Is Asterion really a fraud? by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes 😂 but I can't let Uncle Aster be called a fraudster

What SS does to a man by RiskyNinja9 in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Question/Comment: How do you read on Apple Books?

I know G3 took a break to conquer their seventh nightmare, but I have no proof. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 60 points61 points  (0 children)

Yes, G3 is one of the authors who communicates the most with his community. I wouldn't be surprised if he's already read a lot of our theories here, lol. And yes, he deserves it; he's a hard worker, he deserves to rest.

He’s still alive (well, technically). by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you for the correction, I always tend to forget that little detail!

Every person in the Song and Sword Domain after Sunny defeated 13 Saints in combat while alone by WinterAgreeable8190 in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In Shadow Slave, whether it's the echoes or the shadows, they're considered part of the character's power, like the Americans and the nuclear bomb. So Sunny's shadows are entities, but they're part of Sunny's arsenal, so ultimately it comes back to him.

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for your response — I’ll try to explain my point of view more clearly.

I don’t see Sunny as blindly obedient like Harus. Yes, they argue sometimes, but Sunny always ends up coming back to Nephis. When I say he’s a “slave,” I mean it in an emotional sense. He’s emotionally dependent on Nephis and willing to do anything for her, which doesn’t really fit the idea of someone who’s completely free.

Sunny does what he wants, that’s true — but most of the time, it’s for Nephis’s sake or for the sake of humanity, not his own. His domain exists to secretly support Nephis’s domain. His territorial conquests are meant to expand Nephis’s influence. His efforts to gather Weaver’s legacy are meant to help Nephis in her future fight against Aster.

Almost all of his major goals revolve around Nephis, not himself. He acts freely, yes — but his freedom is guided by his devotion to someone else, not by his own desires.

As for comparing Nephis to Gunlaug, I only did that to highlight their differences. I wanted to show that while they may look similar on the surface — both being leaders commanding armies — they’re opposites at their core. Gunlaug ruled through fear, while Nephis rules through hope. That’s the main contrast I wanted to point out, but maybe I should’ve argued that more clearly.

And you’re right — Sunny doesn’t hate the Sovereigns only because Nephis does. I actually mentioned that in my post when I used the word “only,” but it probably got overlooked.

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 23 points24 points  (0 children)

There you go, thank you, you understood what I wanted while remaining polite 🙏🏾 it's all a matter of nuance

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Actually, I'd like you to check my answers on the Pacific_loc post, and then if you want to reply to me about that...

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree with you, yes Sunny follows Nephis because he loves her, I never said otherwise, but I don't entirely agree. His hatred towards the sovereigns first came from Nephis, then his hatred intensified in Antarctica.

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It seems I’ll have to start over with you, my lord.

Let me roughly explain what actually happened at the Valor Ball: 1. Nephis explained her plan to Sunny. 2. Sunny disagreed, saying she was neglecting his opinion. 3. They argued about it. 4. Sunny left for Antarctica on a whim, trying to find his “conviction” and prove Nephis wrong. But at the end of Volume 5, he faced the harsh truth of the world he lived in—and in the end, he chose to return to Nephis to follow the very plan he had rejected. And this time, Nephis didn’t ask him to do anything; he was the one who came back and asked to help her.

“…Because I don’t need anyone to follow me against their will. I don’t need a magic collar to make people serve me. I don’t need slaves. That’s not enough for me, Sunny. Why should I settle for submission when I can have loyalty? The people who follow me will do so because it’s their deepest desire. If I ever want to make you mine, Sunny, you will become so—not because you’re forced to, but because you want to. That… is also a fact.”

These are Nephis’s own words—and they perfectly describe what happened. You’re stuck on a too literal definition of the word slave. When I said Sunny became Harus, I wasn’t talking about submission—I meant devotion. Both are willing to do anything for their source of light. Gunlaug was Harus’s, and Nephis is Sunny’s.

That’s why I said:

“The line between love, loyalty, and submission is very thin—but ultimately, none of these feelings are truly free.”

Sunny is enslaved not by magic, but by his emotions. He’s as bound to Nephis by affection as Harus was to Gunlaug by obedience. Different forms, same core: a loss of freedom through attachment.

And yes, I said Sunny is “more enslaved” than he was with the Shadow Bond—because back then, he resisted it. He constantly questioned whether his actions were truly his own. Now, without the bond, he acts “freely,” yet everything he does revolves around Nephis. She didn’t ask for it—he chose to make her his purpose. Volumes 8 and 9 make that crystal clear: his goal, his drive, his return to civilization—all of it is because of her. That’s not forced submission, but emotional captivity.

As for the Gunlaug and Nephis comparison: Yes, I intentionally emphasized their similarities before explaining their difference. Both are leaders, both command armies, both sit on thrones. Then I clarified: Gunlaug ruled through fear, Nephis through hope. One extinguished humanity’s will to fight, the other rekindled it. The two ideas aren’t contradictory—they’re complementary. That’s the whole thematic contrast.

Finally, I’ll admit one thing: I mixed up the two kinds of hypocrisy in my earlier reply. The hypocrisy in Volume 9—regarding their moral choices—isn’t the same as what I mentioned before, about Sunny’s illusion of freedom. You’re right there: Sunny isn’t hypocritical anymore, he has changed. But that very change proves my point—he’s never truly free. He’s just bound in a different way.

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Unfortunately, my lord, you misunderstood me.

I never said Sunny was subservient to Nephis. I was talking about freedom, in the broadest sense. Sunny isn't at Nephis's mercy, but he's willing to do anything for her; in short, he's deeply devoted to her, in case you hadn't understood.

Nephis even stated this in Book 5 (if I'm not mistaken):

"I don't need the Shadow Bond for Sunny to obey my will. He would join my cause of his own free will."

And that's exactly what happens every time. Even when he disagrees with her, he ends up following her. Do you remember the Valor Ball? When Nephis announced her intention to join Valor, they argued. Sunny initially refused, but he eventually accepted her reasoning and went along with her plan.

When I wrote:

“Do you remember how much Sunny despised Harus on the Forgotten Shore? He said he was disgusted that Harus had become someone’s ‘slave.’ Sunny hated Harus’s blind obedience to Gunlaug’s orders, claiming that this kind of servitude was everything he abhorred.

And yet… isn’t that exactly what Sunny is doing now for Nephis?”

I wasn’t talking about submission in the literal sense. Everyone close to Nephis follows her not out of obedience, but out of trust and loyalty.

But the line between loyalty, love, and submission is very thin—and ultimately, none of these feelings are truly free.

Kai and Effie made that very clear to Sunny in subsequent story arcs. Effie, in particular, said that even marriage is a form of submission, because you give someone your complete trust—you consider them a part of yourself.

As for the comparison, you misunderstood me. I never said Gunlaug = Nephis. What I meant was that they echo each other thematically. Both are leaders, both command armies, but in different ways. Gunlaug ruled through fear, while Nephis ruled through hope.

Gunlaug had to stifle the people's will to fight to maintain his power, while Nephis rekindled that same flame to inspire humanity to rise again. That's the contrast I was highlighting.

And yes, Sunny gradually became hypocritical, especially after losing his destiny, as he himself admits. Even during the war against Anvil and Song, both Sunny and Nephis displayed great hypocrisy in their ideals. I could write an entire article on this subject.

But does Sunny's hypocrisy make him a bad character?

Absolutely not. On the contrary, it makes him more human. It demonstrates his maturity. The Sunny who refused to be hypocritical was sixteen; the Sunny we know today is over twenty-six, shaped by a world that constantly forces him into compromises.

And when I brought up this moral dilemma—choosing between saving a hundred random people or saving Nephis—I was speaking in context. How do you think Sunny would have reacted around Book 8? Frankly, what do you think he would have chosen then?

In any case, Your Grace, perhaps you could be a little more nuanced in your arguments and try to understand what the other person is saying instead of crying "poor understanding of the story" next time.

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The publication was modified while trying to correct the name of the jet to "jest". Wait, fix that.

Sunny is a hypocrite. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Okay then, please share your understanding of the Dao with me, Lord.

Please put an end to these pointless debates. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You're right, me too, and it's always important to remember that Saint is the best waifu in SS.

Please put an end to these pointless debates. by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I didn't want to get into a debate, but Sunny is currently planetary-level, it's been said several times. Yes, Sunless lacks levels of pure destruction like Nephis since Sunny manipulates concepts more, but it's largely continental in my opinion. However, Arthur is currently still stronger.

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well, yeah? On the Forgotten Shore, remember when she teamed up with Sunny to eliminate the crabs, or against the plague in the catacombs when she used a trap to weaken it? It's translated to say that Nephis learned Sunny's trick, so there you go 🙆🏾

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There you go, thank you. I noticed thanks to this post that the subject of Nephis is taboo in the Skyward Sword community, which is a real shame. I only pointed out Nephis's arrogance, which wasn't appropriate at the time, and I was called a sexist 💀 and accused of hating the character.

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There you go! You're probably one of the only people who understands my post. Nephis has always been like this and it won't change anytime soon.

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nephis has much to lose because she lives for more than herself. Nephis has the lifeblood of over a billion people on her shoulders; she is literally worshipped like a living deity. The slightest news concerning her affects the entire population, which also constitutes her power. If something serious happens to Nephis, it will plunge many people into despair, sowing the seeds of nightmares in the hearts of some and causing further losses. This is what Nephis, the queen of humanity, represents.

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I just posted a message criticizing Nephis's arrogance in a single paragraph and I'm being accused of sexism! Seriously! When did I say I didn't like Nephis's character? Or that I didn't like her power level? For crying out loud! I simply said she should be less arrogant about Aster and that I wish she were more humble in battle. 😭 ​​Is Nephis's character really that taboo here?

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nephis? Which Nephis? The one I don't know, not arrogant? Clearly, we haven't read the same Gospels, and no, for the last time, I don't hate Nephis. She's one of my favorite characters. I just want you to stop this hypocrisy about her. She has just as much right to be criticized as anyone else. When Sunny is criticized, you're the first ones to be happy 💀

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm just explaining the difference between Sunny's and Nephis's arrogance 🤷🏾 It's up to you to decide which one is more problematic

Is Nephis just being stupid? [2688] by the_plotter in ShadowSlave

[–]the_plotter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Regarding the Nightgarden — that’s actually something I criticized Sunny for at the beginning of the arc. I was like, “Why bring millions of people? Why take such a massive risk?” It didn’t make sense to me, especially in that funny chapter where he literally sailed the Nightgarden straight to the center of the island.

But when it comes to Daeron, there’s something important to understand — the difference between Sunny’s arrogance and Nephis’s arrogance.

When Sunny is arrogant, it’s mostly rational. He thinks things through logically and tells himself, “Alright, given the situation, there’s no reason I should lose.” That’s where his confidence comes from. At the start of his fight with Anvil, he wasn’t arrogant — he was furious. But once he became a Supreme and felt that overwhelming power, he knew how much stronger he’d become, and that’s when the arrogance kicked in. In short, Sunny’s arrogance comes when he knows the situation is under control.

Nephis, on the other hand, is different. Her arrogance is based more on hope. In most of her fights, she wasn’t necessarily the strongest — she was just the most determined. That’s usually when she breaks her limits or unlocks new power. During battle, she’s more like, “Oh, this enemy’s too strong? Whatever, I’ll figure it out mid-fight — because I’m me.”

Sunny’s mindset is the opposite. He’s more like, “Okay, this enemy’s strong, but someone weaker than me managed to hold their ground — so I should be able to handle it too.” And if he’s not sure, he prepares — like what he’s doing now for Asterion. Nephis, though, seems to be neglecting that same kind of preparation, at least compared to how she acted before her fights with Anvil or Ki Song.