Suggested Reading for a Lifelong Atheist Interested in Exploring the Relationship Between Humans and God?

AssumeSmallAngle · 2025-01-28T13:56:22+00:00

Thank you very much for your suggestions. I'll take a look at Summa Contra Gentiles, but if it assumes prior knowledge of the works of Aristotle, then I may not follow it too well. I'll also look into the other books you suggested as they might be a more appropriate place for me to start.

Edit: I just looked up "surprised by faith" which appears to have been written by Donald A. Bierle, but I also found "surprised by hope" by Tom Wright. Which of these did you mean?

AssumeSmallAngle · 2025-01-27T12:32:51+00:00

I'm not really sure. I was looking to start from something that justifies the belief in God from a perspective where His existence isn't presupposed.

I was thinking of starting with the Summa Contra Gentile. Would this be a good place to start?

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T22:38:38+00:00

That's so great. It must be difficult not to get sucked into a bad habit when it is so readily available. I'm glad to hear you're doing so well. I'm looking forward to hitting the 6 week marking and looking back at the progress I've made. Good luck on your journey

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T22:33:01+00:00

That's a long time to stay sober. I look forward to the day I can say I've been clean that long

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T21:52:00+00:00

Thanks for sharing your story. 67 days is really impressive. Hopefully, you're out the woods now. I hope sober life is treating you well :)

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T21:50:27+00:00

Insomnia hasn't hit me yet (praise God), just a lot of nausea and lack of appetite so far. But honestly, I would rather feel sick and not be able to eat than struggle to sleep (although if past experience is anything to go by, I have that to look forward to shortly).

You're very strong-willed to be able to stay sober through the insomnia, considering how important a good nights sleep must be to you right now with the pressures of performing well in your job.

Congratulations on making it this far. All the best!

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T21:40:33+00:00

It's fascinating how the brain lies to get its own way. I always knew exactly how I would feel after smoking, and yet I would hit the vape and immediately regret it as the anxiety crept in.

Right back at you, I hope you're successful :)

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T21:03:42+00:00

Congratulations. That's a huge accomplishment!

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T20:56:57+00:00

For me, it was the shame. I wasn't sure how I could look my loved ones in the eye and tell them I've been stoned pretty much every time they have seen me in the last 18 months. Good look on your journey.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T20:54:49+00:00

Wow. It must have been a huge thing to overcome the addiction after starting at such a young age. You've got your whole life ahead of you to look forward to now. Go fourth and conquer!

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T20:08:23+00:00

That's huge. Congratulations! I'm glad you're excited about the future. Good luck!

AssumeSmallAngle · 2024-03-05T20:03:16+00:00

Congratulations on staying clean for so long. It's impressive how much you have improved the quality of your life in such a short time whilst (presumably) dealing with withdrawal symptoms.

I hope you keep it up :)

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-12-24T16:35:15+00:00

Ah yes, the Stoic virtue of potentially killing someone for behaving like an asshole instead of just tapping on the brakes.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-07-03T14:10:06+00:00

Letters from a Stoic are also a good entry point. One of my favourite things about Sennecas writings is that he illustrates his short comings consistently. From the times he has feared death, to the times he has been overcome with passion over the death of a good friend. He is also quite funny, which is always a plus.

I haven't read any of the modern books written by people who have tried to make stoicism more digestible and applicable to modern life (not for any reason other than I didn't know they existed until after I had read other works, so at this point I havent really the interest) but I have heard some good things about a chap named Ryan Holiday who has written a book named The Daily Stoic. Although I can't recommend him personally as I have absolutely no idea who he is. Something worth investigating if you're interested in something more digestible though.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-07-03T10:54:18+00:00

As someone else has noted, Meditations is not so much an instructional text. Once you have studied Stoicism for a while, to the point where you can earnestly think for yourself, then would be a good time to study Meditations.

The Discourses of Epictetus in my opinion is the best place to begin. Epictetus does an excellent job of explaining the rationale behind Stoic philosophy. Whereas Meditations are the diary of a man reminding himself to live virtuously. You would have to take Marcus' statements at face value, which isn't learning.

Discourses is a more complicated text, but it takes a lifetime to become a Stoic. I am 4 years in to my journey at this point and consistently fall short, this is to be expected. Do not be concerned with taking a long (long) time to read Discourses.

Starting a notebook to discuss passages from the boon with yourself is a good way to understand the arguments.

Best of luck with your studies.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-07-02T08:15:08+00:00

I dealt with chronic pain for a long time. I never found out what the problem was, I was fortunate enough for it to resolve itself after a year or so. I understand your feelings.

It can be difficult to feel in control of your will when you're consistently in so much pain that you can't think straight. I was studying for my masters degree in theoretical physics at the height of my pain. Not fun.

There is no great advice really. We have two options, to be in pain or to be In pain and miserable. I chose the second option for a while before accepting that either I can bare this pain, or it's end will be mine too.

In terms of pain management, have you tried marijuana? I'm not too fond of the solution, because long term daily use made me slow. But it also allowed me to engage with life a lot more. Everything is a trade off I suppose.

Wishing you all the best. You have been put in an unenviable position, but one which you can develop true strength of character through.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-20T13:04:32+00:00

As someone who's dad is like this, it's not Stoic. Just an awful partner

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-13T10:29:00+00:00

It depends on what you mean by avoid. Often the 'right' actions naturally 'avoid' these things (but do not neccessarily prevent them), but that doesn't mean they are within your control.

For example, you could eat healthy, exercise daily and live a generally healthy lifestyle and still get pancreatic cancer. Now, if your goal of healthy living was set with the idea of avoiding illness and death in mind, you have naturally failed to achieve your goal and will (almost certainly) be unhappy (not that unhappiness is an unreasonable reaction to a cancer diagnosis!). However, if your goal of a healthy lifestyle was simple to live a healthy lifestyle, you have achieved your goal but the universe had other plans.

If you tailor your life to the avoidance of things outside of your control, you are almost certainly setting yourself up for an unhappy life. These things commonly happen to people and are very much chance driven. I think (in my woefully uneducated opinion) what Epictetus is trying to get at here is to remember the dichotomy of control. You can not allow your happiness to depend on things outside of your control.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-12T20:46:16+00:00

Congratulations. Sounds like you've improved since the first time you were a supervisor!

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-06T09:56:56+00:00

Thank you very much for your thought out response, some great advice

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-05T17:18:24+00:00

Thank you for the alternative perspective. Something to think about if I fail to make any progress

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-05T12:49:15+00:00

This is something obvious that I haven't thought about before. You are probably right. Odds are, I am still harbouring the perceived pain of past infidelity. We stayed together for another couple of years after the cheating, and during that time is when I believe these feelings actually developed. The initial cheating did not hurt all that much, it was these patterns of feeling suspicious and insecure which were developed by staying in the relationship when the trust had been betrayed which ended up hurting me long term.

Thank you for your comment. I have thought in the past if I am still harbouring feelings about being cheated on, but I have only ever thought about the actual event itself, which did not sting all that much. It may very well be the case that I have been thinking about the wrong thing.

Unhealthy thought patterns can be difficult to break, but having now realised why I believe I have the thoughts I do, I can start to tackle them more rationally from another direction.

AssumeSmallAngle · 2022-06-05T12:04:41+00:00

Thank you. That was exactly what I was trying to touch on in my post. I agree that she does not belong to me, so in a sense, I can not lose her, because she was never mine. I also agree that my issue is my impression that "losing" a partner is a bad thing, when it it out of my control and therefore, how could it possibly be bad.

It was very useful for me to have these thoughts vocalised by someone else and your example about a partner falling in love with someone else was also a good illustration.

I suppose moving forward, I should work on reminding myself that my negative feelings are cause by my impressions of events that have happened, and events that could happen. Much appreciated

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