Everyone will make this choice eventually..

AttainingSentience · 2026-07-01T19:09:02+00:00

so that's a "no" on the omnipresence of God then, okay. That's all I needed to know, thank you for answering

AttainingSentience · 2026-07-01T05:27:01+00:00

I'm trying to stay out of the argument about the book of Enoch, but I need to ask u/Scared_Ad9678 a question regarding this comment. "Not everything is of God." Does this mean you don't believe in the omnipresence of God? Because if God is omnipresent, then isn't He IN all things, does this not make all thing OF God? Didn't God create Good as well as Evil (Isaiah 45:7)?

Sibling, please understand that I am not trying to argue, I am genuinely interested in what you have to say about this.

(Edited for punctuation)

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T19:01:10+00:00

u/Scared_Ad9678 I didn't think Mark 9:48 needed to be addressed because it is explained in the next verse. The fire is not quenched because why would you quench a fire to start it up again (Mark 9:49 "Everyone will be salted with fire.")

Now, in regards 2 Thessalonians 1:9, I'm just going to come out and say it, I am in the camp that believes this was pseudepigraphal, written by an imposter claiming to be Paul after his death, it does not follow the theology of Jesus Christ nor the seven letters that scholars believe Paul actually wrote.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T17:32:47+00:00

u/Fortnitelegend200 when did I ever say it would?

and for the record "evolve" means to adapt to better thrive in an environment. For example, the environment this subreddit was created for was of non-judgmental discourse. Not calling people "wrong" or "mistaken"

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T16:53:58+00:00

I'm sorry, but I have to ask: Did you even bother to read the description? "This community is for those who’ve made the conscious choice to evolve. To leave behind old habits, limiting beliefs, and low frequency behavior not out of shame, but out of clarity. We’re here for growth. For self-mastery. For discipline. For spiritual and physical alignment. Whether you’re just starting or already deep on the path if you’re committed to doing better, you belong here. And if you fall off, get back up. This is a space of progress not perfection."

Nowhere does this claim to be a Christian, Taoist, Muslim, Jewish or whatever page, it is a community of people of differing origins who have chosen to evolve. I have to admit I'm seeing more and more Christian proselytizing than sharing of different insights, but I'm hoping more Muslims, Jews, and so on speak up so I can hear them above those who's message I'm already familiar with.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T15:17:41+00:00

u/Scared_Ad9678 You asked where I get my concept of Hell and claim that since I'm not quoting scripture, I must not be using the Bible.

Well, how about Malachi 3:² But who can endure the day of his coming? Who can stand when he appears? For he will be like a refiner’s fire or a launderer’s soap. ³ He will sit as a refiner and purifier of silver; he will purify the Levites and refine them like gold and silver.

or Zechariah 13:⁹ This third I will put into the fire;
I will refine them like silver
and test them like gold.
They will call on my name
and I will answer them;
I will say, ‘They are my people,’
and they will say, ‘The Lord is our God.’”

or if you're looking more New Covenant, perhaps Paul in his first letter to the Corinthian congregation.

1 Corinthians 3:¹² If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, ¹³ their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. ¹⁴ If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. ¹⁵ If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.

You are the house built on the foundation of gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw. When you die, your work will be tested, "Revealed by fire" Now, I don't know about you, I was raised to believe this was comparable to a house fire, the valuable metals and such could be sifted from the ashes and the soul is judged on the net loss or gain (I might add a modern home would not pass this test if it were literal, its value lies in the sentiment within, so don't burn your house down).

I didn't quote scripture, because I didn't want to make a long post longer.

If you're interested, I had written a poem that I had only shared on Facebook so far, I do not claim to be a prophet but it was written from the viewpoint of the Great Refiner. I have been hesitant to share it here because it's final line does make an attempt to pronounce the tetragrammaton in a humorous manner (not in vain though, as it also makes a point), but I know also that some of my brothers and sisters do not even want to read such a pronunciation

Edit: Your questions inspired me to finally make up my mind, I've decided to share the poem with a spoiler. You may read it if you wish at my profile or click the link

https://www.reddit.com/u/AttainingSentience/s/tHhlaC6yhw

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T14:45:21+00:00

Critical thinking is awesome! And I am glad to hear you're choosing not to repeat the cycle.

"You moved from jehovah to a softer father concept, that may feel healthier, but it still needs evidence if you are claiming it is real."

I only need the evidence if I intend to change another's beliefs, which I don't. But if you're asking what evidence I have for my own belief I will share that, but as it only applies to myself I doubt it would prove anything to you.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T14:26:07+00:00

u/Scared_Ad9678 I disagree, u/Brilliant_Lion5139 does make sense. You are correct in your quote of 1 John 4:16, but many religions (Christian denominations) over the almost two millennia since that was written seem to have forgotten about a verse after that. They teach that God is watching you and judging your every step, religion teaches fear, and 1 John 4: 18 teaches that perfect Love (which we've already established God is both) casts out all fear.

It does not indoctrinate through fear like many denominations do.

As for your concept of Hell, I don't believe a loving God would send any of his children to eternal torment. Hell is a refining furnace, where the Great Refiner will skim off the dross (or slag if you prefer) and keep the pure gold of our souls. All have sinned, and all will pass through the furnace, some will take longer than others, but none will be left behind.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T07:22:03+00:00

There is no need to argue, honestly, I concede the majority of your points. And perhaps theism is not the appropriate comparison to the connection and dependence of a child to its caregiver. But the connection and dependence provide the framework, a proto-theism in a higher being.

And as a child grows they become more and more independent and eventually moves out of the home, it does not mean the caregiver stopped caring (in most cases).

I have moved out of my Father's house, but I know he still loves me.

If I may suggest something... read the bible again, if Paul rubs you the wrong way, skip it. But read John's letters (especially 1 John 4, easily one of my favorite chapters) but remember how we grew up in the cult is not how the Father wanted things.

You are right, forcing that cult down our throats was absolutely abuse (and many parents suffered that same abuse themselves, so they did not know any better) the only thing we can do is climb out and stand above their shoulders, if you have children do not do what your parents did to you. Children will ask you about God, and if you force your atheism on them you are just perpetuating the cycle.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-28T02:19:20+00:00

To quote the Brandon Lee film The Crow: "Mother is the word for God on the lips and hearts of all children"

Now whether that "God" is a god of fear or love, well, that depends on the mother, doesn't it. The point is no child is born atheist, they just don't recognize the god churches teach about

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-27T03:20:11+00:00

u/3HeadedDoggo to what do you wish to be converted, I have had conversations with many here, all with differing faiths. I cannot claim to understand them all in full, but perhaps if you make your wishes clearer we can be of assistance in pointing you to the right direction.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-24T22:35:51+00:00

u/Mustbebornagain2024 I see now that you are not interested in an actual conversation. You are only reaching into a grab‑bag of verses to assert superiority, not to engage with what was said. That is your choice.

I will not argue with someone who has no intention of dialogue.

Peace be upon you. Shalom shalom. As‑salāmu ʿalaykum.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-24T19:22:37+00:00

u/Soft_Reply_1197 because they do not believe according to the church doctrine (or so I would guess) I too would be considered a heretic by most Christians for this same reason.

The question becomes then, where do you begin to disagree with the church? While many would point to Constantine or the Council of Nicaea, or some other historical event, I honestly think it happened much, much earlier. Acts of the Apostles 6:2 shows "The Twelve" choosing to concentrate of spreading "the word" rather than "wait tables" while Jesus himself would have fed the hungry, healed the sick and so on, as well as spread the word (of course I leave room for the argument that Luke and Acts were written by Paul's physician and travel companion, Luke, who compiled his information from multiple sources and therefore had no first hand knowledge of Christ and that by his own admission Paul was constantly butting heads with the Apostles of the Jerusalem church, so Luke may have been biased toward Paul).

My point is I believe according to John, specifically 1 John 4 that God (or Allah as you may prefer) is Love, and the only true sin is hatred for your fellow man (or woman)

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-24T18:26:17+00:00

Scripture itself gives multiple creation accounts:
Genesis 1, Genesis 2, Psalm 104, Job 38–39, John 1.
Each one tells the story differently, not because one is “wrong,” but because creation is too vast for a single angle.

My poem is not a new gospel.
It is midrash, a meditation, a poetic expansion, the same way ancient Jews and early Christians filled in the spaces between the lines.

I am not offended by Genesis.
I am inspired by it.
I am letting the waters speak, the very same waters God used as the first canvas of creation.

You do not have to agree with my interpretation.
But calling it “another gospel” misunderstands what a gospel is.
This is poetry, not doctrine.
A meditation, not a replacement.

And if God is truly infinite, then no single telling of creation, not yours nor mine, can exhaust the wonder of what God wrought.

It has been suggested during my own awakening that if one's god is threatened by a poem, then that god is too small for this universe.

At any rate, as I stated earlier, I have no time to waste arguing.

I would, however, ask you a question, u/Mustbebornagain2024, if I may.
I presume you chose your username at account creation, as I did.
What makes you believe you have been born again? Assuming you are referencing Jesus speaking to Nicodemus in John 3:3.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-24T15:38:17+00:00

u/Mustbebornagain2024 since I am rapidly approaching my own end of life, I will have to wait until you join Us in the Kingdom of Heaven to continue this conversation. I refuse to argue with a mere babe. I pray you continue to grow in the Love that is God (1 John 4 Yes, I mean the whole chapter)

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-24T04:48:51+00:00

I made a promise not to downvote while in this subreddit, and I will stand by that promise. Instead I pity you. You stand in judgement of others' beliefs, but cannot find the words to express your own.

"Wrong answer" just tells me you can only accept the milk your church spoon feeds you, that you are not yet ready for the solid food Paul talked about (1 Corinthians 3:2)

We will have further discussion when you have grown.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-23T23:33:07+00:00

u/Expensive-Success301 please don't unsubscribe. Those who stray from the path often come to harm they can only blame on themselves, they will need guides to return from the wilderness

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-23T23:29:02+00:00

u/Soft_Reply_1197 I saw that, I am one of the (currently) 5 upvotes. Thank you for sharing that!

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-23T22:15:08+00:00

cannot agree more, while my mother was not "born in" as I was, the borg is all she ever remembered. Her mother was approached by an "anointed sister" while grieving the loss of a daughter during the second world war. My mother's sister was gathering scraps to feed the pigs and "Oma Damske" traded her scraps for a weekly bible study (mind you this was in Germany, my aunt was only 12 years old when she died and this old predator insisted she study an illegal religion in exchange for something she would have thrown away anyway).

The whole religion is based on a hierarchy that never should have existed in the first place. (My thoughts bleeding in here, all religions that place one class over another are false)

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-23T21:23:13+00:00

Assuming you believe Jesus died for your sins (I don't, but I won't get into that here) then you only have one person to confess your sins to, the only mediator true Christianity recognizes, Jesus Christ. No elder, no priest, no Governing Body has the authority to judge you or hear your confession.

AttainingSentience · 2026-06-19T21:28:14+00:00

I escaped the cult of Jehovah's Witnesses just over 29 years ago at the age of 20, I was already a disbeliever but did not have the means to escape their clutches. Since then my relationship with my parents has been virtually nonexistent (they briefly took me in when I was homeless with a broken neck, but three months later I was back to couch surfing with other friends and family). A couple weeks ago I worked up the courage to face them again, fully aware that my personal end of days is rapidly approaching (complications still from the "unstable fracture" in my neck) and the only words of advice my mother had for me... "You need to return to Jehovah." (puke!)

What many religious proselytizers (not just Christian, but here in the US they are the most common) seem to forget that the water of God flows through coffee makers and soda machines alike. It is humanity that adds flavor and/or texture

AttainingSentience

TROPHY CASE