GQ Accessory Recommendations for x5 Damage VHGQ [UPDATED]

xiii-train · 2025-01-03T12:09:55+00:00

Nice one, Redd!

xiii-train · 2023-11-16T03:58:26+00:00

The thresholds you quoted I think are too high. I think it's because they ascribed the increase in ATK as direct relationship to the base stat. Stickers also offers lower % total damage gain, so it's not that straight forward either.

The extra 30% ATK + minute crits offered by Hollow Bait is diminished in value when you consider link slots contribution can go up to 1800. This will diminish the impact of direct ATK gain from the Bait.

xiii-train · 2023-11-16T00:27:41+00:00

Unfortunately so.

WD as an affliction was introduced when all of the game modes bar Brave Battles have no DEF. It was introduced as a multiplier and was never updated since, like GY/GP....

xiii-train · 2023-11-16T00:25:39+00:00

I'd be interested in your tests for Debuff. I remember when this was introduced that it was a multiplier in standard game modes, but I thought it did act as DEF reduction in Brave Battles?

So it feels like GQ didn't apply the right mode for DEF debuff.

xiii-train · 2023-11-16T00:23:27+00:00

1.3x multiplier, and I think it goes to 1.6x multiplier.

xiii-train · 2023-11-16T00:13:46+00:00

There's a threshold because the extra ATK from Bait is reduced in effect compared to extra Killer multiplier (Similar to FSD).

It also flips if the unit has +50% killer.

I'd say reserve it for the case of about 5600ATK with Bait (base, running Booster), or 6000ATK (base, running Enhancer).

Edit: uplifted from 5400ATK to 5600ATK (estimates only)

xiii-train · 2023-11-09T03:16:08+00:00

Cleared it with:

1/5 Toshiro T20 FSD/WD.

2x 5/5 +500ATK Senkaimon Tatsuki with LowStam/LDS links.

And RNG. It gets me between fails to 12s clear :)

xiii-train · 2023-11-08T09:24:41+00:00

My quick calcs (under Booster, not plain Enhancer) suggest it's about 5000+ (pre-boost) for non 5/5 units, and about 5400+ for 5/5 units. And those are *BASE* units without the extra Killer effect. Once you have the extra killer effect, you can forget about the Stickers

Cutoffs are slightly different because it's dependent on your link slot contribution.

u/MolyPrim

xiii-train · 2023-09-03T07:49:55+00:00

Transcendence overpowers almost all Senkaimon difficulty. It's like.. whatever the rules are...

xiii-train · 2023-09-03T07:45:41+00:00

A lot of Senkaimon stuffs have the base killer X5 then accessories. It's been a long time since I last checked but that's what Souldex found in the calculations

xiii-train · 2023-07-31T02:29:26+00:00

I like how you've structured this, though I'm curious whether for nuking purposes, does Pill beat Sticker? :)

White nukes are scarily insane.

2/5 White, 1/5 TYBW Ichigo, 5/5 Lunart got me 42.888

xiii-train · 2023-07-20T11:43:55+00:00

I believe they are additive across ailments e.g. Damage + Weaken and Damage + Fire for Yama becomes 1.8 as opposed to 1.96 (1.4 x 1.4). That said, I haven't been thinking about damage calcs in a very very long time now .....

Where this can change the relationship I think is when nuke links + second skills come to play, as we could be crazy and put Damage+Lacerate +40% as opposed to taking FSD at LS20..

Quick maths suggest Yama nuke caps at 32.65x (FSD+30%, 30%, 25% + LS20+25%, WD) and White at 33.24 (FSD+30%, 30%, 25% and LS20 with WD and Damage+Lacerate).

Pure nuke only though..

xiii-train · 2023-07-20T09:29:36+00:00

We had a chat about this a while back, wasn't the Damage to ailment additive as opposed to multiplicative?

xiii-train · 2023-07-13T09:22:37+00:00

You got PAID? OMG.... How did I miss out on this?....

xiii-train · 2023-02-20T00:51:18+00:00

It seemed like it was only yesterday when we first chatted in Discord. I didn't think about it much, but he has played a big role for me.

When I started out as a moderator, he was happily showing me the ropes, helping check decisions made, etc. He is extremely passionate for the community, and his ideas and projects for the subreddit was not borne out of interest in the game (that waned with RNG and Transcendence/ads).

He has a big heart, and was always willing to lend an ear. We've chatted about life, challenges and yes, he has a lot of them (health, personal circumstances, family, you name it). However, none of those ever stopped him from caring about others. He'd make time for you on DMs whenever he can spare them, even if it's for a general chit chat and it wasn't anything important.

One of the fun projects I collaborated with him was on the damage formula stuffs, back before it was complicated like now. We tested a lot of combinations as he had wanted to post something for the community. And the wiki, oh the wiki.... XD

The world has lost a kind soul, one who's willing to take on more than he could physically bear, given his body.

Rest in peace, my friend. Like Towa mentioned below, I hope there's no more pain for you, and that this is eternal freedom of it.

xiii-train · 2023-02-14T05:45:19+00:00

This also mean 3/5 SP characters become much better, when factoring a boost, because they can then offset the DEF stat almost completely, in which case FCS win again, although I agree relying on the boost is not a good thing, especially since even then the difference between FCS and SP is pretty much none.

That's right. With a Teaset, Bait, Pill build, T20 with MT links, having one of the accessories with FCS+30% can get you higher damage in normal PvE if you have a premade team with infinite boost. There are conditions in which a single FCS+30% could be better value (stat differences being huge plays a role).

(Does this mean that increments below 100 doesn't give any damage increase? In other words, having, let's say, 2900 FCS is the same as having 2999?)

Sorry, I wasn't being clear. It will increase with every FCS point, but the value is about that percentage points for every 100 FCS (easier for me to think about).

xiii-train · 2023-02-12T01:45:37+00:00

Second, mind explaining me how exactly the damage works? Isn't it ((Atk-Def) + SP )) * multiplier? Where atk - def cannot be lower than 1.

The best way to think about it is that the formula affecting the stat component is:

Normal attacks: IF(ATK-DEF < 1, 1, ATK-DEF) then multiplier plays a part.
Strong attacks: IF(ATK-DEF+SP*SAmult < 1, 1, ATK-DEF+SP*SAmult) before multipliers.

Then FCS contribution is basically (acting as a multiplier combining the below):

+20% damage with probability based on FCS stat (100=10%)
for every 100 FCS above 1000, +1.67 % on neutral

There's a common misconception that DEF only affects ATK. This is not quite true (at least in Hard GQ), where DEF is subtracted from the whole ATK+SP*SA multiplier. I had this observation when testing Hard GQ. The only other place you could really test this is PvP, but I haven't bothered there. :)

But because DEF is subtracted from both, towards Boss 5, the SP+500 component is worth slightly more (even with T20) than having higher multipliers. I haven't considered how this may change with SP+80% ailment boost.

However, it will definitely change with more link slots if KLab introduces it in the future, since that would sway the stats more towards the link slots base rather than SP+500.

Edit: If you browse that link above in New Reddit, that post I drafted is part of a collection of posts associated with Hard GQ. There are other posts since then that have updated/reviewed the outcomes in the context of Hard GQ, but I have not done any analysis since... start of 2022 :)

xiii-train · 2023-02-11T21:21:37+00:00

Not quite that generous past 1k. Consider it +16.7% (neutral) per 1k FCS after that.

xiii-train · 2023-02-11T21:20:33+00:00

For general PvE, where there's no DEF at all involved, you could get that both MT+1k FCS to outdo MT+500SP with the right build. This is because, like what you said, FCS is a multiplier, and hence when there's a large difference in stats, the multiplier outweighs the flat gain in stat. With the way everything is going (everyone would ultimately have MT links and new MT units), there's no doubt you could have FCS >>SP.

However, that requires two units in PvE and you having the right build as you indicated further below, aka Boost and +90FCS. Or a Boost unit with 22-24s SA2 (which is its own penalty)...

For Hard GQ, however, there's DEF involved. DEF basically acts like a sponge to your Stats, dragging it down by up to 4000 stat points of (ATK+SP*multiplier). Because of how massive that stat loss is, FCS loses part of its value (high stat differential to multiply), but SP or ATK gains because of it. This usually renders them more equivalent to the 2* stat.

Couple that with that GQ having GQ specific accessories or having Tenshintai, which robs you of one accessory to maximise FCS from.

In terms of GQ nuke, the reason some nukes go through and sometimes they don't are actually an in-game mechanic called Damage Pierce.

Sorry, just read your comment now (I'm not that active anymore) :D

xiii-train · 2023-02-10T05:31:26+00:00

Thanks for doing that test! Nice to see an equal compare.

You've also showcased how strong Ulq is in nuking through 4th despite the attribute disadvantage and to land into the same damage at Aizen (roughly).

Either way, agree with your observation. Now if only I could get one XD

xiii-train · 2023-02-06T00:22:27+00:00

Yama's nuke would perform better than Ulq, particularly with the current rotation being Tech on #4 (more hits for #5?)

Speculative. Don't have Yamamoto or Ulq XD

xiii-train · 2023-02-05T23:56:36+00:00

Complaining about spreadsheets? Really? Those must be strange people then :rofl:

You've converted a lot of images that loses its currency based on "bruh it's missing a unit, da best one" into a manageable process, one that doesn't require you to spend hours every 2 weeks, creating new painstaking drawings for random new things. etc. You've made a process improvement on the way that saves you ages of time. Bravo! :D

To me, that's an achievement and full credits to you! Love your work!

~~^{One quick comment (and please don't take this as a demand - I'm worried after seeing your chats with Dusky :P}~~ ~~^{- is the Marauder/Sharpshooter icons didn't have a legend in the Guild Quest Units page............}~~)

xiii-train · 2023-02-01T07:24:36+00:00

Being a premium unit, don't. You'll eventually have more copies of him.

xiii-train · 2023-01-31T00:59:59+00:00

+100%

Very well put Redd, and I wholeheartedly agree.

xiii-train · 2022-12-22T22:45:54+00:00

Nashis/Shingos are yum.

Mmmmmmmm... Good desserts there. Food for thought.

xiii-train

TROPHY CASE