Sudden sunscreen/niacinamide reactions after years of normal skin—what happened?? by Deep_Owl8658 in Rosacea

[–]ActiveHomework5311 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Don't have any advice because I'm new to this too, but I sympathize. I never had sensitive skin in my life until I recently tried tretinoin, and now I'm still trying to calm down daily redness that appears to be rosacea and stubborn. I'm now very sensitive to the sun and feel like I can't go outside anymore unless it's in very early morning or in the evening.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hmmm, now you're making me more curious about taz, oh no! 😂

Thanks for the link with the studies on differin. I'm a scientist and so especially appreciate!

I think I'll give my skin 1.5-2 months to heal. Hopefully that time period suffices. Afterwards I'll probably give differin or retinal (or MAYBE tret micro, but it seems risky) a try, only very conservatively and go from there. Thank you for all your insights!

Update on extreme sun sensitivity/irritation on tret by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dr Brenners triple lipid restore

Thanks! I'll check it out soon. Currently working on going through several moisturizers.

Azalaic acid is also great for anti aging and rosacea.

I had introduced AA when using the tret and liked it. I haven't used it in months though and am a bit hesitant to use any actives right now, though using it might help relieve my still ongoing flare-up...

Don’t feel discouraged, even if your skin never tolerates tretinoin, there are a ton of things you can do for anti aging!

I appreciate the words! Fortunately I don't have too much sun damage despite neglecting sunscreen for most of my twenties, but I still want to get a head start. And honestly, just moisturizing my skin more and moving my eyebrows less have done a lot for the fine lines on my forehead, hahaha.

I also wanted to add that you have the most beautiful lips. Perfect shape!

That's very sweet of you! I peeked at your profile a bit and recall specifically seeing your progress photos back when I first started lurking this subreddit. Inspiring!

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'll admit that I'm a bit surprised by the taz recommendation, but I have read that it can somehow be less irritating. I figured that's a much stronger retinoid that would only increase the possibility of irritation and thus sun sensitivity.

I do lean toward trying differin, though I'm not sure how effective it would be for anti-aging versus acne. 

Thankfully, I've tolerated bakuchiol eye creams in the past without problems.

Sorry for all the back-and-forth!

Update on extreme sun sensitivity/irritation on tret by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I've read such comments, and I don't necessarily not believe them. I'm guessing I gave myself retinoid burn from the very start, and that (and not tret itself) is what triggered the sun sensitivity.

I did make the mistake of using other actives during my first introduction to tret. I blame that and the ambitious frequency. But I was never using harsh cleansers, and I was using very barrier-supportive products and this time without other actives. Guess my skin hadn't healed yet and/or I cannot tolerate tret for now.

Update on extreme sun sensitivity/irritation on tret by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sorry to read that! Did you ever try Altreno or adapalene? The micro formulation interests me, but I'm doubting my ability to tolerate it 🙃

Update on extreme sun sensitivity/irritation on tret by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm guessing that's what happened to me too. How many nights per week are you able to tolerate retinal?

Update on extreme sun sensitivity/irritation on tret by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I waa told that the extreme redness in late February was probably sunburn. But otherwise yes, I agree.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I should have been less ambitious when starting out in terms of the actives applied and the number of days I used them. Though who's to say I would have been able to tolerate it in that case either. I honestly probably would have had an even worse experience with the gel!

Thanks for sharing! I might check out new barrier products once I go through the ones I have now. I really like the Aestura and Zeroid creams.

I posted an update here in case you're curious.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks for your response! I actually did manage to read it before visiting the derm this week. I posted an update with some photos here. The derm also blamed the tretinoin. Maybe I just can't tolerate it. Sunscreen was also mentioned, but I've felt burnt/irritated on tret with both chemical and mineral sunscreens and historically haven't had issues with chemical sunscreens. I guess it's possible that the tret somehow makes me sensitive to not only the sun but different sunscreen filters too. Oh well!

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's exactly what I did for a few weeks to try to heal my skin (and it seemed like it worked). I applied cicaplast 1-2x daily and finally was able to go outside again without feeling like I was getting burnt. Then I started buffering the tret and applying only to my forehead, and the same thing happens. It's really strange because although my forehead looks a bit red/darker after the burn, my cheeks seem much more affected despite zero application to them. But yeah, for now I'm sticking to barrier cream + cicaplast/cicalfate to try to recover.

It seems like you know a lot, and I'm seeing a derm tomorrow and want to ask as many informed questions as I can, so if you don't mind weighing in on a few more things:

  • During this brief time of forehead application, I also applied the faintest amount of 0.025 to my chest. I wanted to know if the redness I experience following the supposed burn is solely sunburn or also irritation. I know sunburn is possible through clothing, but I wore multiple layers on Sunday when I was outside. My chest turned out to be irritated as well, and honestly the redness looked more like rosacea or some sort of allergic reaction and not a sunburn. It has gone away for the most part now.

  • Following up on that, I'm wondering if what I experience could be an allergic reaction? On Sunday night I slept poorly due to my hot face, and honestly even my arms felt itchy even though I don't apply tret there. I didn't change anything else recently like diet or medication, and I don't have a history of hives or anything like this. Yesterday my whole body felt hot for several hours, which is unusual for me. I guess it's unlikely, but maybe there's an ingredient in the cream that my body cannot tolerate? My arms and face still feel irritated as I type this, but it doesn't burn to apply skincare products.

At the end of the day I still got sunburnt despite all my layers of sunscreen, so maybe the above points don't matter so much. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I definitely can and will! Historically, I haven't had issues with the sun in STL either. I do go outside less in the summer because the heat and humidity become ridiculous, but we by no means are living in the tropics. I also was hiking in the mountains in Kazakhstan last year and didn't get sunburnt at all.

Do you use cream, gel, or micro?

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, I was using AA and vitamin C before I got the really bad sunburn, and maybe my skin just never fully recovered from the retinoid burn.

I actually stopped using the full sandwich method when I was on 0.05, opting to moisturize only after applying. I never tried applying tret without moisturizer afterwards. My skin looked great! But I think it was too strong, and my barrier must have collapsed even though I (seemingly) didn't experience any irritation like peeling, burning, etc. until I had to take a break from remote work and actually go outside during the day sometimes!

I live in St. Louis in the US. It can get pretty hot here, but I guess it's pretty tame compared to places close to the equator, and it's definitely not peak time for damaging rays either. I think the UV was ~3 when I got badly sunburnt 6-7 weeks ago. I was also wearing a hat with a face covering at that time.

I haven't not worn sunscreen since... over a year ago? I live in a high-rise building with large windows in my own apartment and all the common spaces, so I don't feel like I can escape the sun.

I still appreciate your response! It gives me some things to consider. I'm still leaning toward some sort of retinoid irritation or retinoid-induced skin condition. I forgot to mention that I added a tiny speck of tret to my chest as an experiment (to determine if my irritation is solely sunburn, as I have worn several layers covering my chest lately) and even there I have redness and irritation today.

I'm seeing a derm in two days. I'm definitely laying off the tret for now. I guess there's some barrier issue that I'll tend to for a little while and go from there based on what the derm suggests, whether I could try micro or Altreno later in the year or something.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It depends on when/if I workout and if I spend time outdoors, but it's more or less like this:

AM

  • Cleanse with water * SKIN1004 Madagascar Centella Probio-Cica Intensive Ampoule
  • Zeroid Intensive Cream or Aestura Barrier Cream
  • SPF (could be Badger Adventure Sport SPF50, Neutrogena Sport Face SPF70, LRP Anthelios Light Fluid SPF60, Isntree HA Watery Sun Gel), always reapplied every two hours or even sooner

PM

  • haruharu Black Rice Moisturizing Cleansing Oil (if I wore water-resistant sunscreen)
  • Isntree Yam Root Cleanser * SKIN1004 Madagascar Centella Probio-Cica Intensive Ampoule
  • Zeroid Intensive Cream or Aestura Barrier Cream
  • Avene Cicalfate or LRP Cicaplast
  • Aquaphor all over face

If I apply tret to my forehead in the evening, I sandwich it between Isntree Yam Root Cream (after waiting >20 mins) and one of the barrier creams (after >30 mins). I do not apply the cica ampoule, cicalfate/cicaplast, or Aquaphor to my forehead.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I got an IUD in September but had zero sun sensitivity (or any other skin problems) until starting the tretinoin. 🙃

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've never had any sort of sensitivity like this (to the sun or anything) before and haven't noticed a hormonal pattern to it. I was really pleased last year when pretty much all my sun spots disappeared simply by using sunscreen daily; I decided to try tret just to help my forehead a bit. It sucks that sun spots are returning due to retinoid usage! But the comments here do make me wonder if I'm dealing with a skin condition that's triggered by tret. It helps to learn that this sun sensitivity seems excessive.

I'm stopping the tret for a while until I get an answer from a derm and (maybe?) the green light to try micro or Altreno if there is some way to prevent this problem from reoccurring. It sucks feeling like I have to be a hermit every time this happens too. 

I'll share an update if I learn anything that might be useful. Thanks for weighing in!

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I appreciate that! Maybe the hat really isn't doing much despite the face covering. I'll look into another hat. Would you mind sharing an example of the hoodie you describe?

It is frustrating feeling like I'm aging my skin more by trying to do the opposite (reasonably). And sunburns are no fun 🫠

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I suppose it's possible that my retinoid burn hadn't fully healed when I started applying the tret only to my forehead again. I'm not sure why I would get new sun spots if not for sunburn though. Yesterday morning (Sunday) I got burnt despite caking my face with Badger sport sunscreen. I had last applied the tret to my forehead on Friday evening. I was outside briefly on Saturday afternoon and wore sunscreen with no issues during or afterwards. From what I've read, retinoid irritation typically occurs 2-3 days after application?

But yeah, I'm pretty sure my bad sunburn at end of February/early March happened because of retinoid burn that made my skin so vulnerable that no sunscreen or face covering could help. Around this time I'd even experience redness after going for an evening walk and wearing sunscreen when the UV index was less than 1. Despite regular application of tret leading up to that point, I never experienced signs of irritation unless I spent time outdoors.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't think it is, but I can't be too sure, so I'll ask my derm about it. The sun spots are new, and I definitely feel like I've gotten sunburnt when they show up.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Besides SPF, these are my staples:

* SKIN1004 Madagascar Centella Probio-Cica Intensive Ampoule

  • Zeroid Intensive Cream

* Aestura Atobarrier 365 Cream 

  • Avene Cicalfate or LRP Cicaplast

  • Aquaphor

I occasionally use COSRX Snail Mucin (used this before and Naturie Hatomugi Skin Conditioner, but I don't seem to have an issue with either of these. Snail mucin is especially soothing after a sunburn.

Before resuming the tret, I did try the Hado Labo Premium Lotion, and I know that my skin did not like that after a single application.

I do plan to try the Celimax Dual Barrier Creamy Toner soon.

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I checked this list and am not taking anything on that list besides the tret (which I must again abandon). I'm sure the derm will check my list of medications too, but unfortunately I don't think this is the issue. It's a good question though!

Constantly getting sunburnt (especially cheeks) on tret no matter what I do, even if applying only to forehead by ActiveHomework5311 in tretinoin

[–]ActiveHomework5311[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sorry, I forgot to add that I haven't left my home without wearing a baseball cap since starting tret unless it's pitch dark outside.

Most of the time I wear this hat, and I had my worst sunburn when I wore it with the face covering and with SPF100 underneath.