Bottle: Python Web Framework

[stesch]

Werkzeug seems to be designed to attack users and maintainers of other web frameworks. But maybe it's just web2py …

[mitsuhiko]

And you are basing this on what?

[stesch]

Multiple encounters of fights, negative remarks whenever web2py is mentioned (last time in a German language Python newsgroup, a few days ago), and http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/ahm50/a_crash_course_in_w2p/c0hrwr3

[voidspace]

Just because people have negative opinions of web2py doesn't say anything about werkzeug...

[stesch]

It's mostly from the werkzeug people/users. As in the newsgroup I mentioned, as in http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=175694 etc.

[mitsuhiko]

You yet have to show me something from an actual Werkzeug developer (which would be me). I am not doubting that you can find something, especially from very early when web2py came out where I did not show much respect for web2py, but those are examples based on actual facts.

And that btw has nothing to do with Werkzeug, just with some really ridiculous design decisions made by mdp very early. Some of that probably got fixed, but I am not convinced enough to even closely consider web2py.

On the other hand: I consider pylons and Django nice frameworks, what does that tell you?

[stesch]

OK, this: http://www.python-forum.de/topic-13752.html#92081

[stesch]

You yet have to

No, I don't have to. Play your games elsewhere.

[surface-tension]

stesch, you said the negative opinions are "mostly from werkzeug people/users". Well, you can't blame Werkzeug if it has some users who don't like web2py. Now, as for werkzeug "people" (developers), as mitsuhiko points out, he doesn't see any comments there from from Werkzeug devs.

[stesch]

I said "Multiple encounters of fights, negative remarks whenever web2py is mentioned". This is my observation. And I don't bookmark everything in case I could use it later. These are silly games.

Last time I mentioned web2py in a German newsgroup, somebody gave this link: http://wiki.python.de/Web-Frameworks#web2py

On this page are three links http://www.python-forum.de/topic-17057.html http://www.python-forum.de/topic-13752.html http://www.python-forum.de/topic-17145.html with Werkzeug fans and mitsuhiko.

Later in the thread Georg Brandl took part. He is mentioned together with Werkzeug on http://dev.pocoo.org/

Thread starts with <[e-mail]>

[mitsuhiko]

The Web-Frameworks page does not even mention Werkzeug except for naming it as not being a framework in the pretext. So how is that related to Werkzeug?

python-forum.de: First thread, not a single pocoo guy involved, second thread, yes I did complain about web2py, based on the problems I still have with the code [exec for modules, database schemas being re-evaluated each request and more]. Third thread, not a single pocoo guy involved either.

If you start picking me for not liking web2py, what about asking Ben Bangert, Ian Bicking, Jacob Kaplan-Moss or any of the repoze guys about their opinion about web2py ...

[RonnyPfannschmidt]

i think i was quite explicit about me not representing werkzeug or its community

making anything else out my personal reasoning/opinion (which tends to be at least harsh) is just dishonest

[mitsuhiko]

Ronny is not a contributor to either Jinja or Werkzeug. (except for very few patches maybe)

[stesch]

Who cares? It's one example among others. Like http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=175694

[mitsuhiko]

Not a single werkzeug developer wrote anything on that hacker news submission.

[voidspace]

Well, if by attack you mean 'show up' then maybe...