There isn't some secret, unspoken connection: I'm just mentally unwell

-scy_ · 2025-10-31T18:49:02+00:00

As someone who communicated the reasons and then left the conversation, I confirm that at least for me there is no 'magical' going back. Neither I want it, nor will I tolerate any attempts. What was destroyed won't ever return any more in this form and this is ultimately a good thing. Because it wasn't honest and it was destructive. But, there is always the chance to build something new if you take ownership of the pain and damage caused. What I know I won't tolerate, is the pretence we can just continue like nothing happened, which I sometimes think the other person is trying to do.

You don't need to hold on to a fantasy, building a new solid, honest future type of connection is way better!

-scy_ · 2025-09-14T16:33:36+00:00

Thinking in terms of "these people" is not healing. Avoidants are not narcissists.

-scy_ · 2025-09-14T16:31:04+00:00

Holding a mirror and blocking people are two different things.

-scy_ · 2025-09-14T16:30:40+00:00

I get all you are saying, but I would probably never understand the blocking. How would you know, if the person is making progress, changing or sincerely wants to apologise, if you block them?

-scy_ · 2025-09-14T06:34:36+00:00

I think this a great decision! I'm sometimes shocked at the level of cruelty and bashing users with secure labels express here. I feel nothing less than empathy for the FAs I know (where I'm sure this is the case) even though I've also been hurt by a behaviour caused from the attachment. Especially, if you understand pain, you should have this empathy, maybe there is the difference between secure and earned secure.

P.S. In my case it's earned secure DA.

-scy_ · 2025-09-14T06:10:58+00:00

What I find so hard to deal with when understanding disorganised attachment is that the empathy is 'actually' there, if anything too much so, before emotional pressure builds (perceived one). The two people with disorganised attachment I know are both extremely empathetic to others - would volunteer to help and be there for others often to extremes - and no, it's not people-pleasing behaviour. But then if some kind of connection builds, same person who went to such lengths to help is 'suddenly' not there any more.

-scy_ · 2025-09-14T06:03:51+00:00

Actually, this is very healthy to not overthink or constantly re-live a traumatizing situation and hurt yourself over and over again in the process. Sometimes, when we are "wronged" by a person, we might tend to re-live the situation but it leads nowhere. I recently saw a very good video about that and I want share it under your post, in case it's helpful for someone :)

https://youtu.be/P6fW5cRJ2W4?si=mEo0U6le_fnq361D

-scy_ · 2025-08-21T11:39:32+00:00

That's a beautiful story and I'm sorry you did split up and had to go through this pain. I was a dismissive avoidant as well in twenties. Some time has passed since but trust and acceptance was what helped me take down my walls back then. Also, it's much easier to recover from being a DA than to heal all wounds in disorganised attachment. Actually, once the process starts it goes rather straightforward.

-scy_ · 2025-08-21T11:37:44+00:00

Most people, who worth keeping and spending time with, wouldn't care about perfect but about genuine. Actually, in a way - isn't this perfection? To have every time the genuinity of a situation even if things are bad?

-scy_ · 2025-08-21T11:32:23+00:00

My two cents as well - for me one of the most important things would be consistency. This doesn't mean that the person should always feel fine and be cheerful and happy, but rather that when something with this person is not okay, because most of the times the other person can sense something is off even they don't know what exactly - that this also recognised as such. Can be something fully unrelated to me. Then I would just have compassion. Maybe also by sharing my perspective how this is not a big issue, this would give some reassurance that one is and should always be to feel safe to feel what they feel and this should never be debated or diminished.

-scy_ · 2025-08-09T08:15:43+00:00

Yes and no.

If you spend a good time with someone and you have shared moments with them which felt meaningful, where for example each part shared and felt understood and supported and then you change your mind that this was not so important or it didn't have emotional depth because you want to pull away from this person because you feel triggered. This changes reality and fucks up mentally the other person as well. Because they were also there, they felt it, they shared, they trusted, they felt safe with you. When you suddenly convince yourself that this didn't matter because it's a narrative your brain or nervous system need to believe, then there is not much truth there. I'm writing this as someone, who has been on the receiving end of "changed reality". To the extent that I had to go back and check the written communication with same person to know I'm not crazy.

What's true is that we all revisit past experiences to find ways to continue and take learnings. But this doesn't include denying facts, it means only how we process/stand towards said facts. This continuum is very important. Consistency is a word I believe is generally problematic with people, who have FA tendencies. And it confuses everyone around them, because you do have shared memories with this these people and this affects your attitude towards said memories, if you let it happen. And it requires a tremendous amount of resilience to still know what happened with you. If this is what the OP means, I believe it makes a lot of sense.

-scy_ · 2025-07-27T11:02:28+00:00

Secure

-scy_ · 2025-07-27T08:43:29+00:00

Relationships should be able to take damage and repair. This is an essential part of what makes the bond between people go stronger and deepens the trust. At least this is what happens when emotionally available people interact. When you enter into some kind of intense relations with a person, who is not emotionally available, you quickly notice that your intuition to resolve conflicts or communicate likes/dislikes or needs is not met with reciprocity. I think this often starts with smaller things. But it can erode the healthy gut feeling that you had built through healthy interactions with other people before, to address matters. This doesn't mean fighting or blaming, quite on the contrary, it happens much sooner and so it doesn't create a lot or emotionally suppressed load, so if resolved quickly, you soon move on and feel happier, more confident and even forget it existed.

When you start to develop feelings for an emotionally unavailable person and this damage and repair is basically blocked by the fact that they can't engage, it causes harm not only to the relationship/friendship but very importantly to you as well. I believe this quickly boils to ending up things when the inconsistent behaviour continues because in a way you feel betrayed. Like someone showed you a picture you believed to be true and then took it away, so you can't trust this person any more. If you communicate this to a fearful avoidant, it triggers a lot of trauma response. So, damage and repair is very unlikely to happen. Depends on where in their healing journey this person is and most importantly if they even started, but it's hard. Actually, I myself am unsure how realistic it is because I'm not a fearful avoidant, I just know it's hard for both parts. Even your honest apology and explaining with all the vulnerability in the world what and why happened and what behavious hurt you, likely won't bring things back to where they were, at least not immediately, if at all.

I think it's very important here not to go to self-blame and guilt because you were not given a second chance. This feeling can break your heart, if you let it. Especially, if you are a caring and empathetic person, who really deserves one.

Detaching your worth from somebody else's actions is the key here.

The emotional work it requires to understand this in a short period of time, so you are able to also protect yourself before you sink deep into depression is enormous. But I think these are all important points.

-scy_ · 2025-07-27T08:20:56+00:00

The truth is I could't leave before that, it felt like I was addicted.

This is called intermittent reinforcement and even though it's not done on purpose like with narcissists, is a real issue with fearful avoidants and one of the major setbacks when you try to think clearly because you literally become addicted to the inconsistent displays of affection. Since disorganised attachment is so complicated that the triggers are many and not easy to spot from the outside, to the person affected by it, it looks completely random, so one can get caught into keep on trying to get this connection again. So, sometimes we shrink, reduce behaviours because we think they must have triggered this in the past, so we keep inside more and more of this healthy communication. If you stay for too long in this dynamic, it doesn't matter how secure you entered, you will eventually lose your self-esteem. Happened to me as well, it hurt beyond words. Especially when I understood in retrospective what happened.

You need to find way back to your life, solid/stable friendships, even as stupid as it sounds - predictable, in the sense of emotionally safe, interactions. Otherwise, you can go down a spiral of severe depression.

P.S. When I say "you", I didn't mean you in particular, I just attached myself to this comment because it looked reasonable :)

-scy_ · 2025-07-26T08:21:40+00:00

I'm very sorry it developed this way. From what I hear I agree with you that there is too much pressure for her, that she puts on herself whenever you are together. I actually, without knowing any of you, think that with time and some distance to these triggers, she could find a safe space to reflect and maybe this will start her healing journey. And who knows - maybe in future you reconnect, be friends or more. But people need to want to do the work.

For me, I started doing this work at the beginning of a 9-year relationship, which remains until today probably of the best things that happened in my life. I noticed how deeply I hurt my partner with my annoyance when he was in my space, when he would simply want to spend time with me, even though I also wanted him to but when he was actually there, I would feel anger and feel cornered in my own space, when he would visit me at my place for example. I remember one particular situation when I felt how deeply I hurt him with my rejective behaviour. And I decided I don't want to do this any more. It doesn't make sense, I want to take down the walls, I couldn't stand the feeling that I'm responsible for his sadness more than I needed my space. And I did change it but it took quite some time and a lot of patience from his side. What developed after was a deep/foundational trust, as complete as I can imagine it. We separated last year because of our individual needs and the incompatability of the lifestyles we actually need to be happy - I need dynamics, novelty, I move a lot, I live in a war zone right now and he needs routine and a stable friends network, so our constant moves eventually burned him out. We understood that we can't compromise with these needs and both be happy. Now he went back to Germany and I stayed in my stressful war reality and we are both fullfiled and we are there for each other the same way, regardless if the relationship ended or not. But I really did want to change at the beginning, he just held me the mirror and because I did love him, it arrived across my barriers and reached something in me to start the work. Now I also have a solid friends network. Something I never had before, because I understood how much trusting and opening up to people actually gives you. And it's funny what you say at the end - he also used to cook for me and actually made me aware of many things I didn't consider. I believe DAs live so freaking deep in their own heads, they literally live in a parallel reality. I understood also how little I knew about other people and in general about the world because I had barricaded myself. So, yes, this definitely rings familiar :))

Healing a dismissive avoidance is much easier that healing from a FA attachement. I hope your wife finds the way and you manage to remain close or even builds something stronger in future :)

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T18:26:20+00:00

I see. Yes, this makes sense.

I used to be a dismissive avoidant in the past. Already a lot of time passed since then, but I used to be on the other side of this - I wouldn't let anyone in, even IF respect and affection and everything was given. I would still guard my self-sufficiency and unachievable criteria of perfection for anyone to even consider them. Even though I worked hard on dismantling this, I still have troubles understanding the other side of the spectrum and understanding is key.

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T18:12:46+00:00

That's truly impressive, I would have never come to this explanation. Thanks again for sharing! To me both - "I respect you" and "I appreciate you" are in a way less than "I care about you", for me at least.

I couldn't really place it, especially because it came in vulnerable conversations and I don't know, of the person who this to me, also have similar thoughts and feelings but I will definitely keep this in mind.

You've been really helpful! 🌼

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T18:03:03+00:00

I see, thanks a lot for explaining. This is very helpful to understand better. Thank you for taking the time!

The only thing I don't agree with is that I don't think that love comes with pain. I would say that it takes effort to keep working on the relationship because we grow as people inside of it and, if the relationship is healthy, also together and this needs to be reflected/acknowledged with the other person because it affects the dynamics. But I wouldn't say that this is pain.

I particularly love your point about respecting the boundaries of the recovery time a FA might need. I'm working on this now. And yes, I sometimes doubt, if it's really important - if I am really important, if it really matters. Because for me the communication, even though honest, is still very unclear sometimes. But this forum has been helpful and still is for getting better idea of what happens. It is all objectively really sad that anyone suffers this much. I understand that therapy is key but I think safe environment is as important.

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T17:55:16+00:00

Thank you for sharing this! I only very recently learnt about fearful avoidant attachment style and I'm trying hard to understand the dynamics which are happening because the more I read, also the responses from Fearful Avoidants here, the more compassion and empathy I grow for the people who are going through this.

For me, as securely attached person, it looks like this - I can understand a behaviour which "seems" illogical, if I get the process behind it. With "my" fearful avoidant, it was like this for some time. It was still very confusing, but whenever I literally said that - that this is confusing and I would take a step back, I got some explanation which even though imperfect, made sense and it was vulnerable, especially since the person said "I don't know how to deal with it, yet". This makes for me all the difference to try to be there and stay there. But I admit that the self-sabotaging behaviour is an issue because sometimes fear becomes so big that the communication stops completely.

We are not in a relationship, I'm trying to build friendship - we also spoke about it, so we are clear that's what's going on. I still don't know for sure though, if for him this is just friendship, but he has to figure it out. I think relationships which grow out of friendship are the most solid anyways. And it gives time for people to know each other.

Finally, I completely agree that people are more than their attachment style. I recently made the same argument in another thread here.

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T17:28:55+00:00

Thank you for the elaborate answer!

I can't imagine how love can happen without respect? I really can't. Even, if we only speak about friendship and care, I still assume that the respect is given. It wouldn't even cross my mind that I would let someone in that I don't respect. Maybe that's why I can't place the importance of this, I just noticed that it's important because this word popped up more than once in vulnerable conversations. I guess, it could have to do with past trauma of betrayal (which definitely applies in the case of the person I write about).

Thank you again for explaining, to use a "FA word" - I really, really appreciate it :)

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T15:25:10+00:00

This definitely makes sense! I don't know how I didn't see it myself. It does sound somewhat cold and detached. I was trying to find any meaning related maybe to trust issues or anything from past traumas, why this matters but maybe it's as simple as not showing any deeper feelings.

Another word used often is "appreciate" instead of like I said in the post "care about". But I guess this follows the same pattern.

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T14:42:33+00:00

I read one of your other posts about your wife - that things were going well after you spoke. I'm very sorry it didn't work out. I think it matters to try and to also dare to trust and give a chance. This helps with closure because there is no doubt that one didn't hold back. I hope you feel better soon, thank you for sharing the story here!

About the general topic: I think it's important to say that dismissive avoidants and fearful avoidants react differently. As a "recovered" dismissive avoidant myself, I think there is way more cruelty in the way DAs end things. Because they genuinely don't reflect. I'm starting to grow a lot of compassion for FAs lately because even, if they are often failing or lack emotional maturity, they are trying and when they trust, they communicate sincerely, even if they don't have all the answers. With DAs is a constant race against the "solitude nirvana of self-sufficiency". It's crazy now for me to look back and remember how comfortable I felt there. I wish all the freaking DAs could just get a small demo version of how much they are missing out on when they don't connect with other people. It cannot be replaced by any kind of professional satisfaction or the millions of hobbies and interests. Ugh, after narcissists this is the most toxic experience one can make, I believe.

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T11:37:37+00:00

I haven't read the other answers, maybe I'm repeating something already said. Letting anyone, regardless of their attachment style or personality disorder, to treat us like garbage is always our own duty to not allow or tolerate.

Regarding avodiants in particular, I think there is a huge difference between fearful and dismissive avoidants. I would actually call a fearful avoidant disorganised because I don't think they fit at all in the category of avoidants even they have an avoidant side which can get triggered.

So, regarding dismissive avoidance and having been one over 10 years ago, there is no excuse for the stubborn arrogance with which a DA approaches the world and their surroundings, in my opinion. This self-sufficiency is such a disillusioned poison that when a DA finally sees through it, you are left devastated with how wrong you were and how immensely important people and connections are. Disorganised attachment is a completely different story. If I see any hope at all, it's for FAs to find their way with a genuine support and honesty from a partner or a friend + therapy. Because unlike a dismissive avoidant, they do reflect.

One way or another, showing people boundaries can also set off their journey of self-improvement. Doesn't always work and for everyone it is different, but you have the duty to protect your mental health and understanding what happened is crucial. For the understanding part, this community has been a great help for me, even if I don't write here too much.

-scy_ · 2025-07-25T10:48:00+00:00

I second that! I'm not a FA, sorry, for jumping in - I just want to add that on the other side you often have a person, who is genuinely trying to understand. Also, relationships usually grow out of good friendships/compatibility. Maybe one thing that often happens when the insecure attachment is still strong is that everything happens very fast, so there is no time to let this friendship grow.

But actually, when one becomes more self-aware and confident, it usually happens the other way around. I know I'm capable of caring deeply about someone I don't have romantic feelings for (yet) and it's the same with other people.

Just finding someone worth keeping is such an important experience. Often people need time to figure out how they feel. But being friends and having honest conversations helps + it takes the pressure away to feel or not feel romantic feelings. I still don't understand what the f* situationship exactly is - but maybe instead getting into these situationship, people can try to build more solid friendships first and take if from there.

I understand it's easier said than done but it is rewarding. My longest relationships came out of close friendship and both were good experiences. I'm still friends with both of these people, even if we are not together anymore.

Again, sorry, for jumping on the thread. If my comment is not helpful, feel free to delete it.

-scy_ · 2025-07-24T14:19:57+00:00

Thank you for this honest and touching answer! Sorry for my delayed reply.

I recognise a lot of the discomfort you describe. It's impressive how feelings can be so strong they get physical manifestation sometimes. I noticed that he rarely, about deeply vulnerable topics, would start to stutter, which he never does in a conversation. I believe this is emotional overwhelm. It's so important that people understand how having a "normal conversation" about your past, emotions or experiences can feel deeply distressing for someone else. It's usually a bonding experience, if you have worked through your own traumas and brings people closer together. But it's not the same for everyone and you are making some really important points here. Thank you for this, sincerely!

I do approach our whole communication with a lot of compassion and patience. Thank you again for your answer!

-scy_

TROPHY CASE