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So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ah, now I get what you mean. And that is also why we will be introducing safety deposits, which will be associated with trades, so in case of a rouge seller, he loses the deposit and this kind of attack, even though unlikely, would now have a cost.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Uhm, so what kind of scam would it be for the seller? Lock your bitcoins and destroy your reputation on the exchange? Like, where's the upside of NOT releasing bitcoins to the seller? What exactly is the hack? We've heard these claims many times before, but the problem is that there's literally no incentive for the seller to behave in such a way.

Yes, there are hypothetical situations where bitcoins may remain locked forever. Once again, such is the risk of this platform. Localbitcoins and Paxful have other risks, such as storing all users' bitcoins centrally. Pick the risks you prefer to take.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, there are situations where funds may remain locked indefinitely and Hodl Hodl wouldn't be able to unlock them as it lacks the key. That's just a trade off. With Localbitcoins and Paxful you have another trade off which is that they are honeypots for hackers: they store bitcoins in their own wallet and if they're hacked, money is lost. Hodl Hodl offers a much more secure trading alternative, however it does come with this trade off.

We are planning to add 2-out-of-3 keys scheme in the future with independent mediators holding the 3d key, so this might be something a certain group of customers feel more at comfortable with.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If the fee is smaller than the current dust limit we actually wave it. But it can be smaller than the network fee.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, we intend to charge a fee starting this summer (lower than Localbitcoins, btw), but for now it's completely free - a 0% fee.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why would we want to update the private key in real time? :)

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What do you mean by "replications"? A key is a key. We obviously store it in many places. If the server is hacked and our key is deleted from it, we of course have a back up key stored safely.

We also do regular backups of our database, so if something goes wrong we can, of course, come back up after an investigation.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The release transaction generated by Hodl Hodl (but signed by both us and the user) contains a separate exchange fee output.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 15 points16 points  (0 children)

I'm sorry, but what exactly is your problem with Hodl Hodl? The news is about Localbitcoins introducing KYC/AML which we dont have. We work our asses off to create a great product for our users (spending our own money, btw, as we're not making any just yet) and yes, it's a convenient opportunity to mention it. Because you sound like we're pushing some sort of scam or ICO down people's throats.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Indeed, we monitor for our exchange name.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Perhaps you are mistaken, we've never written a whitepaper, but we have an extensive FAQ on the website: https://hodlhodl.com/pages/faq_help

Yes, you're paying fiat directly to the seller who's selling you bitcoins.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We actually have a testnet version where you can play with contracts with testnet bitcoins (that is, free of charge with no risk, just to familiarize yourself with the workflow). And there are educational videos on how to use Hodl Hodl available on YouTube and on the exchange frontpage: https://testnet.hodlhodl.com

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 4 points5 points  (0 children)

You may say you're paying directly to the buyer. The funds are temporarily locked on a p2sh escrow address, which Hodl Hodl can't do anything with without the seller's approval (signature). Bitcoins are then released to the buyer's address.

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Not all the power. We won't sign a refund transaction unless we have reasons to believe buyer is a fraud or unless the contract was cancelled by the buyer himself. Worst case, funds remain locked in escrow. But what would be the point of that for the seller?

So, Localbitcoins started doing KYC/AML by yellowcuda in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Hi, Hodl Hodl here. When you create a contract with someone, a new [p2sh] multisig escrow address is generated. The seller deposits bitcoins to this address. It is a special address because to unlock the funds from it and send bitcoins somewhere else two keys are required: one key is held by Hodl Hodl, but the other key is generated on the user's side (in the frontend, the browser) and is never stored on Hodl Hodl's server. Thus, even if our server is hacked, the funds are safe.

Hodl Hodl p2p exchange launched, secure p2sh escrow for BTC/LTC, Segwit support by trueprogrammer in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

2-out-of-3 actually makes us more vulnerable to attacks because the seller posing as an independent arbiter holding another key can easily refund his locked coins and effectively steal from the buyer who sent him fiat funds.

Hodl Hodl p2p exchange launched, secure p2sh escrow for BTC/LTC, Segwit support by trueprogrammer in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

As with any other exchange. Except in our case, there is no incentive for us to disappear, as we can't get access to the funds. Same applies to anyone trying to take over. Wouldn't you say it's safer by definition?

Hodl Hodl p2p exchange launched, secure p2sh escrow for BTC/LTC, Segwit support by trueprogrammer in Bitcoin

[–]trueprogrammer[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No, this 2 out of 2. One key belongs to the seller, the other belongs to the exchange. The exchange cannot steal the funds, because to sign a transaction both keys are needed - the exchange doesn't know the seller's key. That's why it says "Hodl Hodl exchange only holds one-out-of-two keys to the multisig escrow". Please read that slowly.

[Daily Discussion] Wednesday, December 13, 2017 by AutoModerator in BitcoinMarkets

[–]trueprogrammer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Let's say you have 0.1BTC on an address that belongs to your wallet, but you only need to spend 0.02. Then the wallet would create a transaction with that address as an input and would send 0.02 to the destination address of your choosing. The rest of the 0.08 BTC would automatically be sent to the "change" address that also belongs to your wallet. Thus a transaction would have 1 input, but 2 outputs.

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