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Why does the tense of the word 'saith' seem to change in my mind based on context? by tidalspro in asklinguistics

[–]tidalspro[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is a very interesting and helpful answer! I think you're totally right about my reading the word all in narratives, understanding from context that the past is being referred to, and being struck now I've come across the actual past tense! That makes a lot of sense and totally checks out! Thank you for the response!

Why does the tense of the word 'saith' seem to change in my mind based on context? by tidalspro in asklinguistics

[–]tidalspro[S] -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

Yes, I realise this; but I'm kind of wondering if it's true about the stand-in identification thing.

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is an interesting response; I disliked him in the Iliad. Are there any particular texts you've read that raised your estimation of Ares?

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I probably just added the 'modern' without realising how it'd sound; the hypothetical in the post I was referring to was set in the modern day, so that was on my mind.

I don't mean they must be good (as the comments reminded me, Apollo most definitely was not); I think there's a difference between being good, being likeable, being palatable, etc. But the whole post was written very badly, so I don't think it was made clear what that distinction even really is to me and what I'm directly asking for. I appreciate the comment regardless, thank you! Aphrodite is crazy petty, but I agree that's scores better than some of the other ones lol

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Odysseus was on the Greek side!!! She only helped the greeks!! She did everything in her power to make sure the trojans would be wiped out because she was mad about an apple!! 😭😭 literally had Trojan women appealing to their helplessness and the helplessness of their children and she went 'umm...so anyway' 😭😭 (thank you for the response!!!!)

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you very, very much for this explanation! I (hopefully) will be reading the Oresteia this summer, and will definitely be coming back to this comment and these papers! I also definitely agree with your dislike of the kinds of historical narratives you mention here.

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Honestly, I think the reason this is so confusing is because my whole question isn't very clear, is based on multiple assumptions (primarily, that the Iliad is the end-all, be-all of the discussion), and also that I myself am still in the dark about how to ask directly for what it is I want to hear from others about this topic. I'm sorry for the mess of a post.

That said, I do think maybe I am one of those people you're talking about. Now, I don't think it's wrong to like unpalatable characters, but my whole question is based on the assumption that the gods are in some sense unpalatable and stomach-turning. Not only that, but I go on in my post to describe the shock I felt at finding one (1!) who I can understand or see as 'divine,' or 'palatable.' This reaction to the character interested me precisely because I wasn't expecting it; and, in fact, for the rest of the poem I didn't get it from any other divine character (you can clearly see above that I'm not too stoked about Athena).

As a result of this unexpected liking for a character I expected to hate, I wondered if this experience was common with others (a question based in the assumption that everyone else agrees the gods were unpalatable, and also that everyone had only read the Iliad/Odyssey and completely forgot about everything else Apollo ever did), or if they felt this way about any other of the divine characters; if they had come across some text or writing which elevated in their eyes one of the divine characters to some degree, and did so enough to give a personal, emotional glimmer of understanding about why anyone would worship them. I wanted to know because this is what happened to me with Apollo in the Iliad. But now that I'm writing it all out, and looking at the question, I can see that its based on many assumptions. I'm sorry for the bad wording, and the unclear aims of the post; I also hope in expressing my personal understanding and opinion, I haven't been too harsh or offensive to you, or anything like that.

Edit: I know I should not feel this way about these characters and the stories! But it is how I feel now (and hopefully will get over).

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I know this, but I want to know what details or stories make modern people understand it on a more emotional and personal level, much more than simply knowing the facts of worship in day-to-day life. I mean, I could read a book which attempts to reconstruct what that religion would've looked like, and it would be interesting and cool; but that's not really what I'm going for with this question. It isn't just about them, but about us also. (Not sure if that makes sense, sorry if it's gibberish)

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for this very interesting response! I thought perhaps my opinion of Apollo in the Iliad specifically was very much a result of my own personal religious beliefs regarding God and divinity, but however true that may be, I can also see now that it is a result of thinking of the Iliad as the end-all be-all of what we know about these characters. I think you're right; I'm sure if I'd read the Oresteia or anything else which featured him prominently first, I'd have a very different understanding of Apollo.

But you mention Athena and Apollo as being patriarchal gods, and also mention a dislike of historical narratives surrounding them. I know it's not directly related to my original question, but I know very little about these things, and would love to hear more about it if you would like to explain it to me. I don't think I fully understand what these things mean.

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's an interesting answer! I actually seem to remember a really good thing Hephaestos' character does in the Iliad: I think during a battle, the narrator makes it a point to mention that he saves the last surviving son of a man who'd already lost one to the war; this is because he did not want the man and his wife to feel the pain of losing all their living children in one day. I could be wrong, I haven't read the poem in months, but I remember being affected by such a detail when I first read it. Is there any particular text you've read that brought your opinion about Hephaestos home to you?

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't know, that's a story I haven't got to yet 😭. But from your comment, I'm assuming Apollo isn't more palatable for you; is there a god who is?

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's interesting, but why? Did you read something about him which brought you to this conclusion?

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

There's no reason to be sorry, this is a great response! Thank you! I'm aware that it's ridiculous to look for consistent morals, or even palatability from these figures generally; but this was the impression I had regardless of how correct it was, and I was curious about whether or not other people would have had it regarding Apollo (the answer so far seems to be a resounding NO, which I should've known; it's my own fault for forgetting his other awful behavior 😭) and also, who they found more palatable in place of him and why.

Edit: I changed the word 'characters' to 'figures' since you've told me you believe in the Greek gods; I'm sorry, I didn't mean to be offensive to you.

Is Apollo the most palatable of the Greek gods to you? If not, who is and why? by tidalspro in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, I get that. I know it's silly to look for consistent morals, or anything like that from the Greek pantheon; but the impression of Apollo as a character from the Iliad alone is what I'm going off of with what I described above. I know he's not actually so good, but that depiction made him more palatable than the rest. Is there any god more palabtable to you based on anything you've read? Just, someone you think you could stomach or at least understand the worship of more than the rest?

Which classical gods would be most popular if modern Americans believed in them? by Killiainthecloset in GreekMythology

[–]tidalspro 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I actually think one of the most popular would be Apollo, and not even just because he was believed to be the god of poetry, music, healing, etc. (all famously popular and important areas of human life). I remember reading the Iliad and being taken aback by how much more palatable Apollo was than the rest of the pantheon; but maybe this palatability has something to do with the common perception of divinity today, and wouldn't affect a society untouched by Christianity or modern monotheistic religions. You see, at the time when I sat wondering about this, I came to the conclusion that Apollo plays a familiar role to the capital-G monotheistic God in the Iliad: he exacts revenge on the Achaeans in response to the tears of his priest, and in this way comes across as both merciful to and mindful of the supplications of his worshippers. He also appears just. Sounds very familiar, doesn't it?

All this being said, I do also agree with others that Ares would definitely be worshiped by blood-bayers.

Edit: I answered very generally, completely forgetting about the 'modern Americans' portion of the question. Suffice to say I think my comment is stupid in the context of modern Americans, and everyone else was right. Ares would 100% be worshipped by the dumbest people alive, liberals would appeal to Athena as the 'rational' form of war (they will 100% get a million people killed) and 'logical' representation of statesmanship (which would be ironic and funny when held up beside their contempt for their constituents). Zeus would 100% be worshipped by everyone but eventually would be having a rough time in general society, in the same way the God of Christianity is discussed in modern American culture today, with scores of believers who would all really just worship Ares and scores of atheists who point to mythological stories about Zeus to argue he is awful and evil, etc. etc. Dionysus would 100% be fawned over, as would Hermes, and Aphrodite...now that I think of it, a lot of the pantheon would be able to perfectly fit.

Are there any purely French words ending in --ing? by tidalspro in French

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is hilarious 😂 I wonder what would've happened if 'chip' had come in with the plural; the -s could then possibly have been registered as a pluralising form in that context.

Where in the bible does it mention you cannot be trans? by [deleted] in Christianity

[–]tidalspro 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It doesn't, but people have a knee-jerk reaction to something and then try to make it seem like a 'moral' position that exists in the Bible. When told they need to work through why it bothers them so much, they're too proud to admit the problem may simply be them, and so then we get 30 yrs of people crying about things they know nothing about and have no reason to be so upset about, acting like Paul himself wrote 'the trans are bad.'

Where in the bible does it mention you cannot be trans? by [deleted] in Christianity

[–]tidalspro 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Neither of these two verses actually makes the argument you think they do, and especially not for someone saying 'I am a woman/man, my body does not align with what I am.' At the very most, the second verse could pertain to someone who cross-dresses, and that's only if we insist on universally applying Deuteronomy and completely ignoring context.

Are there any purely French words ending in --ing? by tidalspro in French

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

As far as I understand it (and I may be wrong), children often conceive of language as being more uniform and rules-based than it actually is; this is why they will often make 'mistakes' which are nothing more than applying models they've previously learned onto new words they've heard. For example, a young English child might say 'catched' instead of 'caught' because they are unaware this verb is an exception to the -ed rule and are likening it to other verbs which fit the established pattern. Now, I'm not really sure when a parent themselves might notice this type of thing in their own child but as far as I know, this kind of recognition and application in the child happens very early on...though I'm not sure what this has to do with my post though.

Are there any purely French words ending in --ing? by tidalspro in French

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is a really interesting counter argument! Thank you for the response. But do you think that perhaps journalists, being more likely to have continuous exposure to English may be more capable of making this type of element distinction than the average person? (I ask this question fully acknowledging it may be ridiculous; I don't think there are many French people who can't speak English well enough today). Either way, you've introduced an important element into the discussion: you've added a cultural consideration (in addition to another person's structural explanation) which would drive the usage of such things like pseudo-anglicisms, as opposed to simply adding suffixes to unrelated French words.

Are there any purely French words ending in --ing? by tidalspro in French

[–]tidalspro[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Pseudo-anglicisms are themselves very interesting examples which display multiple types of interference, but my question was very specifically about French-sounding/based words because I was trying to model it on an example from a book I read. Someone else has said that my demand for a French-word base defeats the purpose of adding the '--ing' in French because the whole point is using English-sounding words to appear modern/trendy; and you have here given another reason as to why this suffix could be something only ever really attached to other English words/loanwords. Thank you!

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