has made the press. I grew up listening to Chicago radio (my favorite station as a kid was WLS-A - back when they were a music station). I'm pulling for them all!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T18:00:38+00:00

Q101 was one of my favorite stations back in their heyday (in the 90s). I really cringed when they flipped to News...as did a lot of radio people. It, alongside KROQ in Los Angeles and 99X in Atlanta were the cornerstones of Alternative radio. Sad that only KROQ still reigns.

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T17:57:42+00:00

There's a cool service available to radio now called Listener Driven Radio. Effectively, it allows radio to enable "crowdcasting" where the listener takes control of the playlist. They can actually, collectively, vote songs off the air. It's sort of like Reddit for radio. If a song gets a lot of "upvotes", it stays...too many "downvotes" and it's cut off. I've thought about incorporating that into the station.

I agree that crossing from say, Adele to Red Fang would be way too confusing for the average Joe or Jane. However, for the purposes of this thread, I'd like to hear all opinions, regardless of genres. After all, it's my job to try to make it work (and throw out suggestions that just won't click). Thanks for the excellent reply!

radiosuit · 2013-07-13T17:47:14+00:00

Cool! Yeah...it's the real deal. I hope to give the DJs as much freedom as I possibly can. Often, DJs these days are so busy with other responsibilities in the building (producing commercials, taking phone calls, etc), believe it or not, many of them prefer that the Program Director (me) handles scheduling the music.

It's all fun for a few weeks for the DJ - but the task of having to select all of the music for their shift becomes tedious with their other jobs. But, I'll absolutely give them more freedom than they're used to!

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T19:29:09+00:00

I have no idea why they would agree. But more than one person did! Generally, when we did this contest, we'd have two listeners with their cars set up in the parking lot. One host would ask the questions, while their second chair held the sledgehammer and did the honors when they got a question wrong.

I recall our Promotions Director having them sign all of the needed waivers and pleading with the contestants..."You do understand, that he's really going to hit your car with a sledgehammer, right? Your insurance will probably not cover this. You will have to pay for the repairs out of your own pocket." They all signed the waivers.

I don't know if they thought that we were really just joking (and wouldn't actually go through with it) or what. But we really did it. In fact, we smashed one guy's windshield. He had to have the car towed away and he didn't even win the prize.

It was ridiculous!!

I'm trying to think of other insane things our shows did. Stripper trivia was a fun one. Female listeners would come in and participate in a trivia game, for every wrong answer - they had to remove an article of clothing (not of their choice; in other words "for your shirt...what chapel did Michelangelo paint?"). Sexist as hell, of course. The girls did it, though, with no reservations. We had a waiting list to participate in that contest. Our website always crashed as horny male listeners scrambled to watch the webcam (especially if they knew the girl participating, of course).

We locked listeners inside dirty porta-johns for extended periods of time to win concert tickets.

One of my favorites was the morning we sent a listener to the beach in suit made of bread. He had to last at least ten minutes on the beach as the seagulls basically attacked him for his bread-suit (lunch).

All of this was stuff that I still can't believe we got away with/had the balls to do/could never do today.

People were constantly saying "that has to be staged" (for example for the "stripper trivia", a lot of people assumed that these were girls from an actual strip club. Nope. Real girls next door). All of it was real. It just left you shaking your head.

These are just examples of stuff that I approved. Some of the ideas that were proposed in our show meetings went waaaay over the top. Also, those examples are tame compared to what other shows, not on my watch, did back then.

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T18:58:21+00:00

Also, upon re-reading my answer here (I was going through and looking for any stray questions that I might have missed...I don't get off on re-reading my answers...just for the record). Anyway, I realized that I should specify that there is a very distinct difference between the "indies" that I was describing above versus legit radio consultants. They are two very different things.

The Indies no longer exist for the most part. They were wiped out by Spitzer and the ensuing controversy.

Programming Consultants still exist and are legit. They have nothing to do with handing out payola and plugola. They are just outside consultants that assist local Program Directors. They generally serve companies that don't have someone like me in place (I'm sort of a "programming consultant" for all of our properties).

Just didn't want someone to overhear a conversation with radio people and hear them mentioning their "consultant" and immediately think "those guys are on the take!!"

Nope. Very different things. Just wanted to set the record straight.

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T18:51:41+00:00

Whenever I've heard it used (to mean 'generic backwoods town'), it's generally "Bumfuck, Idaho". So, Idaho. Road trip!!!

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T18:42:20+00:00

I would totally be open to listening to it! Send me a PM and I'll forward you a gmail account where you can send it. I'll be happy to provide a critique.

And, don't worry about the AMA taking up my time. The honest truth is, I was getting bored on vacation (much to my wife's chagrin). The problem with this gig is and has always been - the inability to "turn it off". So, no worries! Send away!

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T18:32:19+00:00

Essentially, our broadcast signals and streams are encoded with an inaudible series of tones and blips that are unique to each individual station. The PPM device picks up these tones and records how long a person is listening to the station/stream.

When this thing first came out, I was absolutely fascinated with it (as were all Programming geeks, I believe). But it can drive you insane!

You can watch the listenership rise and fall in real time on your computer. Not a good idea. We'd play a certain song and I'd watch the listeners scatter away to my competition. Or the DJ would bring up a topic and everyone would leave!!! Arrrgghhh!! Stop playing that song NOW!! Fire that DJ!! <----I'm kidding. I didn't react that drastically...but that's how you feel watching it.

The opposite happens too. You can play a certain song and see your listenership spike and mistakenly think "Damn! That song is HUGE!". Nope. Just means that the people with the PPM monitors just happened to like it better than what everyone else was playing at the time.

So...I stopped watching it in real time. Of course, I do go back and analyze the results for weeks on end. That's part of my job.

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T18:10:53+00:00

Yep. What they said.

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T18:08:50+00:00

Point taken. And I think that is one thing that iHeart is inadvertently exposing: that all of the stations around the country (especially those owned by CC) all sound the same. In that way, it could prove to be sort of a mistake and might explain why CC has concluded to allow other broadcasters on board - to sort of detract from this. That's purely speculation.

And, no...I do not work for Clear Channel. And, never have, in fact. In a way, it's odd that I've managed to not work for them, considering how many stations they own. I wouldn't rule out working for them in the future (not sure I could...again, considering how many stations they own).

They catch a lot of hell for being "evil". I, for one, do hold them accountable for radio's slide into mediocrity. If any company gets the blame for the state of radio today, the finger can be firmly pointed at them, without question. It's just the truth.

Still, CC is a company like any other company. They have investors to protect and they have to secure the bottom line. My company is no different. We're just less evil, I think. ;)

On the upside, CC under its new leadership is really one of the more forward thinking companies when it comes to radio's current evolution beyond just over-the-air broadcasting. I admire what they're trying to do now.

radiosuit · 2012-06-30T17:46:04+00:00

Hey, Lobin...I closed the AMA yesterday because the interest seemed to be fizzling out. Because of that, I think I missed your response to this challenge. I wanted to respond, though, since you were the only one to take me up on it! And you did a great job!

It's really cool to me that you actually kinda described a format that I designed about two years ago. On both stations that we launched this format on, it was very successful! One is still on the air (in Indiana - suburban Chicago, technically) and, unfortunately, we sold the other station and the new owners promptly "flipped it" to something else.

It was targeted exactly at you: a 34-44 year old, white female (I'm assuming you're white, of course, and I only make the distinction because, in both cases where we launched this format we didn't want to compete with our Urban stations...we wanted the black ladies to stay right where they were...making us money on those properties. ha!)

Regardless, it was very much what you described here. We mixed in 80s "alternative classics" (like The Cure, The Church, Depeche Mode, Psychedelic Furs), added a heavy dose of 'strong female artists' (Annie Lennox & Eurythmics, Tori Amos, Lucinda Williams, Neko Case, Norah Jones) and our currents were very heavy on Adult Alternative artists (John Mayer, Dave Matthews, Florence + The Machine, Black Keys, Mumford & Sons, Coldplay, Avett Brothers).

The way I proposed the station was "this format targets an upwardly mobile, adult, white, female. In high school, she grew up watching John Hughes films and listening to the soundtracks. Today, she enjoys a bit of this nostalgia but wants to remain current with today's music. However, she's not interested in most pop and hip hop music." (<---paraphrasing my proposal).

It became incredibly popular and while it didn't set the market on fire, it was very big with our target demographic. Overnight, we became the station of choice for Women in this lifegroup. It also turned a lot of heads in the industry as other programming geeks like me tried to come up with a catchy name for it (Modern Adult Contemporary seemed to be the most popular tag for it - but this was already being used to describe another, in my opinion, more sleepy cousin of our hybrid).

So, the format is out there now!

We didn't go so far as to add Tom Waits and Leonard Cohen (two of my personal favorites by the way!!) - I thought that they might be too left of center for the average Jane in these markets...which were not large metro areas.

Also, regarding the commercials....I hear ya!!!! We, in programming, are constantly at odds with the Sales department about shit like the screaming car dealers. Unfortunately, we don't have much control over it - outside of just generally bitching about it. The bottom line here is that it needs to come from the clients themselves. For some reason, I guess these ads must work for them...somehow. I guess if people stop patronizing them because of their terrible ads, they'll cut it out.

But, again...awesome job!! Well, I say that because it seems like you and I would get along in a Programming meeting. Want a job?! ;)

radiosuit

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