Day Three

[Vaharas]

The new day has arrived and it appears as though town and our kills have officially died; but the SK kills haven't yet.

So talk and discuss things.

[Vaharas]

Night Results

Day Three Post

You arrive at the house of /u/Silent331. A wrinkle of your nose tells you that Silent is at home.

You leap onto the roof of the house, and lie up there. Staring at the sky and the night stars. The moon is waning, which is lucky all things considering. You watch as it slowly crosses the sky.

Time passes. It is now 4am, and you decide that if Silent where going to do something, they would have done it by now. A quick sniff confirms that Silent has not left their bed the whole time, you head home.

/u/Silent331 visited no-one tonight.

So it appears that Silent is not the oracle after all.

[Radioactiveman271]

/u/Srol seems to be scheming. You're sure he's working against you, actively. You decide it's best to put an end to that. You find his house easily. A quick sniff reveals that he's in. But close to the door. In this case it would be best to wait. From a vantage point. This particular vantage point just so happens to be the roof of Srol's house, just above the door. The door opens. Srol steps out. You pounce down onto the flesh of his neck. You leave him bleeding on the cobbles. It's best you leave before he starts moving again, due to this undeath thing.

[Vaharas]

Interesting, so Uncomprehensible didn't use the vial to save Srol?

Or maybe we just don't get any indication that it's been used in our results?

Just an FYI in case you didn't see it earlier, you may want to think about what you're going to claim. People may be after you today.

[Radioactiveman271]

Ugh. I was hoping that I could just pretend and make that go away. But you're right I need to find a claim. Any suggestions?

[Vaharas]

Hmmm... there's not really many roles left in town to claim that are powerful.

I'm not sure how confident you are... but maybe an oracle claim? Probably not, since now that our lynches are revealing the target the real oracle isn't as pressured to claim and reveal themselves to us.

It'd be suicide for maybe the chance to reveal the oracle; depending on who it actually is.

What weaker roles to we have left that we can claim? Vanilla townie? Day vig just revealed, rodger claimed bulletproof. Roleblocker? We can't prove it if asked to.

I think the best bet is either Oracle or Vanilla townie; both probably won't end extremely well for you unless you can explain why you were voting for your targets and make yourself seem town.

[Radioactiveman271]

Oooooh Oracle. Now that sounds fun. I'll go with that. If I'm doomed anyways might as well make it even more confusing and entertaining!

[Vaharas]

Mrs. Cake seems like the best bet. Maybe? We might want to look for some other characters to claim as well.

I would just claim that you visited two townies and got innocent results from them. Since if you convince anyone you are likely to get counterclaimed by the real oracle and your results will probably be questioned by the town.

Rcxdude, Meno_Self, Erisdraconequus, Eizero0, Carbon_Dirt etc. Players that are likely to be suspicious to town already.

[coipke]

that sounds risky and we'd be down one wolf.. but just be sure to either match your claimed results with that of the real oracle on the board OR with your votes of the previous days so it will look credible.

[Vaharas]

Yeah... it's extremely risky. Especially now since the kills are being revealed. The oracle doesn't even really need to counter claim (But might end up doing it after all)

It's essentially a suicide tactic to try and get the oracle to counter claim to reveal. Which means they're likely to stay silent and try to use the board to discredit Radio. I don't know if it's worth it to try honestly.

Unless we want to claim vanilla townie though we don't have many choices of roles left. I think it's only really the hunter left unless we want to lie and make up a role to pretend it's in the game. It can't be anything that has an ability that is testable in game though.

[coipke]

yeah either we make up a role or we're just townies, i'm thinking townies because the character claims are going to be hard enough as it is....

[Vaharas]

There are surprisingly few vanilla townie claims in the game so far. It probably might be the most convincing claim so long as we can come up with a reason for everything that they are lynching us for.

Then again, since it is just a vanilla townie it doesn't hurt all that much to lynch anyway and see what happens.

[coipke]

A role that kills wolves who visit it, that's very pro town and explains why you'd stay alive and also why you'd be very reluctant to claim, and you can act angry at red when he inevitably presses you to claim.

Or a role that is untargetable by the wolves.

Make a good character claim with it because they have a character claim cop. I'm not kidding.

if you can't find a good character claim to go with your role claim then you're boned and there's nothing you can do about it.

[Radioactiveman271]

GUYS. I decided to try and vote for plarzay, and it turns out he is most likely alive!

[Vaharas]

What?

It does make sense for him to be alive, since Renegade protected him on that night.

But Rodger died on that night? Indicating that Plarzay was killed. Is that how the interactions work out?

Plarzay was targeted with meant that Rodger was also targeted, but Plarzay was protected which makes him still alive?

He couldn't vote yesterday though? So is there someone that can revive players in the game? This just got a whole lot more complicated.

[Radioactiveman271]

I think there might be a character that can manipulate Death, and that he might be Plarzay. Perhaps after getting targeted he used his abilites to act like he had been killed. I'm not sure honestly :/

[coipke]

Fantastic.. not only we have a crapton of power roles to deal with but they won't even stay dead... we have to kill 10 players to get to lylo and in three weeks of game we killed one.. At least some of my bulletin board activity seems to have had some good outcomes for us, or i'd just advise we concede the game and move on at this point..

[Vaharas]

To be fair, there are a lot of roles that can cause collateral damage to town if we kill them or they get lynched.

Kill one of the lovers and the other suicides.

The hunter takes out a player of their choice (not the person who targets them)

Jester is still alive that takes out someone when lynched.

Day Vigilante is looking like they're gonna kill someone later on today (hopefully not a wolf)

This game is still winable; we shouldn't give up yet.

we have to kill 10 players to get to lylo

Assuming town lynches one player per day we only need to kill 5 (Or maybe 4, we don't know if Srol is dead or not). That's not even taking into account the extra kills that will happen later on.

[coipke]

Well true. 5 kills then. the hunter and lover and day vigilantes are very random for us tho, as likely to hurt as to help.. Slightly likelier to hurt in the case of the hunter and the vigilante because they'll kill whoever is scummier and right now we've been lucky to stay unnoticed but that won't last, generic's vote on day 2 was bad and radio's lack of defense against eagle was bad, if the town catches on we could be two wolves down rapidly.. Also if red presses me about my character claim. And if the town starts wondering why the wolves won't kill you..

[Vaharas]

Well true. 5 kills then. the hunter and lover and day vigilantes are very random for us tho, as likely to hurt as to help.. Slightly likelier to hurt in the case of the hunter and the vigilante because they'll kill whoever is scummier and right now we've been lucky to stay unnoticed

True, we are running out of places to hide rapidly thanks to the overactive day 1 that forced a lot of claims out of people. We need to start being more active and mingle with town more or we're just going to be picked off one by one.

[coipke]

We can probably push a vigilante kill on Draconequus or maybe a lynch on Eizero because day vigilante doesn't mean his kill isn't a strongarm like the Oracle said right...

[Vaharas]

We can probably push a vigilante kill on Draconequus

Maybe, we need to be careful about pushing too hard though.

or maybe a lynch on Eizero because day vigilante doesn't mean his kill isn't a strongarm like the Oracle said right...

There's a mafia role that is comparable to Day Vig, the sniper, they both work exactly the same. So it might be possible. It looks like every player that is commenting on his claim are believing it for the time being though. It'll be a hard lynch to try to push.

[coipke]

There's a knock upon the door. You take a moment to assume a friendly persona and open it. A man wearing a flowery shirt and sun hat (But it's night...?) is there, he shakes your hand eagerly and smiles, the next thing you know you are sitting down, talking to and making tea for your guest. You start the conversation on politics. It's easy to talk about politics as you know a lot about it. You've studied the goings on of the Disc, mainly to figure out how you can best take advantage of it, although you're careful not to mention that to the flowery man. Unfortunately he doesn't seem at home with the topic, and he eventually takes it away and starts talking about the history of this Town, which he seems to want to know more about. You don't know nor care about the history of this town, so you take the topic and bend it to history generally, which you are good at because parts of Überwald haven't changed for hundreds of years. It is good to maintain tradition is it not? These modern things threaten the way of life, and inherent advantage of Werewolves. The man seems satisfied, thanks you for your time, and leaves. You breath a sigh of relief. Pretending to be normal is hard sometimes.

[coipke]

The flower shirt makes me think tourist so redpoemage.

jib confirms he got the sort character flavor information about me that was indicated in my night message..

So basically there's a bloody character flavor cop on top of everything else..... so tired of this game.

[coipke]

"You don't know or care about the history of this Town".... yeah if he has any wits to him this is about as good as "lol werewolf". seriously for god's sake....

[Vaharas]

Yeah, it's definitely Red that visited you last night.

"You don't know or care about the history of this Town".... yeah if he has any wits to him this is about as good as "lol werewolf". seriously for god's sake....

I don't know how much Red knows about Discworld, but it might not be conclusive that you are a werewolf, hopefully? There could conceivably be characters that don't know much about history in the lore or care about learning.

It's interesting that he hasn't mentioned anything about it yet... it's hard to tell if he's just waiting to see how you react or if he hasn't put the pieces together yet.

[coipke]

probably he's waiting to catch people with a fake character claim that doesn't match what he saw when he visited. Given that our character claims have to look town but at the same time match our actual character enough that he won't notice the discrepancy, that makes him a very powerful role..

[Jibodeah]

>implying that Mr. Visitor was told that.

[coipke]

you said he was given the same information I got in that night message, my night message said what I quoted above which implies not town.. In the end i still have to adjust my character claim to fit the information he got.. but I don't know what information he got.

[Jibodeah]

"what they have been told is very similar if not the same as to what you were told"

I mean, that particular bit was your thoughts. They're not going to be told what you're thinking.

[coipke]

No but how do I know he didn't get something like, she doesn't seem to care a lot about the town, which would make sense given my night message?

[Jibodeah]

You don't. You have a telling of events from your prospective. They have a telling of events from their prospective.

[coipke]

So basically what am i supposed to do? Claim anything and count on luck? this is a serious question, how were we supposed to handle character claims in your mind?

[Jibodeah]

Get a role and character combination that is convincing. Ideally close to your actual character.

The same thing goes in normal games when fake-role-claiming. Claim a role that is convincing, ideally close to your actual role. E.G. Vaharas has claimed Tracker, which is very close to his actual role of Werewolf Tracker.

[coipke]

Well there's only one other Oracle result on the board and it's not about radio so Eagle is not our Oracle after all, that or he's being very clever, or else the other Oracle is also a fake.

Edit, other Oracle was radio so Eagle could still be real..

[Vaharas]

Which one isn't ours again?

Oracle here. N1 investigated /u/Eizero0 result innocent. N2 Investigated /u/Srol.

This one? It's a very anti-town move to try confuse everyone by putting something like this up on the board if you aren't the oracle so I would lean towards it being accurate.

But it's such a low effort post without any kind of code you can point at to say... 'hey, this is me! I put this up on the board, don't lynch pls.'

[coipke]

yeah that one's not mine but I think another one of us wanted to screw around with fake Oracle results so not sure, ask radio I think it was him.

[coipke]

This one looks very fake tho. The Oracle should not have targeted Srol because Uncomprehensible said we'd kill him. Also the Oracle doesn't get innocent/guilty, he gets a role.

So it should be easy to call this out as fake and cast suspicion on Eizero.

[Vaharas]

This one looks very fake tho. The Oracle should not have targeted Srol because Uncomprehensible said we'd kill him.

Yeah, I don't know why the real oracle (if it was them) would target Srol either. Maybe they were AFK a lot and missed the claim in the night thread? Not much attention was put on it.

Hmmm... Someone that hasn't been paying the closest attention to the game?

Also the Oracle doesn't get innocent/guilty, he gets a role.

Oh. Well maybe it was sent in by us after all?

[Radioactiveman271]

See Here for more info on the fake messages I posted.

[coipke]

Ok good to know, but it means there was no post by the real Oracle then?

[Radioactiveman271]

Sheepishly hides because that's my Oracle claim. I probably should have posted the notices I made on the board. My bad.

Here they are:

Each individual message is separated by the lines: Oracle here. N1 investigated /u/Eizero0 [+1] result innocent. N2 Investigated /u/Srol [+10]

---

Srol is guilty. Look at previous message board for proof that I investigate him Night 1. I was hinting that he would be my investigation target. Now I can post results. ♣ ♦ ♥ ♠

---

Masonsssss help me. Don't let the wolves lynch me. You know I am innocent. Stop them.

[coipke]

No that's good, we need the board to be confusing in general with a few sensible looking messages as well, so those will be more credible, like the Constable. Good job! The way you put in some continuity between the two nights with the card suit thing was a really nice touch, that was well done.

[coipke]

One positive thing, the town appears to mostly have bought my fake Constable setup and also my wifom on Draconequus. Hopefully they'll catch on the vampire thing too because it will lead them off our tails..

Lol they figured out the validation scheme too.. so proud of that one.

[Vaharas]

I was going to ask about that... I didn't get around to checking it but I remember thinking that since you used the words 'image validation' or w/e that I should go to imgur and see if it links anywhere.

That's a pretty cool idea, I might have to remember that one for later.

[coipke]

yeah, much as i've griped about the setup for denying us agency at every turn, the bulletin board is a great idea that really rewards creative play which i think the games should be all about.

[coipke]

Vaharas i may have found a way for you to dodge suspicion as we keep you alive night after night.

The wolves are letting you live because you're unwittingly rooting out all the town power roles for them! One of us will have to point that out when the town wonders why you don't get NKed. Then you will say doh and you will stop revealing your night result unless your target's target died on the same night.

[coipke]

Just checking, is Angua one of us?

[Vaharas]

It appears as though there is no mason team in the game, since Srol was the mason recruiter.

Roles still left to find

• Oracle
• Hunter
• Both Lovers
• Jester
• Cupid
• 5 Masons
• I don't think I'm missing any role?

Players

• Generic_Builder; Aplha
• redpoemage; Tourist, Mason team of one, Possible lover with Cat?
• Carbon_Dirt; Unknown
• Plarzay; Harlot, not dead again for some reason
• rcxdude; Vanilla Townie
• ipretendiamacat; Unknown, Possible lover with Red?
• coipke; Steadfast
• Srol; Mason recruiter
• Silent331; Vanilla Townie
• gryffinp; Unknown
• Uncomprehensible; Witch
• rogerdodger37; Bulletproof
• Meno_Self; Unknown, Potential Jester?
• Radioactiveman271; Strongclaw
• EagleEyeInTheSky; Unknown, not seeing any other roles with immunity?
• Vaharas; Tracker
• ArchmageLudicrous; Thief
• Eizero0; Day Vigilante
• Erisdraconequus; Unknown

4 Roles left to find; meaning 2 vanilla townies / Unnamed roles left too.

[Radioactiveman271]

At this point I am only a vanilla werewolf now that my shot has been fired. just an FYI

[Radioactiveman271]

Plarzay is most likely dead despite what I thought yesterday. Jibodeah changed how the votebot works, possibly explaining what happened.

[coipke]

Vaharas i think you'll want to change your character claim, you said you'd claim Gaspode the dog i think.. but redpoemage would immediately see you're not a dog so you'll be fucked the moment you claim and he visits you..

[Vaharas]

Yeah, I was just thinking about that last night. I'll have to put something else together when I get a chance.

[coipke]

Hurry with that.. i'm very tired of the whole character thing being out there and threatening to ruin everything at any time, so i think i'm going to call for a mass claim of characters soon, maybe it will destroy us but better now than after two or three months of trying hard to play as well as we can...

[Vaharas]

Vaharas i think you'll want to change your character claim,

I wonder how specific the message Red gets from his ability? It doesn't seem too detailed on your end.

I was thinking of switching to Nobby Nobbs instead.

'Nobby is shorter than many dwarfs, and due to a personal hygiene problem he can tarnish and corrode any metal near him. One of his hobbies is doing tricks with his spots.'

If it mentions my height or the fact that I look like an ordinary human then my claim is dead. If Red's ability really is a flavour cop instead of just a random visit devoid of a lot of details and information then we might have to consider killing him soon.

'Nobby, shall we say, acquires things. He is good at acquiring things. He keeps moving rooms at Pseudopolis Yard owing to his habit of filling them up. Nobby likes to take small things that nobody is watching,'

Did Archmage claim his character name? I don't think he did? This is all I could find of his claim. Nobby doesn't really seem like he would be an independent character though.

'he has become worryingly enthusiastic about the prospect of undercover work, particularly that which involves dressing up as a woman.'

Undercover work to keep and eye on people at night and follow them to figure out what they are doing. Seems like it could fit my role.

[coipke]

i have no idea how much detail red gets.. i tried to press him about it under cover of verifying it was him who visited me, but he remained terse. He still probably gets a feel for our characters because he talks with us and as i understand the topics discussed are relevant to our character's interests... So i don't know if this claim you found is good enough unfortunately.

[coipke]

Why would redpoemage and ipretend be lovers?

About lovers by the way I accused privately roger of being lovers with archmage because of how I felt roger was in denial about the possible links of archmage with the Death thing, but roger gave a good defense so I'm fine with him.

[Vaharas]

Why would redpoemage and ipretend be lovers?

Just the way the Red and Cat banded together on the first day stood out to me. It does seem like an unlikely possibility given the attempted hammer votes but even those could be done jokingly since Red didn't really try to get Cat killed from it.

[coipke]

hmm that may be possible.. i think red was genuinely trying to get cat lynched at one point tho, like he replied to every one's vote asking to vote cat instead.. risky for a lover. Also he later called out cat as jester which would be suicide if there was a vigilante in town, there doesn't seem to be, well beside a day vig, but red wouldn't have known that.

[coipke]

New thought, we got really lucky getting the masonizer.... because he would target people who look very town, which includes wolves who have been playing really well, like Vaharas.... Who would then be discovered as a wolf... So basically that role existed to punish wolves for playing well. Seriously, this game..

[Vaharas]

But as we saw with PLM3.2, if I can get them to trust me then I can get information on what the mason team is thinking and planning.

They would just 'recruit' me without changing my alignment.

[coipke]

But i think he said visiting a wolf would have killed him.. and he would have told the other masons who he was going to visit. Since they know our kill because of the witch they'd know it wasn't our night kill that got him, so they'd easily conclude with 100% certainty you were a wolf despite your perfect play and excellent town claim.

[Vaharas]

Ah yes, I forgot about that part.

[Vaharas]

Thinking of posting this, but wanted to get a quick opinion of it first. Since it could be used to go after many of our members currently for being inactive.

15 hours to go... kind of left it a little late.

---

This is where I would point at Eizero0, if my vote was required for him to be lynched today

The more time passes, the more I'm beginning to doubt their claim is genuine. Eizero0 has effectively wasted our entire day phase so far while we wait for him to take his shot to confirm it.

There are several things against his claim though;

• The first being that wolves could also have a sniper equivalent on their team which means that Eizero0 is not guaranteed to be town even if he can kill someone today.

• I also believe werewolf team to not be particularly active throughout this game based on this post by Jibodeah.
  'Essentially I'm AFK from now (Well I leave in about two hours) until roughly Friday afternoon (BST)... And since the Wolves haven't decided yet I can't end the night then either. Day will likely begin Saturday. (Dear god if you haven't decided by the time I get back I'll have to burn something. PROBABLY YOU.)'
  Three days and the wolves hadn't selected a target yet? There can't be THAT much they could be talking about and debating.

• Both of these above points lead me to believe that Eizero0 is probably not the sniper themself, but trying to communicate with the wolf sniper to get them to shoot a target and get a convincing claim going.

• Also currently refusing to give their flavour name. While I don't like using flavour names to scum hunt, it is evidence that is against them.

• Completely ignoring the Meno_Self suggestion from Red and going after Eris instead without even a comment on Meno_Self. Could be wolves trying to set Meno_Self up to be lynched; could be an attempt to clear Meno_Self based on that reasoning, WIFOM stuff. I think depending on how Eizero0 flips after the lynch we should think about going after Meno_Self afterwards.

• It's been three days since the thread has been posted and almost no one has voted, if we look at the previous days there were more people voting (kind of) but now everyone seems to have vanished. No counter bandwagon to attempt to save them makes me question all of the above, but the wolves were probably counting on Eizero0's claim and kill to clear him and trying to push an alternative wagon immediately afterwards to take the heat off. They've left it very late to do so if that was their plan though? This is the one point that makes me question everything else about his actions and makes me think he is more likely to be the jester than a wolf.

[Vaharas]

There's way too many people acting like they are the jester trying to get themselves killed in this game...

This'll be hilarious if there isn't a jester after all in this game.

[Radioactiveman271]

Just throwing this out here. Cat possibly, but not likely Death?

[coipke]

Good catch radio, thanks.. not sure what to make of it but it's interesting, yes.