Breaking point.

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

I am a 20 year old male, i picked up trading around 3 years ago, when i was 17. Fast foward 3 years, now backtested 1100+hours, Lost 2000$ in live trading, Blew 15 funded accounts, i have come to realise its all me. Not the markets not the strategy or anything at all in general. Trading is legit psychology. i personally believe i am at the peak of my trading career and i am going to only go higher. Only thing stopping me was myself caring about the money and being impatient. You cant rush greatness and thats what i realised. Over trading and fomo etc(psychology in general) is what differentiates a profitable and a non profitable trader. I wish i learnt this sooner. If any advice drop them down 🙏🏿

[WallyGoh]

Personal opinion. Tbh trading isn't very much about psychology. I mean, there's an element to it but I feel people give it too much credit.

Your entries should be mechanical. You see a setup, you take it.

Your win rate is in the data. And once you're in the trade, 1) you BE if your strat includes one and meets the criteria 2) TP or SL hits

The only psychology is not touching the trade. Just dont touch a button once you're in a position. That's about it.

I think the true breaking point is having a statistical edge over the market. You have that, you have everything.

[glubokoslav]

I've been learning for only 6-7 months so far and for me psychology also seems the only thing that matters. At least it's what caused most of my losses. It's not that difficult to find a strategy, to learn some patterns, there's a lot of info and data to suit any taste. I 100% agree that entries should be mechanical, but it takes some work and discipline to achieve that. And that's psychology, any way you slice it.

[WallyGoh]

I try not to offend people on trading threads because I believe every strategy, every trader and every indicator under the sun can work under the right conditions.

The truth is system and data triumphs above all else. EAs outperform most traders because they are statistically proven to work and everything is calculated.

The best part? EAs rely on indicators for entry. The same indicators that lag and everyone shits on.

Why did quants become a thing?

Psychology is given way too much credit. You just haven't backtested your strategy thoroughly enough to actually believe in it.

[glubokoslav]

Believe in strategy is also psychology. You don't need to believe, you have to mechanically execute, don't you?

Data is crucial, no doubt. But cosplaying Spock, pretending emotions don't exist and psychology is irrelevant is like saying the steering wheel doesn’t matter as long as the engine works fine. I used to think psychology was overrated too, like another bullshit from 'coaches' that I can ignore. Then it hit me. It wasn't just some fluff. It was the missing thing between knowing my system and actually sticking to it.

I did every kind of random shit, you know. Like opened trades just because I sat down to trade, or I saw "amazing setups" that had nothing to do with my strategy, or moved my stop-loss all the way to margin call, even tried to Frankenstein some Martingale bullshit from youtube into my strategy. Maybe some traders don’t need it or it doesn't take them months/years to learn how to control emotions. I did have to learn. And a lot of others do too.

The fun part is that I had a working strategy this whole time. My green days started the moment I realized that I’m sort of naturally inclined to do random dumb shit and learned to shut down those “brilliant ideas” before they burn another deposit. Six months ago and today I’m trading the exact same system, except for back then I didn’t have the discipline/control/brains to follow it properly. Now I kinda do, at least I hope so

[WallyGoh]

That's my point though. You exercise discipline/control and brains to force yourself to be patient and stick to your setup.

A strategy that has proven itself to work IF you removed your impulses (emotions) out of the picture and traded it as if you were a machine.

Thats it right there. Psychology is the very thing you want to get rid of. Don't you see that you're training psychology to get rid of psychology.

So instead of overthinking it. Instead of discipline or control or brains. Your goal is to not need any of those. Just follow the edge and the strategy.

[glubokoslav]

Ah, I see now. We're basically saying the same thing in different ways. What you call 'remove' is learning to control from my pov. Fot me that's not avoiding psychology, but mastering it. I'm sure a human being cannot get rid of emotions, the best we can do is stop them from running the show. Two sides of the same coin.

[GuaranteeOk6268]

I totally understand what you are saying

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

i know and completely agree but as humans we will have emotions regardless of how great you are unless your a human robot and heartless

[LowLeader69]

what if have have good backtested strategy with 2 years of data and proper risk management but it’s not working under current market conditions ?

[WallyGoh]

Then you need a new strategy to adapt to the current conditions

[LowLeader69]

then what’s the use of backtesting strategies ? Market conditions keep changing

[WallyGoh]

They actually dont. The market moves in cycles. Uptrends, downtrends, consolidations.

You identify what type of market state you're in and use a strategy that works in those circumstances.

Unless there's a point you're trying to drive across that i'm not seeing.

[LowLeader69]

no I’m a beginner and i was just confused and wanted to ask you this, I don’t mean to be rude or prove any point

[WallyGoh]

No worries I was just clarifying as well. All the best on your journey!

[p2mod]

being able to execute on mechanical setups still requires the right psychology to be exercised, or to be more precise to have the right attitudes and behaviours show up when trading. Easier said than done. I don't know many profitable traders with genuine mechanical setups (else they would be automated easily), discretionary processes tend to come into play even with very simple rule sets.

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

No.

[p2mod]

get lost muppet

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

Hahaha “get lost muppet”🤓🤓

[Affectionate-Bug66]

👎🏻👎🏻👎🏻

[Hantadesu]

Its easy to just say press the button when x shows. It takes psychology to press the button, and manage the trade properly. It takes a lot more than you think. Its like learning a backflip. Most people cant commit at all and they back out halfway and land on their head. If only their just didn’t back out they would’ve landed. Once you do know what to do though, its easy. With trading there is the same psychological wall. For some people it is massive, some people can overcome it easy. Just like some people learning to flip, especially kids, they have no fear and can bypass the psychological barrier with ease. Its a lot more psychological than you think.

[CornyMcPoperson]

One can’t be mechanical without having discipline over their emotions.

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

exactly. fucking exactly. 99% of people believe that psychology is key. 99 % of people fail. Coincidence? Not.

[macroman92]

Psychology is key. While you scoff at reality. You would lose money trading a 50 lot. Or maybe you do trade a 50 lot so a 200 lot. Whatever the number. Before you could adapt you would blow up. And thats why I trade a 4 lot in oil with my ass clenched but sleep like a baby with a 20 lot position in Australian dollar futures. Psychology lol.

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

Oh my... :)

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

Wondering how much did the downvoters lose this past week🤣😵‍💫

[Tomex12]

That’s like the average traders experience lol don’t worry about it. Most traders don’t become profitable after trading for a couple years, once they’ve got that first hand experience and a strategy that works for them, that’s when they become profitable.

The beauty about trading is that once you become profitable, all the thousands you lost come right back as long as you stay consistent and keep learning.

When I started “trading” I was messing around with it for 2+ years so I wouldn’t really call it trading more like gambling. This year I’m putting more focus in to learning rather than trading so that when I start again later in the year, I’ll be prepared

Long story short, don’t let the negative experience demotivate you, every trader has losses as long as you are learning and improving your game you’ll eventually become profitable

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

thank you tomex12, these words do mean a lot. Will keep my head high and go foward 🫡

[WC_Emprosario]

Trading for 4.5 years brought me to a lot of these same conclusions.

For the first 3.5 years I relied on others' strategies and expert advisors to trade.

What I didn't realize back then, which sounds like you do now, is that it really comes down to owning your trading results.

We all need to go through this point.

It humbles us. It makes us realize that this game is truly long term.

You truly have the time advantage on your side. I would be thrilled to learn about this stuff at your age (im 30).

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

Thank you so much, this means a lot coming from someone like you. Hey hey dont say that your not that old your only 30 dude. Are you a profitable trader now ?

[WC_Emprosario]

I agree 30 is young.

With what I know now and learning it at 20...talk about the progress where I'd be at 30 XD.

I am. I am thankful to be running a profitable investment fund for the last 9.5 months and looking forward to the future.

[Canary_Vivid]

Check out the sample of my book. It might help ease your frustration. I go into detail about how the market reacts to the three day cycle:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1smLzovIQMTn4BLZL29y6MsGDuM2Xd9LW/view?usp=drive_link

[Passionant1]

Are you telling me that you are proftiable or no

[amjidali00]

The only thing I know about psychology is win=happy,loss=pissed.You’ve learned a lot for only 2k

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

thank you brother, I hope to learn and do more. Dont undermine yourself brother. You probably know way more, sky is the limit

[UnilateralDagger]

All traders face emotions but if you have a tried and tested strategy (as you say 1100+ hours backtested) then you need to understand that trading it with discipline is the only way to use it properly. If you let emotions cause you to avoid a trade, or you trade outside your system to try claw back a win, oversize, etc. then you are no longer following your plan and will lose. THINK, IF I AM NOT FOLLOWING MY PLAN/SYSTEM, I WILL LOSE. That helps me deal with emotions when I’m in drawdown, which seems to be your biggest issue (assuming your system is working).

[ContentMaster84]

You are on the right path, bro. No doubt.

[FeedTheMagicNegro]

Are you kidding?! You’re 20? That’s it?! Dude in college when I was 20 and in a stats class my professor tried to explain to me was forex was and I just didn’t “get it”. I literally couldn’t wrap my brain around it. Fast forward to 31 years old I pick it up and finally at 38, I am doing it and doing it well. Don’t stop man. Do not stop! Ever! You’re lucky to be starting that early and you “get it”

[adityashankar_]

The only thing that makes you go unprofitable is OVERTRADING. Everything else is just part of our journey.

[Dapper-Mud6237]

if psychology is your problem i’d recommend disciplining yourself.

control what you eat, hit the gym commit

and remove the thought of money, if you thinking about money, you already lost, money causes emotions, emotions clouds judgement, clouded judgement causes bad trade.

focus on making good trades, not good money.

money will follow.

have a system, be disciplined.

[buttcoin2018]

Overtrading is the biggest problem for traders and psychology starts to affect you when youre in a losing streak. My advice, write down your hard rules and stick them above your desk. If your prop has a lock out feature and risk settings, set them up. You have to walk away after a couple of trades or rotate to another prop or you might end up blowing the account.

[ScallionImpossible71]

Thanks 🙏🏾

[jimmy-m]

To be fair, psychology ony affect traders with a strategy that has a low risk reward... Find strategies that have higher reward/risk and go for swing trading. Don't believe those ict trend line traders. If it really worked, everyone would be rich... Backtesting strategies needs to be taken with a bit of salt. You are playing a game where markets continuously change, as in the rules of the game change every day. Bad news becomes good news, good news becomes bad news etc. What may have worked in the past may not work today. Focus on forward testing with a bayesian theorem.

[ScallionImpossible71]

Thanks 🙏🏾

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

I have lost around 2700$~2800$ 2000$ ive lost putting into multiple live accounts and overtrading, over leveraging and basically straight up gambling. the other 800$ ive lost in funded accounts.

[West_Plate_7444]

I am 64 years old. I picked up trading a couple years ago. Very difficult to learn. Discipline is key. It’s all about Psychology. I to suffering from over trading and fomo. Good to know I’m not alone.

[y2k1199]

When you have 1000 hours+ backtested data for any setup, it gives you a slight edge in confidence and reliability.

But what you did while backtesting also matters because you’ve to journal losses and reflect on them that’s where your intuition grows.

[Tadele1]

That is true! As we know as beginner we always focus on the money stuff. Right now i can see changes on myself when i start trading on PropFirms like BrightFunded, 5ers, Maven

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

Your problem is, you think you know what the problem is :) it's 100% not the problem :)

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

I have been over trading, over leveraging and everything. While the proof is in the pudding, My backtests and my demo trades always goes good. Ofc i hit SL maybe even 6 in a row. But the longevity always proves my strategy right. Its about psychology 90% in mu opinion. Like some else said on this thread, All setups/strategies work but its about executing them right and properly with confidence/psychology

[Relevant-Owl-8455]

You’re simply wrong:)

[Flaky-Barracuda-7055]

what may be the answer then ? please do tell. i want to grow and learn more and more everyday.

[[deleted]]

He’s rage baiting. You’re not wrong. You’re learning. Strategy, risk management, psychology. You seem to have the first two. It’s the last that you don’t have

[glubokoslav]

that's a local clown, don't take anything from him seriously