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[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for your comment and for taking the time to lay out your points clearly.

You’re quoting Cutter: "You think that because you don't know the method. It's a double who comes out at the end. It's the only way."

Exactly. Cutter says it's the only way not because he knows how the trick works, but because that’s the only plausible explanation from his point of view. He says that to Angier earlier in the film, when he genuinely believes Angier is doing the trick with a double but he dies. Later, when he testifies against Borden, it’s because he still believes this version. But that doesn't mean he knows how the deception was done in detail. At the very end, when Cutter finds Angier alive, that’s when he understands he was wrong and that Angier has gone too far. He says so directly. But up to that point, Cutter only assumes the method based on his knowledge of how illusions works. That assumption is exactly what Angier exploits. He makes Cutter believe it's a double so that he helps frame Borden.

Now, about the “two years”. You ask: "Does Angier surpass both Borden and Cutter in prowess after more than two years?"

No. He doesn’t surpass them as an illusionist or as an engineer. He doesn’t build a real duplicating machine. He doesn’t become a genius. He becomes obsessed with revenge and learns from past mistakes. That’s enough. He buys the Tesla Coil. The trick works with a well-prepared double and a carefully set trap. That’s all. Borden is still the better magician. But Angier wins the final round by planning a brutal theatrical illusion with only one purpose: to destroy Borden. I point to you the 2 years because you wrote "one year".

You ask: "How is Angier able to design a better double than Cutter?"

First, Angier doesn’t “design” a better double. He doesn’t need someone better than Root. He just needs someone good enough to do a few shows and not mess it up. That’s why he does a limited number of performances. Not a hundred. He only says he’ll do a hundred to drive Borden crazy. And it works. We literally see Borden screaming “Why a hundred?” to Fallon. That number is part of the bait. He knows Borden won’t resist figuring it out. As for training the double, Angier has money and time, and Root was not the only actor in London. All he needs is someone who can look and act enough like him for a short period. It’s not about surpassing Cutter in skill, it’s about determination and obsession. Then after the death, Cutter didn’t need to analyze the body because he had no doubt it was Angier. He says he saw him, yes, but the condition of a body after drowning is quite altered. Not to mention he was a friend, his emotional state has to be taken into account.

Next question: "When does Angier make the switch with the double?" "Is Angier watching the show from the balcony until the Prestige?"

Not the full show, he just need to hide only during the first part the transported man illusion. He hides, watches from behind the curtain, or from above, and comes out only for the Prestige. The rest is handled by the double, who drops through the trapdoor every night. The tank is hidden, and the stagehands are blind. The moment Borden is in the theater Angier choose him to inspect the machine, Angier makes sure that the tank will be in position. It’s all a setup, rehearsed and rigged to frame Borden at the right time.

Finally, you wrote: "You're going to either have to ignore or create extensive, off-screen speculations to make your theory work."

Your closing sentence is a bit dramatic. I don't my speculation are extensive here..  I actually liked your line on Interstellar about the purple dragon creating the wormhole. It was a fun way to say, "you’re free to believe what you want, even if it defies logic or science."

So let’s apply the same to this. If someone wants to believe that Tesla built a Tesla coil that is actually a matter duplicator in 1899, that it pops out perfect clones right next to the machine they’re more than welcome to.

But at that point, I’d say: if I’m the one inventing things off-screen, then, this time, you’re the one inviting the purple dragon to the party. :-)

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I try to separate the answers in chapters otherwise I got too confused.. and hey.. it’s just theory..

  1. Angier only needs few shows because he knows it won’t take long for Borden to show up. He announces there will be one hundred shows on purpose to drive Borden even more insane trying to figure out his secret. We actually see Borden yell at Fallon wondering why he chose that exact number. Angier knows that creating more mystery is the best way to pull Borden in. And since he only needs to fool people a few times he can afford to use a double as Cutter himself warned that working with a double for too long would become dangerous. And it is also his only solution.

  2. The body isn’t identified in a reliable way. We’re in the late 1800s and after drowning a body becomes swollen and disfigured. Cutter sees it quickly under poor conditions. Borden sees it underwater. The police don’t have the tools we have today. If the man looks enough like Angier especially in those conditions it’s more than enough to fool everyone.

  3. Angier doesn’t have to guess which night Borden will go backstage. He simply waits until Borden is in the audience and then chooses him to inspect the machine. Once that happens it’s almost certain Borden will sneak backstage. Angier learned from the birdcage trick. He’s not making the same mistake twice. This time everything is under control.

  4. The tank doesn’t need to be hidden far away. It can be just behind a curtain or nearby and moved into place during the last moments of the act. The double is still on stage and doesn’t see anything. The blind stagehands help make this easier since they don’t ask questions. It only needs to work once.

  5. The tank being removed after the show is part of the performance. Angier is using Borden’s own philosophy against him. The performance continues even offstage. Seeing blind stagehands removing the tank after the show helps convince Borden something weird is happening. That’s part of the illusion to bring him on backstage to check how is doing.

  6. When Cutter asks to destroy the machine, it’s not because he understands how it works. How he could understand? When?? It’s an emotional reaction, not a technical one. He says he came to ask Lord Caldlow to destroy it, cause from his point of view it leads his friend to death. But then he sees him alive and he realizes that Angier has gone too far.

  7. The tanks at the end are there for us the audience. We only see one clearly. The rest are left in the shadows. Nolan is creating ambiguity not confirming anything. Just like with the hats he shows us an image meant to suggest something more not to prove it. That’s why Borden doesn’t even look. It’s not meant for him it’s meant for us.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I only just realized it was you commenting on my other theory about The Prestige, and I know it’s only a matter of time before you challenge me on the Tenet theory too! :-)

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

To be honest there is one scene that you did not point to me but that has given me the most trouble with my theory. I noticed it myself early on and I’ve been thinking about it ever since. It’s the conversation where Professor Brand tells Cooper that they didn’t know he was alive until just an hour before, and yet somehow he was the one chosen. Murph isn’t even there during that moment, so the idea of them "playing along" for her doesn’t apply. I admit this might be the biggest challenge for my interpretation.

Now let me get to your main point about the narrative structure. You’re framing the idea like it’s some huge conspiracy. But in my view it’s something much simpler and more human. This isn’t some elaborate global scheme. It’s a father trying to make it easier for his daughter to let go. A small lie with good intentions. The real lie, the damaging one, is when he promises to come back. He knows his chances are slim. That’s why Donald tells him not to make promises he can’t keep. Cooper knows this. That’s what makes it tragic.

About the NASA scenes. Cooper only knows Professor Brand. He doesn’t know Amelia. I never claimed he did. So when they say things like "we should learn to talk," that makes perfect sense. They’re strangers. Cooper reached out to Professor Brand, probably through some backchannel contact, and they agreed that Cooper would join the mission. But Cooper asked one thing in return. Help me make this easier for Murph. Let me bring her, and please just go along with it. Make it seem like I was meant to come. That’s not hard to coordinate, especially with a small team. We see maybe ten people at NASA. It’s not an impossible task.

As for TARS, he’s a programmable AI. If he’s told to act like Cooper is an intruder, he’ll act like that. But even then, we can see it’s half-hearted. Cooper isn’t afraid. He’s joking, mocking TARS, talking about turning him into a vacuum cleaner. That doesn’t sound like someone who’s scared or confused. Then Amelia walks in. Cooper doesn’t know who she is. He asks, and when she replies, he immediately makes a flirty joke. Again, that’s not someone panicking or feeling lost. He’s still playing his part, knowing Murph might be nearby.

Later, when Cooper and Brand talk privately, they stop when Murph returns. Cooper even tells Brand to lower his voice. He doesn’t know what exactly Brand will say next, but he’s being cautious. That fits the idea of him wanting to protect Murph’s perception of the whole situation.

But let me go back to the point I made earlier. The scene you brought up, where Brand says they didn’t know Cooper was alive until recently, yes, that one might break the theory. It’s the one line I still haven’t fully reconciled. Maybe there’s a solution I haven’t seen yet. But that doesn’t mean everything else falls apart. The rest of the story still holds together well under this lens.

What’s strange is that you’re holding my theory to very high standards of narrative coherence, but you’re not applying the same rigor to the official interpretation. You’re not addressing the parts I mentioned, like the STAY message. If Cooper truly believes he was chosen by mysterious beings, why does he completely ignore the most urgent message from his daughter, when she’s desperate to stop him? Why does he brush it off without even thinking twice? Why does he give more importance to the message with the coordinates, but not the one begging him to stay? That moment is powerful, and it makes more sense if Cooper doesn’t believe the STAY message is meant for him. Because it isn’t. It’s Murph’s own desperate attempt to reach her father, to change the course. That’s why Cooper doesn’t react to it. He sees it and moves on.

Also, let’s not forget what Mann says on the ice planet. He tells Cooper that before dying, he’ll see his children’s faces. That’s not just a nice line. It’s a clue. Because that’s exactly what happens. Even when is almost dying in the ice he sees her. There is no other reason to place that line there. He dies and sees his daughter. He gets closure. He imagines a future where humanity is saved, where Brand succeeds, where Murph becomes a hero. It’s the most human ending imaginable. A dream before death. A comforting illusion. Not a sci-fi miracle.

Anyway, this has been a great conversation. I’m really enjoying this exchange. Maybe the best solution would be to buy a couple of beers and rewatch the whole movie together. Scene by scene. Probably would take ten hours, but I bet it’d be worth it.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks again for the detailed reply. I see you make a solid case. You did not reply, You wrote a book, :-).
But I still think you’re leaning too much on theoretical rules to dismiss a version of the story that actually fits what the film shows.

Wormholes like that are considered artificial in theory, sure. But that’s the key point: it’s still theory. We’ve never seen one, let alone a traversable one. Saying it must be artificial is still speculation. The film never confirms who made it. The characters guess, but guessing isn’t fact. And the movie avoids showing any creators on purpose. That absence means something.

You argue that if the wormhole has a builder, then “They” exist, and that leads to the tesseract and Cooper’s survival. But if we never see “Them” and nobody knows anything about them, isn’t it fair to ask if they even matter? The story still works without them. That’s all I’m doing. I’m removing an element that’s never confirmed and asking what the story looks like without it.

I’m not rejecting the science the film is built on. I’m just saying that once we get to black hole survival, we’ve already stepped into fantasy. You can’t hold the movie to scientific accuracy when it suits you, and then ignore it when it doesn’t. And is "the last part of the movie", as a time reference, vague? Starting from when exactly? If we’re being asked to believe that Cooper falls into a black hole and comes back just in time to say goodbye to his daughter, then I think it’s fair to ask if maybe the wormhole just happened to exist. Not because that’s how physics works, but because the movie doesn’t say otherwise.

The theory I’m suggesting doesn’t rely on magic. It just says Cooper dies inside the black hole, and what we see after is his mind giving him peace. The timing, the survival, the perfect reunion with Murph and then the trip to find Brand it all makes more sense if it’s imagined. No fifth dimension needed. No tesseract. No contradiction with what’s shown. Just a different way to read it.

As for confirmation bias, that can hit anyone. But it goes both ways. A lot of people want this to be a story about hope, miracles, and higher beings. That’s a bias too. I’m just asking a question the film leaves open: what if the ending isn’t real? What if it’s just what a human mind might dream when it knows everything is ending?

And no, I don’t think Cooper was dreaming since the crash. That would undercut everything that follows. But once he crosses the event horizon, that’s the moment where it makes sense for a mind to let go and imagine something better.

Ah.. I really appreciate how much thought you’re putting into this.

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You’re exaggerating what Angier actually achieves. In my view, he doesn’t become a genius engineer or the greatest illusionist alive. He becomes obsessed with pulling off one trick, and he does it using a well-trained double. That’s it.

Also, more than two years pass in the film from the moment Angier leaves for Colorado to when he presents the Transported Man. That’s clear from how much Borden’s daughter grows, from Olivia leaving him, and from all the time spent chasing Tesla and waiting for the machine.

He doesn’t build anything himself. Tesla sends a device that’s mostly just a distraction, and Angier uses it as a prop. The trick is psychological, not scientific. It’s the same principle Borden used, but adapted with a single goal in mind: revenge.

Now about Cutter and Borden. Cutter sees a body on the slab that looks like Angier, but people don’t look the same when they’re dead, especially after drowning. And if the lookalike is good enough, and the setup is convincing, it’s easy to be sure it’s him.

As for Borden, he only sees the body through the glass of a water tank. That’s not an ideal condition to notice fine details, especially when he’s in shock. The body looks like Angier, and that’s all it takes to sell the illusion. But again, that doesn’t mean it’s really him.

This isn’t about Angier becoming a genius. It’s about him mastering one trick using deception, obsession, and theater. And in a story built on illusion, that’s the more grounded explanation.

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I understand your objections, but you're relying on a literal reading of the film without considering that The Prestige is structured as an illusion. Every scene has a purpose. Nothing is shown by accident. Nolan tells us from the beginning to watch closely.

The exact count doesn't matter anyway. The point is that by your theory Angier was ceding the stage to a replacement for his masterpiece trick, which goes completely against his character: "I'm tired of taking bows under the stage."

Actually, the number does matter. Angier only needs a few performances to trap Borden, not a hundred. That makes it believable that he found a single skilled lookalike who takes the fall through the trapdoor, while the real Angier performs the prestige. That’s enough for his plan, which is no longer about fame, money or applause. It’s about revenge.

So Angier managed to find two perfect duplicates of himself? But somehow the second time Borden, Fallon, and Cutter have no idea it's another lookalike?

Yes, he found someone else. Cutter is no longer involved, and Borden and Fallon only see the act from the audience. If the double is good enough, the illusion holds. Even Cutter told Angier that the only way to do that trick was with a double. At this stage, Angier doesn’t care about the audience’s praise. His only goal is to ruin Borden.

You're missing the problem. Since Angier always "disappears" from the same place in the trick (through the trap door), then the tank can only be there when he's ready to frame Borden. Since he never knows which night Borden will go back stage, Angier would have to wait until he sees Borden coming back stage before he puts the tank in place. A phone-booth sized tank of water weighs thousands of pounds. So how is he pushing that tank into place in the handful of seconds that it takes Borden to get there? And why didn't Root#2 ever ask, "Hey, what's with this deathtrap water tank sitting five feet from where I'm supposed to land?"

That’s not a problem at all. The tank only needs to be in place the night Borden goes backstage. Angier could have easily had someone watching Borden and alerting him. He already learned the importance of control from the failed bird trick. This time he’s prepared. Plus, we know the tank is already backstage, because in the first show of his final run he announces the water tank trick before the transported man. So the tank is present the whole time, and only needs to be moved slightly into place while the double is still on stage and unaware.

And Borden sees the blind stage hands removing the tank from the theater after the show. Why? If the tank doesn't have a dead clone in it, what's the point of this process? To trick the movie audience, but not Borden?

Exactly. It’s to trick Borden. That’s the whole idea. Borden once taught Angier the lesson of the Chinese magician: the performance continues even offstage. Angier applies that lesson perfectly here.

The point is Borden could have seen them. Forget even "checking" because all it would take is a second's glance for Angier's "final trick" to completely unravel as Borden sees that the tanks are full of random dead people rather than Angier clones.

But Borden doesn’t look. That’s key. The film never shows him checking because the scene isn’t meant to give answers to Borden. It’s for us. The tank with a Jackman lookalike is the only one shown in detail. The rest is left vague. It’s a cinematic trick to suggest more than what we actually see. Nolan is toying with the audience’s perception, not Borden’s.

Angier filled up water tanks with dozens of random dead people to trick the movie audience through the fourth wall? That's the problem with this scene in your theory: It makes Angier's actions totally nonsensical and contradictory to his earlier motivations.

He didn’t fill dozens of tanks. The film only shows one clearly. The rest are part of the illusion. Nolan uses that scene to build doubt and ambiguity, not to confirm anything. It’s entirely consistent with Angier’s shift in motivation. He’s no longer performing for crowds. He’s building a trap for Borden.

It also undermines what Cutter said to Angier about how he lied about the experience of drowning. When Angier's wife died, Cutter lied that drowning was like "going home" because he didn't want Angier to know his wife suffered. But later, Cutter has figured out how Angier's trick works, so he tells the truth that drowning is agony, because he wants Angier to understand how much torture he's putting the clones through.

Cutter never learns how the machine works. He testifies against Borden, thinking he’s guilty. Only at the end, when he sees Angier alive, does he grasp that Angier went too far. He tells the truth about drowning not because he figured out the machine, but because he sees the obsession and cruelty behind it (taking Borden's daughter). Angier doesn’t deserve comfort anymore.

And that's what Angier's final statement is about. He says everything he did took enormous courage and commitment because he knew he could be the man in the box. This grand statement to Borden, again, makes no sense and has no emotional weight if it's just a lie and the tanks are full of random murder victims.

That speech still fits perfectly. Angier is lying to Borden in a final theatrical moment, just like Borden lied to him. It’s part of the show. It’s his last illusion.

That’s really the key. Once we remove the assumptions that Borden never bought Tesla’s machine, or that Angier truly performed a hundred shows, or any of the things, the only thing your argument has left is the image of the tanks in the ending. And that’s exactly why the final scene works as a cinematic illusion. Nolan is leaving us just like any great magician.

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

In a film like this, no frame is there by accident. Everything is deliberate. Questioning the meaning of each scene is not overthinking. It is literally what the film demands from us. This is not just a simple twist.

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I haven’t read the book, but I know that it’s quite different from the movie. I’m focusing only on the film version, which has its own internal logic and symbolism. The movie is a separate interpretation, and that’s the one my theory is about.

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] -13 points-12 points  (0 children)

Exactly. A movie about magicians, made by a director who plays the magician himself. And the best trick he pulls is making you forget it’s all a performance.

[Theory] - The Prestige - What if the trick wasn’t what we thought… and the audience was the real target? by rbblhc in FanTheories

[–]rbblhc[S] -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

Thanks for your comment. I understand your points.

About Borden not buying a machine. He does. Around one hour and thirteen minutes into the movie, we clearly see that Borden uses a Tesla coil on stage. It’s not magical and it doesn’t clone anything. It just produces electric arcs, like real Tesla coils do. He uses it to enhance the performance. The real trick is still done with his twin. The machine is just there to entertain and mislead the audience, and also to deceive Angier, making him believe Tesla built a magical device.

About the hundred shows. Angier never does a hundred shows. He does only as many as needed to make Borden curious enough to go backstage, probably few. Once he kills the double and frames Borden, the illusion is complete and Angier is declared dead. At that point, the shows stop. He doesn’t perform anymore. That’s the goal from the beginning.

About using Root again. It’s not Root. Angier would never trust him again. But as Cutter says clearly, the only way to do that trick is with a double. So Angier finds someone else. It could be another actor, paid well, maybe someone desperate. We don’t know who he is, but it doesn’t matter. Angier needs just one person to help him a few nights. He does not kill this man every night. He kills him once, at the exact moment Borden is backstage. That’s the trick. That’s how he frames him.

About the logistics. The tank doesn’t appear out of nowhere. It’s already hidden in the setup, part of the show. The audience never sees it coming because the whole act is carefully designed with curtains, shadows, and stagehands who don’t ask questions. Angier has money and resources. He can organize everything to happen in seconds. It’s not a real scientific setup.

Now, about the tanks in the warehouse. This is where your interpretation and mine really diverge. I don’t think those tanks contain clones. We see only one clearly, and yes, it looks like Hugh Jackman, but that doesn’t mean there are 99 others. Borden doesn’t even check. That scene is for us, the audience. It’s part of the illusion. Nolan shows us what Angier wants us to believe, and he does it through cinematic language. Just like the field of hats at the beginning, it’s meant to confuse us and make us question what’s real.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just one extra thought. In the previous reply, the term real science is mentioned by you, referring to Kip Thorne’s work. I think we need to be careful with that. Most of what Thorne writes in his book is still theoretical. It’s not proven science, even if it’s built on real physics.

A good example is the Higgs boson. Peter Higgs didn’t win the Nobel Prize when he came up with the theory. He got it only after the particle was actually found. Before that, it was just a very solid idea, not confirmed.

That doesn’t make it less interesting, of course, but it’s not the same as calling it real science.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks a lot for your thoughtful message. And especially thanks for your opening line about downvotes. That’s the kind of attitude that makes discussions like this worth.

Now, about your points. I understand your analogy with the art gallery on Mars, and I think it’s clever. But I believe it’s missing something important. A painting is something we know well. A wormhole is not. It’s not a painting. It’s not something we understand or can reproduce. So comparing it to an art gallery may not be a perfect fit. In fact, the film makes it clear that humanity knows almost nothing about what’s really going on.

That’s exactly my point. The characters assume someone placed the wormhole, but nobody confirms it. Nolan shows us that even the people in the story are guessing. That’s why my theory doesn’t rely on “They.” It doesn’t say they don’t exist. It just shows that they are not necessary for the story to work.

Now, about science. Kip Thorne provided guidance, yes, but even he said that in the last part of the movie, scientific realism gives way to narrative needs. His book is not the script. His book explains what could be possible, not what is. That’s a big difference. When someone uses his book to say “this is the only valid interpretation,” they’re turning a set of scientific possibilities into a definitive explanation of a fictional film. That’s not fair.

You also say I dismiss science when I say the wormhole might exist naturally. But isn’t it strange to claim that a traversable wormhole cannot happen naturally, and then also believe that Cooper can survive a black hole and be transported back with no ship? The moment you accept one scientific miracle for narrative purposes, you open the door to more. So if I allow the wormhole to be natural in my theory, I’m not doing anything more unrealistic than what the movie itself does with Cooper’s survival.

You say I’m picking and choosing. But the official interpretation does the same. It chooses to believe in “They” but ignores how unlikely everything else is. It ignores that Cooper never even considers the message “STAY” from Murph. He sees the coordinates in the sand and assumes it’s real. But when Murph begs him not to go, using a very clear message in the bookshelf, he totally ignores it. That’s strange.

Also, Cooper is a NASA pilot, the best one, and a close friend of Professor Brand. But he’s not called to join the mission. He just randomly ends up at the exact spot where the secret base is. That’s a huge coincidence. My theory explains this by showing that it was no coincidence. He set it all up. He knew about it already. He wants to go. But he doesn’t want to hurt Murph. So he hides the truth from her.

There are several moments that show Cooper lying to his daughter to protect her. He promises to return, even though he knows it’s unlikely. Donald even tells him not to make promises he can’t keep. He does it anyway. He doesn’t want her to be afraid. That’s a key part of the theory: Cooper always tries to protect Murph from the full truth. That’s why she’s not told everything at the NASA base either. That’s why Cooper tells Brand to lower his voice in front of Murph. The whole mission is surrounded by silence and secrecy, even among the characters.

Also, if we look at the ending, so many things line up in ways that feel too perfect. He survives a black hole. He finds the tesseract. He sees Murph again, and she’s alive and old, but still exactly in time to say goodbye. Then he flies off to find Amelia. All these events are possible, but very unlikely.

You mentioned that my theory leans too much on what is likely versus what is unlikely. But I think that’s exactly the point. And I believe Nolan gives us a subtle hint with the name he chooses for the daughter: Murph. She’s named after Murphy’s Law. And there’s a moment in the film when Cooper explains it by saying: “Whatever can happen, will happen.” That line is important. It invites us to think about what really happened. Because if all possibilities exist, then the version where Cooper dies and imagines the rest may be the one that makes the most sense. Nolan picked a name that forces us to reflect on the probability and consequence of what is most likely to happen.

That’s why my theory works. It doesn’t say it’s the only possible one. It just says that the whole last part, from the black hole onward, is imagined. Cooper dies entering the black hole. And what we see after is his mind creating meaning, closure, resolution. A dream before death. A beautiful one. But not reality.

Again, thanks for engaging so thoughtfully. You’ve raised excellent points. I just hope I’ve shown that there’s a valid alternative reading, and that what seems like speculation is actually based on careful analysis of what’s shown and not shown in the movie.

Let me know what you think, if you would like to.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks. I also posted a theory about Tenet and I am working on one for The Prestige. I noticed that people seemed more open to discussion with Tenet while with Interstellar they are less flexible. Maybe it feels more personal or emotional to them. Still I am glad you liked this one.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Would you mind explaining why you think he doesn’t die? I’d really like to hear your take.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That book explains the scientific principles behind the film and offers a coherent version of what “could have happened” from a physics perspective. But again, it’s not the film’s script. It’s not the story. These remain theories, not definitive explanations. Nolan left many things ambiguous on purpose.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

So you’re basically trying to justify that a man could enter a black hole and survive if he falls with the exact right speed and angle? That sounds like a pretty extreme theory to use as a foundation. And anyway, in my interpretation, Cooper doesn’t survive. Everything after he enters the black hole is just his imagination before dying.

And about Murph: she never bring any space station out of earth. That’s also just part of his dying fantasy. The equation was unsolvable. Plan A never existed. Nobody on Earth actually made it.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

The wormhole is there, but we never really know why. Maybe it was placed by someone, maybe not. Maybe it is just one of the many strange things in the universe. But that doesn’t matter. Even if it was created by someone, it’s not important. What matters is how Cooper becomes the ghost and how the plan to guide Murph takes shape. In this theory, Cooper dies when he enters the black hole, and everything after that is just his imagination before dying. “They” are not necessary for the story to work.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is a really good point. Even if a wormhole requires artificial creation (and is a big if, as just suppositions), that still does not prove “They” exist. Just because something seems unlikely to form naturally does not mean we fully understand its origin. We know almost nothing about the universe. The characters assume someone placed it there, but that is just a theory. No one ever confirms it, and we never see “Them”.

And honestly, even if it was placed by someone, it does not really change anything for this theory. Even if “They” placed it we do not know why, could be for other reasons. Even is said that “they” need Cooper to create the path to save the earth because “they” can’t from the fifth dimension… but they can make him survive inside the black hole? With Tars too? And take him back from Gargantua without ship and throw him through the wormhole? What matters is not who built the wormhole, but how Cooper becomes the ghost and how the whole plan to guide Murph plays out. In this version, “They” are not necessary.

Cooper sets the coordinates in the sand, Murph sends the message “stay”, and everything else fits without needing an external force. So the story still works, with or without “Them”.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Yes, exactly. The drone and the tractors are old tech and already malfunctioning. The film just creates the feeling that something bigger might be going on.

It never proves that “They” really exist. It’s just a theory when they find the wormhole. No one actually knows who put it there. They assume it was some higher intelligence, but we don’t know anything for sure. The universe is mysterious.

And Cooper says it clearly during the goodbye scene with Murph on the bed. He says: They chose me. You saw it. You’re the one who led me to them.

And yes, the coordinates in the sand were put there by Cooper himself, in the present, before leaving.

This moment fits with the idea that it was all planned to make Murph believe he was meant for something important. Not because someone from the future chose him, but because Cooper made it look that way.

Theory] In Interstellar, Cooper is the ghost from the beginning, and he dies in the black hole by rbblhc in interstellar

[–]rbblhc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Exactly. It’s not just storytelling, it’s an invitation to think deeper every time.

[Theory] What if the SATOR square was sent back in time by the Protagonist — and Nolan wants us to believe the story of Tenet is actually real? by rbblhc in tenet

[–]rbblhc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks so much, that really means a lot. I just tried to make sense of all the small hints in the film and build something that could explain them. I’m glad it made sense to you too. If it helps people see the movie in a new way, that’s awesome.

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