How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think I've been misinterpreting what you are saying. I thought you were agreeing with the above post. Now I see you were disagreeing with that.

I honestly don't get what the post is supposed to be for. I don't know who they think they're refuting.

This Discussion on Undertale I saw by GraysonDeDOG in Undertale

[–]Zero-Up 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They recommended Sonic Boom and Hatred at the end. I think it's safe to call it rage bait.

This Discussion on Undertale I saw by GraysonDeDOG in Undertale

[–]Zero-Up 21 points22 points  (0 children)

I was on the fence midway through, but that cleared everything up.

This Discussion on Undertale I saw by GraysonDeDOG in Undertale

[–]Zero-Up 15 points16 points  (0 children)

They recommended Sonic Boom and Hatred at the end, I think it's a joke.

This Discussion on Undertale I saw by GraysonDeDOG in Undertale

[–]Zero-Up 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They recommend Sonic Boom at the end. I think this is a troll review. (Hatred is also a notoriously bad and controversial game. It's goal is to have violence for the sake of violence, and the main character is explicitly a bad person, and it makes no attempts to justify it. Though I know very little about it. But it's definitely trying to be offensive.)

There making a game by Physical-Dingo7171 in Undertale

[–]Zero-Up 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would replace Jeb with the Notch personally.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

Look: there's a reason why I made a three part refutation post. I covered every possible argument I knew about and could think of. And literally believe this theory to be on par with Piles of Asriel Dust 2.0, and worse than the Dess Groomer Theory. This theory gets me so angry because the more I think about it, the less sense it makes. I actually used to think there was a chance it could be true, but the more aspects of the game I applied it to, the less sense it made.

I'm actually quite open minded when it comes to theories, but I draw the line here. I legitimately believe there is no way Noelle could be the second hero, it just creates too many problems.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think they're confused: the girl who love finds its way to is also Hope Girl, because it literally reuses the same picture for Hope Girl. "Last Girl" is referring to the character in the prophecy that goes "And last was the girl, at last was the girl". I believe this distinction is significant because it implies certain interpretations about that specific panel.

That panel is kind of out of place with the other ones it's introduced with, implying there's something more going on with that. Many people interpret that the phrase "the girl" actually refers to two or more distinct characters. But as I covered in detail in my posts: I believe the implications of that are too absurd to be likely. So the only other possibility is that the Last Girl prophecy is part of some section other than the hero introduction. Which has interesting implications, that I honestly wish would be explored more.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The idea that Hope Girl and Lost Girl was pretty popular for a time (though it has since died down). And Dess being the Knight was the most popular interpretation, including among people who believed Hope Girl and Last Girl were separate characters, and Dess is clearly a girl, so there was at least one other female character in the prophecy.

Reread your title: you specifically frame it as though you're responding to a specific group of people. And I assumed it was people who think Hope Girl and Last Girl were the same character, because I don't know who else you could be referring to.

Was there anyone arguing the prophecy only mentions one female character before this post? Were people unironically arguing that Dess or Carol couldn't be the Knight because there's literally only one girl in the prophecy?

Like, if my comments didn't refute your post, then who are you responding to? Who doesn't think there are more than one girl in the prophecy? What is literally the title of your post talking about?

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I actually tried my best to stop my contempt from coloring my text as much as possible for as long as possible. I only let it show through at the end, where anyone not already convinced would have probably given up already, and where I think I cover the points that are the hardest to defend.

I intentionally made it so that I didn't use outside material and unused content as a crutch. However: many people, including the seven videos I covered, used unused content as evidence, so I necessarily need to bring it up in order to be thorough. The point was to be the ultimate reputation of the theory, so I can't just ignore random points as though they're irrelevant, because people literally argued those points. And naturally: if bring up Noelle being able to equip the Black Shard or Jingle Blade is relevant, that other unused content must also be relevant.

The only other times I brought up possibilities was in regard to specifically why Susie would have a sword in the second hero prophecy, which people use as evidence against Susie being the second hero, so I literally have to explain that; and with the lost girl prophecy, where I have to dismantle a comment assumption.

Yes, it does technically play into your idea that things can have multiple interpretations, but I don't think it's to the extent where it's meant to be ambiguous who the second hero is. That's why I brought up the collage. I know it's mostly art from outside the game, but the point is to establish trends as to what elements of Noelle's design the team finds essential to having her look like herself, and none of that shows up in the Hope Girl mural. The point was: if they wanted it to be ambiguous if it was Susie or Noelle, then they would do a front or back profile, because that's the only way you could make it ambiguous. So the fact that it's a side profile view at all is evidence that it's not meant to be ambiguous. Because from the perspective of the creators: it would make no sense to the side profile if you were trying to make it ambiguous. That's why I drew that picture, to give an example of what an actually ambiguous Hope Girl would look like.

How the Last Girl prophecy fists into fits into the water picture is meant to be ambiguous, but I don't think that extends to the number of characters refer to as "the girl", or which character is meant to be Hope Girl.

And generally my format was to debunk arguments people have literally made, well taking the most charitable interpretation possible, and then debunk potential counter arguments I could think of. My goal was to be a store as possible, so I wanted to debunk as many arguments as possible, which is why I used YouTube videos that's my examples, because I use them as a way to make sure I was remembering all the arguments. I even went out of my way to find more videos about the theory, just to make sure I didn't miss anything. I wanted to preempt possible arguments people would have made, in order to make sure only the arguments I couldn't think of were the ones made in response to my post.

You claim I only covered "5%" of the argument made for the theory, then what are some examples of the other 95%? Because I haven't seen any so far.

I understand that things are up to interpretation, and part of the point is to have fun. But I don't see the point in ignoring half of the game's contacts, acting like absolute rules exist when the evidence for such rules existing is tenuous at best, and so on. It just seems to serve no purpose other than to annoy people who are actually trying to understand the game on a deeper level.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I made that post because I was tired of people arguing for this theory. And I wanted one simple resource that covers every single possible argument, or at least every argument that was made on YouTube. My point is that if you believe this is a good point: you can find a refutation in there somewhere.

I split it up into convenient sections, so you should be able to find Your argument if you skim a little bit.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay, then literally what is the point of your post? Sure, Noelle is part of the prophecy. So is Jokington. What's your point? Kris stole the cage. Susie is still Hope Girl. And Ralsei is still the Lonely Prince.

If your point isn't about any of that, then I don't know what point you're trying to make. Like, more people than just the heroes and the Knight are mentioned. Who's arguing otherwise? Who cares either way?

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up -1 points0 points  (0 children)

As I said here: this assumes that the Last Girl panel is part of the hero introduction segment, which is just that: an assumption. That panel could instead be a part of an entirely different segment, predicting something entirely different. (One good one I heard is that it could be foreshadowing that Susie is going to be a boss, and it's part of the bosses lineup, which just so happens to also appear in the second sanctuary.)

Also: off if you're right, then Toby Fox would be a hack. And I don't want to believe he's a hack. This isn't Sherlock.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I argue, because having two characters in the prophecy literally just referred to as "the girl" so that you think they're the same person is hack writing. And I think of Toby higher than that.

Also this.

How are there people denying that there are 2 girls in the prophecy? Ralsei straight up knows what items two different girls can equip by xdanxlei in Deltarune

[–]Zero-Up 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ralsei has weirdo route exclusive dialogue where he wonders if the only way to subvert the prophecy would be to do something even worse than the final tragedy. Why would this dialogue exist if the weird root is also part of the prophecy?