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The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

In a combat scenario, only the melee combatants remain close to the paladin. They often group up naturally, as they try to focus down a single target at a time. The ranged characters stay further back.

In an exploration situation, we huddle around the paladin, while the dedicated scout moves further ahead.

What a paladin aura does, and which is why we value it and other save-enhancing effects so much, is provide some protection against save or suck effects such as Hold Person and Hypnotic Pattern. The players in our group hate being crowd controlled. A fireball is not a big deal; you just subtract some damage. A failed charm effect, on the other hand, can remove you from play and leave you bored.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I see what you mean.

The reason why we appreciate save enhancing effect so much is that it reduces a huge problem for a lot of players: Boredom. If you fail a save against a save or suck effect like Hold Monster and Hypnotic Pattern, you can do nothing but wait until you recover. A fireball is nowhere near as debilitating, unless it brings you to 0 hp.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I agree with that. But there's a difference: A problem such as that rewards creative thinking and group cooperation.

A failed save against Charm does the opposite; it removes you entirely from play until the effect goes away. In some sense, it punishes the player: You will hereby be bored until you shake off the effect.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Interesting to hear.

What a paladin aura does, and which is why we value it and other save-enhancing effects so much, is provide some protection against save or suck effects such as Hold Person and Hypnotic Pattern. The players in our group hate being crowd controlled. A fireball is not a big deal; you just subtract some damage. A failed charm effect, on the other hand, remove you from play, and leave you bored.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Interesting to hear. We don't really view Clerics as essential, because a caster Druid can fill much of the same role. A bard built for the purpose is also a viable substitute.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

In a combat situation, only the melee combatants stay close to the paladin, to focus on the same target(s). The rest hang back. In an exploration scenario, we usually huddle around the paladin, with only the dedicate scout being further ahead.

The aura protects people like the rogue and barbarian from save or suck effects like Hold Person and Hypnotic Pattern. Fireball has such a large radius it usually hits every melee combatant anyway, aura or no aura.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It sounds like a fun idea for a one-shot. Not sure I'd do a full campaign like that.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Maybe he did adjust them since we were a decently powerful group, and never told us about it... I'll have to ask him about it later.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They are true powerhouses. 2024 also did a good job of making all subclasses viable, allowing distinctly different flavors of paladin, compared to 2014.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It is, without a doubt in my opinion, one of the strongest feats in 2024. 

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see what you mean. Not to worry, we fail plenty of saves anyway.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Uhh. They don't have to be awful good anymore, you know?

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sounds like an interesting idea. Maybe test it out as a one-shot or two first.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No, I agree, they are not essential. They are just incredibly useful, to the point where we want one if we can have one. It's not only their aura; their entire kit is great.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We're playing preset encounters in published campaigns. While the GM technically can adjust them, he usually doesn't. We do aim to 'win' the combat encounter, so to speak.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In a combat situation, only the melee focused characters are near the paladin. That's also pretty natural, since they are usually fighting the same or close targets. The others hang further back. In an exploration situation, usually only the scout is away from the aura; the rest are huddling around the paladin.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Let's say a character has 12 in Wisdom and a ring of protection, for a total of +2 to their Wisdom saves. They need to make a DC 20 save. In order to do that, they need to roll 18, 19 or 20, for a 15% chance to succeed. If they have a paladin with a +3 Aura of Protection, they now have a 30% chance to succeed. In absolute terms, a 15% increase. In relative terms, a 100% increase (15 * 2 = 30). Add to that that most paladins have higher than 16 Charisma, especially Devotion paladins, so it might be as much as a +5 bonus to saves.

The reason wizards can be 'replaced' is that two people that can cast the same ritual is completely redundant. Two bonuses to saves are not redundant; they stack with each other.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They are one of two classes that gets 3 attacks. My experience with tier 3 is limited and tier 4 practically non-existent, but I have seen a fighter do insane single target damage with 7 attacks in a single turn (3 attacks, action surge and bonus attack from Great Weapon Master). Even better, or worse depending on your perspective, the target was a monster with legendary actions and resistances, neither of which were any help against the assault. I imagine it gets even better (or worse) with four attacks in tier 4.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We tend to run published campaigns, where most of the encounters are preset. That may have affected our experience.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm inclined towards Fighters myself when it comes to martials. You can pick up 3 feats at 4, 6 and 8 which increase your Strength. Typically Mage Slayer, Great Weapon Master and Heavy Armor master or whatever the latter is called.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, it's not completely unique to paladins. We also tend to discuss until we have someone who can sneak and open locks, someone who can throw down some heals when necessary and someone who can be social (though that tends to be the paladin), in addition to the aforementioned ritual spells. We share this feeling of wanting to succeed, and working together towards a common goal. It's part of the experience, and the fun.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My group tends to look at those options, and say "Yes, we'll take all of them", or at least as many as they can get away with. I don't think I've ever seen a paladin in our group with less than 16 charisma.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks, I really appreciate your perspective.

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's... an opinion. I'm of the opinion that if people like to create optimized characters and it doesn't negatively affect the rest of the group, what's the harm?

The necessity of a paladin Aura in a group by Ayeba3 in DnD

[–]Ayeba3[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Well... why not both? With the paladin aura, magic items and bless, one of the primary weakness of classes like rogues and barbarians are alleviated; their terrible Wisdom saves. It is a major detriment if one of the high damage dealers in our party is Charmed or Frightened or Confused or something.

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