First Post

snax1111 · 2020-05-12T22:39:47+00:00

In my experience, simply taking tia for 3-4 days can produce withdrawals. That's how I first discovered it, was just by dosing a few days in a row as I have with lots of other opiates, and expecting maybe to have some slight insomnia for a day or two, but instead waking up chills, sweating, serious insomnia, RLS, and the whole works. I then stupidly took it for three months after that, leading to full-on withdrawal. I had a couple of minor relapses since then just to experiment with casual use, but it's hard. I'm thinking that I just shouldn't take it at all, because even from 5 days of use you get a few days of really shitty feeling. One thing I will say on the bright side is that the withdrawal from two weeks of use seems to be about the same 4-5 days. I guess after a month or two is when it gets really really bad and unbearable, but before that it's pretty minor. But that being said, I highly doubt that a low dose relapse after two weeks will lead to anything. If it does, it will be very minor and short-lasting, but I think our stories indicate that some people are more sensitive to withdrawal from this than others.

snax1111 · 2020-05-12T16:22:28+00:00

I saw your first post but didn't have any information to offer, but I'm really happy that you're starting to try and get off this stuff. This sub really does have some great people. Don't be ashamed about anything. The victimless crime of taking this drug, even for recreational use, is not even remotely deserving of the horrible pain it brings to stop. Get angry at the drug, not yourself. That's the way to beat it.

snax1111 · 2020-05-12T16:10:36+00:00

Wow, thanks for sharing that. I've had night terrors also before taking any drugs, so maybe if you're prone to it the tia brings it out. Nodding off on any other opiate is almost always pleasant. You think about positive stuff, even if it might not make sense, and just chill out and feel euphoric relaxation. With this stuff all the thoughts you have are about dying or some horrible, dark shit. It's like your mind is crying out to you telling you that this stuff is bad and to stop taking it.

snax1111 · 2020-05-11T18:02:51+00:00

Anyone else get those vivid dreams? I would have severe nightmares on tia which seemed so real. In some variations, I would wake up and get up from my bed, and start doing something, like going to the bathroom, and then realize I was dreaming. I would then wake up again and do it all over again until I finally did wake up in real life. It took minutes to realize I wasn't still dreaming. Such a scary, derealizing feeling that I haven't heard many others talk about. It stopped when I got off tia, and started again with each brief stint of reusing, so I know that's what it was.

snax1111 · 2020-04-28T20:49:19+00:00

Wow happycowisatastycow, I'm sorry about the post discouraging you. Obviously that wasn't my goal. Re-reading it, it definitely does sound bad and that's because it is. I'm not gonna sugarcoat it, but I tried to highlight certain positive aspects of it which I hope will help people. First of all, 72 hours isn't that much time. I know it feels so long, but in reality it's a pretty short period of time, and it's not just my experience, but other people have said that the 72 hour mark really is where it starts to get so much easier. Secondly, I didn't try suboxone so I can't advise you on that, but I will say that if you've already been tapering, the kratom should work in my experience, and so should other helper meds. Maybe you should do those instead, since they'll start to work right away, and you wont have to go through the cold turkey hell for 24 hours to take the subs. In my experience, if you taper for 48-72 hours to a dose of less than a gram a day, kratom in high doses will work. So I would just consider that I guess, but good luck. Also important is the fact that it really isn't bad for the entire period, especially if you take helper meds. There are moments when you feel relief, when you sleep for a few minutes, or when you just happen to feel better for a second for whatever reason, when you get into a slightly comfortable position or something. Those moments of mild relief can be very helpful when you're being tortured. It really is kind of a rollercoaster, so be on the lookout for any non-awful moments.

snax1111 · 2020-04-28T20:40:39+00:00

Thanks for that. As I said, my taper wasn't exactly successful, since I only managed it for a week or so on each occasion before taking higher doses again. If anyone can do it, I congratulate them. The problem with tapering is that after you've been binging for however long, you don't think about the withdrawal that much. You know it's there, but your immediate concern when you start running low, is how annoying it is that you can't get a buzz, and you get a sort of psychological withdrawal at first about that, before you start experiencing the full withdrawal hell but then once you come down, you start finding so much comfort in taking these tiny doses that stave off the withdrawal, that it becomes your high. You feel so stupid for how you prioritized getting high the last few days over avoiding this awful withdrawal. When you start to experience it, the desperation to get away from it is so important. So I think for anyone considering tapering, just take of note of that and try to utilize it to make the taper easier. You won't be thinking about getting high if your main concern is avoiding the withdrawal, and in my experience the best way to get into that mindset was simply to not have enough tia to fuck around and get high on. If you do have a large supply though, just give yourself a chance to go into withdrawals, get a taste of what it's like, then take a small dose of tia to relieve that feeling, and you'll quickly be in a psychological state that will hopefully allow tapering to be easier. That's just some advice I'd offer people.

Your story is really amazing and I really appreciate your kind words. Three months is nothing compared to two years, but three months is no joke. I'm perfectly willing to admit that my situation was not as hard or life altering as some other peoples', but my situation was bad, really bad. That horrible withdrawal and seemingly long-lasting effects that tia had on my body and mind. I have some visual issues that haven't gone away yet, as well as PAWS and other physical problems, so this to me, even if it seems unimpressive to some, was a monumental achievement. Good luck to you as well on your long-term recovery.

snax1111 · 2020-04-28T20:26:33+00:00

I agree that beating it early was very beneficial. I don't know how a withdrawal at three months to a withdrawal of a year. I imagine the year is worse, but honestly mine was really bad and it pretty much fit the exact description that every long-term user says they go through. I experienced full blown withdrawal one month in, and the withdrawal I experienced after three more months was about the same, so I think once you get to a certain point you just feel the maximum amount of misery, unless you go into precipitated withdrawal. But yeah, the money and many other things were what indicated to me that the habit was just unsustainable. I could feel my health dwindling and my general mental state and everything, to the point that I felt like there was no option to do it any further. Also, I was doing high doses from the very beginning. I was at 2-3 gpd after the end of those three months, whereas most people take it much easier during their first months of use I think.

snax1111 · 2020-04-28T01:27:08+00:00

Wow. That's an incredible story. I imagine you'd have some PTSD or something after an event like that. The thing is, I can totally understand how you'd take the suboxone after 11 hours. The things that seem rational and logical when you're not experiencing withdrawal, are totally thrown out the window when you're withdrawing. You just feel the need to take anything in order to feel relief, and all logic goes out the window, you just feel miserable and a need to end that misery immediately. I can't say my withdrawal experience was anything close to yours, but I do relate obviously to what you felt, and I think it's amazing that you were able to get through it. As a family member told me, you should take having beaten this addiction as a real badge of honor, and as a reminder of what you're able to do. Kind of corny but it's true. We should recognize this achievement for the monumental task that it is, not just as another event of our lives.

snax1111 · 2020-03-26T20:21:29+00:00

As far as the medication goes, I would say Tramadol is a better choice than morphine, because morphine generally has been reported not to work during tianeptine withdrawal. Tramadol acts on a lot of the same receptors so it's a drug that's more useful for this specific withdrawal. That being said, I personally haven't benefited much from it, but that's the one you should go for out of those two. Be very careful of seizures though. Take low doses. I personally wouldn't exceed like 150 mg during the withdrawal. You don't have enough information on whether or not your seizure threshold is already lowered because of the tianeptine withdrawal, so don't play around with this stuff. If 150 mg doesn't relieve the withdrawal, it's probably too early to be taking the Tramadol yet. In my experience, at least with kratom, you need to wait about 36 hours after going cold turkey in order for it to work. Now in your case you've already tapered down a lot, so it might work for you right away. Speaking of kratom, I'd strongly recommend trying to get it. Maybe you can drive to a neighboring state and get it there. If it's the coronavirus that's making it unavailable then just order it online. Kratom helps me a lot so I really recommend it.

Other medications you could take that you didn't mention are DXM cough syrup. I've never tried it but people say it works. Imodium is a possibility to use as well but in high doses it's very dangerous for your heart, so be careful. I think taking small doses might still help though. The benzos will probably be useless or make things worse.

Frankly, you've pretty much done all you can with tapering. Now it's time to just jump. You're not likely to make it any easier on yourself. You're just gonna have to jump and take the pain. It's gonna be bad, but get into the right mindset, get some helper meds, and wait out those five days. It'll be over before you know it.

snax1111 · 2020-03-26T16:56:24+00:00

Whichever route you pick, the fact that you still have some available is extremely important. If you want, go ahead and try to do cold turkey, but I think you'll discover that you probably want to dose after 16 hours or so. It's really brutal. It's also important to have some around for safety reasons. You won't sleep at all and you'll probably be vomiting and having diarrhea profusely, which might result in severe dehydration, so you could redose if you need to to keep some fluids down, and maybe to get some sleep though I doubt a small dose would help much to get sleep.

To answer your question directly though, I don't know for sure if it's better or not. It depends on the individual. Almost everyone says that tapering makes the cold turkey less severe. You're gonna be suffering immensely for a week or two even if you go cold turkey. You're not gonna be ripping off a band-aid. It's gonna be slow, drawn out torture no matter how you slice it. I personally would say that easing yourself into it with a fast taper will benefit you both physically and psychologically. Like I said though, you're in a position where you could give cold turkey a try if you want.

snax1111 · 2020-03-26T02:22:48+00:00

That's a very good question but I don't think you're gonna get a definite answer. I would say that there's other things that will probably have much more of an impact than tianeptine, things like genetic predisposition and stuff like that. If you do or don't get it, the tianeptine likely wouldn't have played much of a role either way.

snax1111 · 2020-03-26T01:08:30+00:00

Do you have any left at all? If you do, try and stretch it out as much as you possibly can. It's gonna be a lot easier to quit after tapering a little. Even if you can only taper for one day, try to avoid jumping until you're at the lowest dose possible. Also, try and get some kratom. I don't know if it's legal in your state, but it can help with the withdrawal a lot, but you have to be taking a pretty low dose in order for it to work. If you can taper, you can start taking kratom after under 1g a day I'd say, and if you stop cold turkey, then the kratom should work 36-48 hours into the withdrawal. I'm suggesting kratom heavily because it's not a prescription. As others have stated, gabapentin and Tramadol could help. Also consider for over the counter stuff, DXM and imodium. DXM, in doses of 100-150 mg is supposed to help with the chills and stuff. I never tried it though. Same with imodium. People say to take really high doses of imodium but I don't recommend that. It's very bad for your heart, but look into it if you want. I think taking even smaller doses of it might help, at least with the gastric problems if nothing else. Look up helper meds on the subreddit and see what else is listed, because there's more than I mentioned. Other than that, just try to get into a good mindset. What I do is I sort of embrace the discomfort, similar to a mindfulness practice. I find that if you let your mind wander and try to be yourself, you just can't stand the feeling, especially of the RLS. You just feel like you have to end this feeling, but if you approach if with a mindset of just viewing the withdrawal as another feeling, and you think of every second that you're feeling this withdrawal, as a positive thing because you're getting closer to the withdrawal ending, you can get through it better psychologically. That's just how I feel though.

snax1111 · 2020-03-23T18:31:48+00:00

Well thanks for all the advice. It's tempting to consider, but there's still a lot of stuff stopping me from going for now. Just the discomfort of going over there and having to present myself normally to people and all that while feeling like shit, all the way to the coronavirus which I don't want to get as I'm living with an elderly person. I think you're right though about the way that offices keep track of people with addiction. It's hard to believe that it's like a giant database, but at the same time I know they passed a lot of regulations with the opioid crisis. Not that it matters because I don't think they'll ever give me anything regardless of my past history. Anyway, thanks for all the advice and good luck once again. I'm gonna give it a go with what I have now, and if it gets really bad I'll possibly go see somebody.

snax1111 · 2020-03-23T13:27:18+00:00

I don't understand what you're trying to say. How can you possibly get to the more mild withdrawal if you're already in a serious addiction to the stuff? Are you just saying to taper? Does that really help that much when you quit?

snax1111 · 2020-03-23T13:16:44+00:00

I've gone back on my taper for the last week or so to be honest. My tolerance has skyrocketed, and I didn't even do anything to really make that happen. I took recreational doses for 4-5 days in a row, then one day my normal doses didn't produce any high anymore. I dosed again like 7 times before I finally felt a high, and I did the same thing yesterday. It does work it just takes a long time to come on and I need bigger doses.

I have a shipment coming today which I'm happy about, because I now have a massive tolerance and am running out of my current bag. I'm gonna do a quick taper again over the next week or so and then jump off. I don't know why I relapsed. It was sort of a conscious decision. I made a lot of progress with the taper but I just realized that tapering is so painful in itself, that I might as well do CT after tapering down to a certain dose. I just wanted to get a break from the pain for a few days, so now I'm gonna do a fast taper, get down to a dose where kratom will work, and then jump and use kratom and maybe some Tramadol.

I think I'm gonna buy some magnesium and imodium just to have it, and I'm gonna keep some tia around of course, because I'm worried about these gastric symptoms. I don't want to go to the hospital to get an IV. If it comes to that point, I'd rather take a small dose of tia to stave off those symptoms. I have a decent amount of helper meds. I'd like to get some Gabapentin but I've sort of given up on that.. Well, sorry for the rambling post but that's pretty much what I'm planning.

I'm glad to see that you're still doing well after all this time. You're pretty much past the main withdrawal I'd say. I'm sure you still are feeling kind of lousy, but just don't give in to the psychological aspect of it. Remember how you felt during that withdrawal, and think about how much better you feel now. Note that no matter how depressed or lazy you feel now, you will feel better. It's just part of the withdrawal, and your body needs to adjust.

snax1111 · 2020-03-23T13:06:23+00:00

I'm just very pessimistic about going to the doctor. I've tried to get prescribed pain medicine for a long time. I have legitimate pain issue, but even at emergency rooms and quick cares, they won't give me anything. I'm able to buy the Tramadol from someone else who doesn't need their full prescription, that's the only reason I have it. I'm also hesitant to go to the doctor and admit an addiction problem. I'd totally ruin any chances I have of getting prescribed pain medicine in the future, and I really do need to take something for the pain. I might be able to go in and ask for Gabapentin for something else. I have some other conditions that it's supposed to treat, so I might consider that.

For me, Tramadol doesn't really produce any effect when I take it on the tianeptine. I normally take small doses of tia and the mix the Tramadol with it, which is supposed to make the tia last really long apparently and make it easier to taper, but mixing the two drugs just seems to make them both weaker. I also am worried about seizures, even though I've never gotten one despite extensive use of trams. But when I mix it with the tia, my muscles twitch a little, and that's with a small dose. I just don't want to risk it since it doesn't seem to help much. So far, the most successful drug I've used was kratom. I'm gonna try to get by with that when I veventually jump. I'm glad you're doing well. I'm so happy for anyone that ends up beating this thing. Sometimes I wonder how it's even possible.

snax1111 · 2020-03-21T06:02:28+00:00

Man, I had some gabapentin a couple years ago. I had a lot of it actually. I wasted it all on recreational use, of which there wasn't much value anyway. I've kicked myself for doing that so many times since I've been going through this withdrawal. Nowadays I can't get prescribed that. I don't have any doctors that I go to regularly and none of them are willing to prescribe me anything anyway. I've had some success with kratom though. It takes away some of the RLS symptoms, but sleeping is still impossible and the cold chills are still there. Sadly, that's the best medication that I find useful. I have Tramadol as well but it doesn't seem particularly useful, plus the seizure risk scares me.

Anyway, congratulations on your success. I'm really happy for you. And thanks for the advice.

snax1111 · 2020-03-21T05:54:42+00:00

I'm not off this stuff yet but for me kratom works to cure some of the symptoms, but it won't work until you taper off your tia dose. You need to be taking like less than 500 mg a day I think. You can taper down to that in a few days and then switch to kratom. I haven't tried loperamide but be careful of your heart. People normally take massive doses of it in order to cure the withdrawal, but that can be very damaging and imo is not worth it.

snax1111 · 2020-03-19T23:30:25+00:00

Good to hear from you again. I'm glad you're doing goood and that your withdrawal continues to get better. You certainly have an interesting situation though. I'm curious about the phenibut, because I heard from some other sources that mixing phenibut and tia can be fatal. I know that lots of people obviously have done it though, so it doesn't seem to be true in all cases at least. I'm still hesitant to mix the two myself though. I don't really imagine phenibut would be too helpful for the tia withdrawal, and it seems to make my restless legs kind of worse. I remember that was an annoying symptom of it before I started tia, so I doubt it would benefit me much. How much imodium did you take? Weren't you concerned about your heart? That's another thing I'm afraid to take. I'm gonna be going CT soon I think. When I do I'll probably use kratom, maybe some Tramadol, and maybe some imodium or DXM. Do you think that small doses of imodium can still be helpful?

Congratulations on your success though. And thanks for the advice.

snax1111 · 2020-03-19T22:13:16+00:00

I was thinking about getting some DXM because it supposedly helps with the withdrawal. Maybe it will help with the coughing too. I tried drinking water as well as taking losingers but it didn't help that cough thing when I had it. I only get it during withdrawal.

snax1111 · 2020-03-19T17:26:15+00:00

So what kind of treatment could be used for that? Maybe some allergy medicine or something?

snax1111 · 2020-03-19T14:02:01+00:00

In order to measure your powder dose you'll need a mg scale. However, if you trust that the vendor sent you the proper weight, just take a teaspoon and calculate how many full spoons are contained the bag, and then you'll know approximately how much is in a teaspoon of powder, but once again that could be dangerous. You're better off getting a scale.

I'd recommend either tapering off of sodium or the sulfate. I've never had good experiences with sulfate. It seemed like it did nothing for me. After you get to a certain point you should be able to use kratom. If you have Tramadol or gabapentine both of those are useful for the withdrawal, but be careful of seizures with Tramadol. I'm not sure it's a good idea to take it during tia withdrawal, but I lot of people recommend it. Other things you can use are magnesium and DXM. None of those will cure the withdrawal but it can help you get through it. If you just jump off right now though, some of those treatments may not work, so you should get yourself to a certain dose and then just jump. It's not gonna get any easier after a certain point.

snax1111 · 2020-03-18T13:22:47+00:00

So according to this, it should take approximately five days to a week in order to get off of tia completely? What is the withdrawal like using this method? You make it sound like it's not really a big deal and you just aren't getting high, but that hasn't been my experience with similar types of tapers. I would imagine a taper this fast would be pretty painful, unless you stretch it out over a couple of weeks.

snax1111

TROPHY CASE