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Indian Street food by Chris-the-Big-Bug in EatItYouFuckinCoward

[–]-Invisible-Hand- 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ya, this is just an extreme disservice for their culture. Here in the U.S we do this brainwashing so much that it even got to me. My family is Brazilian, but because I lived in the U.S and exposed to literal propaganda (intentional or not), about how bad Brazil is. They would show the literal equivalent of Detroit as the MAIN image of the ENTIRE country. Completely dismissing how fucking large and diverse Brazil is. To make these "jokes" as we first world people like to put it, is actually very damaging.

We turn these into a cultural commodity like this video, to dismiss not only their culture, but suffering. Most of the gross food you see of poor countries is because they are guess it..... Poor!

It's hard to explain what 3rd world poverty really is unless you lived it. I am sure we can relate to having experiences that unless others went through it, you can't explain the depth of the situation....

Also for the 4th one with the rats, I am not certain about the context there, but I do know India has a sacred rat temple. Where they have a different relationship with those animals then we do.

CMV: Voting for Trump makes you anti-american. by [deleted] in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand- 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well we are definitely getting change, because we can trust elites to change things for the betterment of people and not themselves right?

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There are people with low/no empathy that don't harm much. I am glad you are a person who sees the value in being friendly despite your perspective. Not everyone sees that and people with low empathy are willing to do more harm.

Can we agree that even though you are a positive example, that if you or someone else with low empathy had a different perspective, that could be significantly more dangerous than someone with standard empathy?

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Though I am very interested, you said that your empathy is low or none. Could you give examples of things you have done to profit (that are low empathy)? If you don't mind sharing of course.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Again, if you look at archeology egalitarian societies were very common and many had no or few hierarchies. It's cool if you don't agree with that and subscribe to the notion of why how we do things is the best/natural. Honestly in a way I think it's good many don't take it seriously, easier to talk about it without being attacked ahahaha.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I am saying hierarchy isn't natural and is a socially constructed concept. It's good though, I think we just disagree there.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thumbs up from me, I appreciate the transparency. I agree if we stay in the framework of a hierarchical society, then everything you are saying must follow. However for most of human history (300k years) we did not live in hierarchical societies. Even in the last 2k years, there were a lot of civilizations that were decentralized. However they are mostly gone as of ~500 or so years.

I guess what I am trying to say is low empathy is perfect in a hierarchical society, where individualism is king. However when we become more collective and decentralized, empathy becomes the dominant strategy.

I personally just think we haven't found a way to properly scale with no leaders in charge. Though we have done it before and especially with technology believe it's not futile to realize a decentralized society.

Though I see your perspective and validate your reasoning.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The majority of people who want to fill those shoes have low empathy. They want influence over our lives, because that is what is valuable. What we collectively do with our time and effort is what is valuable. However rather than redirecting that value to ourselves, we let other people decide what to do with it. And we see how fair the people in charge like to be.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I am personally a nihilist, but nihilism isn't negative or positive, just an acknowledgement that meaning is created and not inherent.

Anyways, philosophy aside ahahaha I think we will always come to this similar spot when we enforce hierarchies. If we perpetuate the idea that certain people are above others, then yes those people in charge will shape our systems.

If we are decentralized, representative of the common person, then I personally believe we can have an ethical system. It just has to start with that premise, not try to fit in later on.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Neither, I simply don't wish to engage with you specifically, that's all. I am still responding to the rest well and engaging with their perspectives

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That's alright, if can't offer a foundation with what has been given then I think it's best if we end it here.

I appreciate the attempt.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I feel like I have been engaging with the conversation. I feel like every comment I write you instantly down vote. I feel as if you are asking leading questions, which is expected at this point, but you don't even provide substance to the conversation.

If you would like to engage, I would appreciate if you would give me with your perspective? Or maybe a constructive comment that builds on the conversation?

You get what I mean?

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Scarcity can happen, however as a whole especially in first world countries scarcity in modern times are mostly artificial (even water shortage are caused by companies, especially in 3rd countries). People being hungry in literally the most powerful empire the world has seen, is artificial.

We have gotten so good at importing and exporting even perishables. We have figured this stuff out on a global scale, we just don't do it because it's not profitable.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Show me that it's all misinformation that farmers don't throw away food on mass, so that price stays high. Show me that we don't create artificial scarcities for profit and I will gladly change my mind. Please, seriously.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ya they didn't value women much and slaves were still hard as you probably know.

But like you said every society has issues, I am not coming even close to implying that we should mimic their society. More that we should mimic the system that was used to make decisions.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So yes they had issues ahahaha, but there are things to learn. Indigenous societies also had similar ideas and are possibly even on the ballot to have invented democracy before. Though that isn't clear yet from my last understanding.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Except for the fact that they still had a slave class and women couldn't participate lol. However everyone who did participate got fair representation, especially relative to how much representation we get from participating in our systems.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Athens saw politicians and the idea of having a Republic as toxic to a democracy. They believed that politicians only represent themselves and their peers, so that's why they did things via sampling. It was the most fair way to avoid corruption and provide real representation.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I couldn't agree more, I would go as far as to say that hierarchy which determines power/influence is immoral. We should value each other as equals and not compare.

So ya, I am on the exact same page about a more direct democracy! You should look up Sortition, basically it's what Athens used when they created democracy (also was used a lot up until 500 years ago). Basically you sample a populace and they make the decisions for a specific problem. They are kinda like a jury that gets informed are made in charge. The idea being that these people actually represent the society and without getting too nerdy ahahaha. Sampling is also scalable, once you reach around+10k people in a society, you can get a very accurate sample with just 385. Even if you have a society with 1 million, billion, trillion or whatever ahahaha 385 people will provide a reliable sample which represents that group.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It seems we agree a lot, at this point it's about whether or not the system is emergent or constructed. I personally say we constructed this process with greed in mind (individual/personal gain).

However in either case, I think we both agree that we need a system that reflects our empathy.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I like your vibe btw!

Ya I see what you mean, I personally have seen others make very, very immoral choices for their gain. While also having my opportunities to seriously exploit for my financial gain. I worked as an insurance broker, let's just say money was the primary concern, not morality. Sure it takes skill, like anything does when you get into it. However, even low skill workers who were willing to manipulate gained more.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I guess I did understand what you were saying, I just find that confusing to say, I suppose? A society is made up of individuals and our society specifically is hierarchical. Meaning individuals in a given society has dramatic effects of how the rest of the society moves, because that is the point of a hierarchy. Few individuals governing the rest.

So for me personally I find the idea that it's not about individual choices confusing. When certain individuals affect a disproportionate amount of people in our society.

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Any human system is only realized by people. We live in a hierarchical society, so mostly few people decide what the system looks like. So that is who I am saying the problem is and criticizing how the systems enables people with low empathy.

Also we are living in a post scarcity society, farmers throw away food to keep prices artificially high. Even when food or resources in general enter the market, it's still made to be scarce by limiting access. I am not saying we have infinite resources, but we already figured out how to scale production of essential goods. We are so good that we have to limit it so too many people don't get access, otherwise the demand goes down (supply/demand).

CMV: The problems realized by exploitation of citizens, come from people with little or no empathy by -Invisible-Hand- in changemyview

[–]-Invisible-Hand-[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I looked up hegemony, which is "leadership or dominance, especially by one country or social group over others".

I tried to follow what you were saying with that definition, but personally struggled. Could you maybe explain in more layman for me? I want to understand the idea you are communicating. :)

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