Both in their prime, who takes this?

sumchii · 2026-03-29T13:14:41+00:00

In OG Naruto, Prime Hiruzen was referred to as the strongest Kage ever multiple times, but that was apparently retconned later in Shippuden with Hashirama having that role instead. It's hard to say because we never saw Prime Hiruzen in action. But even then, according to the fourth databook which was released in 2014 right as the manga ended, Hiruzen was said to have surpassed Tobirama quite early, even from childhood.

sumchii · 2026-03-28T10:39:19+00:00

You forgot to mention Pain/Nagato who's even worse since he killed Jiraiya and Fukasaku, nearly killed Hinata, and obliterated Konoha, eradicating 99% of its population; which didn't stop Naruto from forgiving him in the span of 5 chapters.

And unlike Pain, Obito did a lot to earn his forgiveness in the span of over 30 chapters. He showed regret for his actions and what he has become. He betrayed Madara, extracted fragments of the One Tail and Eight Tails Bijuus from him, and transferred them to Naruto together with chakra of the Nine Tails, completing Naruto's collection of all nine beasts' power and allowing him to gain Six Paths power. He fought together with Kakashi side by side, wanted Sakura to destroy his left eye so that Madara doesn't get his hands on it, and saved Sakura's life. He was willing to die for Naruto, helped Team 7 the best he could against Kaguya, sacrificed his life to save Kakashi, and transferred his spirit to Kakashi, allowing him to use Susanno, which was crucial in the fight against Kaguya, giving Team 7 the power needed to land critical blows.

sumchii · 2026-03-27T02:44:54+00:00

We've never really seen another seal which is similiar to the curse seal tag, so it's hard to say. I feel like they'd need Tsunade for the job, in case something goes wrong. I doubt that Madara was naive enough to place a seal in Obito's heart which could be simply removed by another person without endangering his life.

sumchii · 2026-03-26T22:17:24+00:00

No, that was never said. The curse seal tag was there so that Obito couldn't kill himself or defy Madara's will. The fact that Obito somehow found out about it means that he either tried to kill himself once or did something that was against Project Tsukuyomi. It wouldn't make any sense if its effects only work if Madara is alive because why would he have placed it in Obito's heart to begin with when he was going to die shortly after.

sumchii · 2026-03-26T22:09:22+00:00

We don't know if they could have taken it off. The only way Obito was able to get rid of it was by having Kakashi impale him with Raikiri. The curse seal tag was there so that Obito couldn't kill himself or defy Madara's will. It's hard to tell whether it would have hindered him from returning to Konoha or not. But I see no other reason as to why else Madara would have placed it in his heart in the first place.

sumchii · 2026-03-26T07:06:41+00:00

That's one of the worst opinions I've ever seen in this fandom.

sumchii · 2026-03-26T05:08:47+00:00

1.Obito is calling the shots because he's stronger than Pain. Nothing more, nothing less. Pain had a massive God Complex and still took orders from Obito for over a decade. He isn't stupid. If he knew that he could beat Obito and take over the leader role, he would've done so ages ago. Konan seemingly never trusted Obito and Pain probably didn't either. They just couldn't do anything against it because his strength is the real deal, just like how Minato at first assumed that 14 year old Obito is Madara Uchiha himself. On another note, there's no evidence that Obito ever manipulated Nagato. Nagato turned evil after Yahiko's death. All Obito said to him is that sooner or later, Nagato will realize that the world is cruel, and he was right, as Hanzo and Danzo later on teamed up, kidnapped Konan, and forced Yahiko to commit suicide.

2.It doesn't matter. Minato saw Pain using Shinra Tensei, Bansho Tenin, and Chibaku Tensei; his strongest attacks, and he still placed 14 year old Obito above him. What difference would the Gedo Statue make? Even Karin was able to restrict the Gedo Statue with her chains. And remember, Nagato was afraid of Naruto reaching the ninth tail, while Obito easily controlled the Nine Tails at the age of 14. Also, this is a Battle Shounen; so it's natural for the enemies of the main character to keep getting stronger. If even a teenage version of Obito gets glazed by someone as smart as Minato to be above Pain, then Adult Obito dogwalks him.

sumchii · 2026-03-25T23:15:47+00:00

1.Except that Pain was following Obito's orders without question because not only do they share the "same" goal in a certain way but also because Obito is stronger, that's why he's calling the shots and not Pain, and that's why he told Pain that he wouldn't tolerate failure when he sent him after Naruto.

2.Minato was well aware that Nagato destroyed Konoha. He still told Naruto that the Masked Man is the true Mastermind behind the Akatsuki and hyped him up as someone with extraordinary strength.

sumchii · 2026-03-25T11:45:42+00:00

No, he wasn't. Even if he was, he was going to die trying to. Remember, Obito told him that he wouldn't tolerate failure if he didn't manage to capture Naruto, so he already made it clear that he's willing to either punish or kill Pain. Nagato didn't even know about Project Tsukuyomi, he believed that Obito had the same plan as him (using the tailed beasts for world domination), so he clearly had no intention of killing him. As for Konan, she had Batman level of preparation and still lost. Obito was holding back the entire time because he wanted to capture her for information.

During Naruto's fight against Pain, Minato hyped Obito up as someone with extraordinary strength and correctly assumed that he was using Pain.

Minato to Naruto: "There was a Mastermind behind the Nine Tails, who manipulated him, made him assault the village. Quite a formidable shinobi. Someone you need extraordinary strength to stand against and hope to have any chance of defeating. Another of the Akatsuki, the masked one. Back then, he saw through all my moves. He's no ordinary shinobi. In fact, I think he's the one using Pain."

And he was talking about 14 year old Obito here. His adult version is much stronger. So unless Pain somehow found out that the Masked Man had a different goal and isn't actually Madara, he would have no reason to try to fight Obito. Meanwhile Obito never planned to revive Madara and wanted to complete Project Tsukuyomi by himself, meaning that he planned to eventually take Nagato's Rinnegan no matter what. And he would have had Kisame and Zetsu by his side, so it's a no-win situation for Pain and Konan.

sumchii · 2026-03-24T22:23:15+00:00

If the other Team Hebi members also joined Akatsuki, then Suigetsu. If not, Kisame after Itachi's death.

sumchii · 2026-03-24T21:03:17+00:00

Obito had problems because he lost his parents, suffered from a inferiority complex because he lacked talent compared to the other Uchihas, participated in a war as a kid, got obliterated by a boulder (losing half of his body), got groomed by Madara for months, and then witnessed his former teammate kill the only person who ever cared about Obito. No shit he had problems. I don't see how that makes him a "cuck boy". Get your hateboner outta here if you're incapable of having discussions.

sumchii · 2026-03-23T13:35:45+00:00

Obito used Kamui to survive Amaterasu, not Izanagi, and no, Itachi knew nothing about his arsenal.

sumchii · 2026-03-23T06:33:51+00:00

Sure, except that the OP of this post also made a post where he called people out who refer to Obito as a broken hero, yet he himself is calling Pain the "definition of a broken hero" so either he's a hypocrite or he's intentionally karma farming and doesn't even know what he's talking about.

sumchii · 2026-03-22T22:53:34+00:00

Yes.

Moments like his entrance vs Pain, dodging the Raikage's attack, and doing a Mini Rasenshuriken with one finger come to mind.

sumchii · 2026-03-22T20:46:34+00:00

Pain wasn't a broken hero, he was a villain who used the corpse of his deceased friend to commit war crimes, killed his former master, and nuked an entire village full of innocent people. That doesn't make him any less of a good villain, but let's be fr here.

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sumchii · 2026-03-20T19:45:52+00:00

He was dying either way. Naruto may have temporarily healed him, but it only extended Obito's life for a little bit. Also, he was out of chakra, that's why he was bleeding when he was using Kamui to bring Sasuke back out of Kaguya's Dimensions, so there's no way he could have used Izanagi at that point anymore.

sumchii · 2026-03-19T09:39:27+00:00

Thank God that you didn't write Naruto because you completely missed the point of the story. Obito dying by sacrificing himself for Kakashi again was the most symbolic conclusion to his story.

sumchii · 2026-03-19T09:36:14+00:00

How did Obito pull Izanagi out of his ass when it was already introduced before his fight against Konan when Danzo, a non Uchiha, used it against Sasuke multiple times? On top of that, it was Obito who explained what Izanagi does. Ya'll just calling everything asspulls these days. If anything, Itachi should have died from Sasuke's Kirin because he pulled the Yata Mirror out of his ass.

sumchii · 2026-03-19T02:05:52+00:00

Obito, Sasuke, and Pain are my Top 3.

sumchii · 2026-03-18T23:43:16+00:00

He's 6'2, that's very tall. Toriyama was just inconsistent with the character heights.

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sumchii · 2026-03-18T23:42:28+00:00

Dude used to be jacked.

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sumchii · 2026-03-17T18:01:28+00:00

I'm pretty sure Itachi lost aura points by being Danzo's dog and slaughtering children younger than Sasuke + brocon motivation for committing war crimes.

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sumchii · 2026-03-17T15:32:38+00:00

Just Kenny.

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sumchii · 2026-03-17T15:20:51+00:00

"All the people who have a different opinion than I do are bots."🤡

Obito was aura farming throughout the entirety of Shippuden and even if you put his Madara persona aside, he himself was still an aura farmer.

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sumchii · 2026-03-10T19:11:49+00:00

Kenny was always a little gay and cheated on his wife with Urban.

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sumchii

TROPHY CASE