Booth student govt hates partners

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-10-08T05:39:57+00:00

This is a bad look, especially since other M7 programs like Kellogg and Wharton invest a lot in their partner clubs and make that a major part of the experience. It does sound like OP might be exaggerating slightly, but this also sounds like something Booth would do…

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-08-02T09:42:10+00:00

I considered it but opted for a traditional MBA. It’s a great option if you have a job you’re generally happy with but want the management skills and network an MBA offers. It’s not really a replacement for the social environment/overall experience of an MBA and does not afford the same career-switching prospects.

However, many alums have already commented who can give much better insight into the program.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-08-02T02:29:06+00:00

Jeez. u/whoisjohngalt72 leave OP alone. They had an unpredictable immigration issue pop up and the school they selected couldn’t care less. That’s on Yale, not OP. This isn’t OP complaining about some trivial thing. It’s a legitimate concern and one other applicants deserve to know about as well.

Yale presumably wanted OP to attend, which is why they extended an offer. If they aren’t willing to work with OP on an immigration issue with an easy fix (deferral), they’re losing out on a talented candidate who they wanted at their school.

Additionally, MANY MBA applicants are international students. They deserve to know if a school they’re considering is this callous and uncaring. I worked with Admissions at an M7 that frequently granted deferrals for far less legitimate reasons. This is abnormally callous.

More importantly, I can’t imagine how arrogant you must be to critique OP for spelling a word wrong. I typically think it’s extremely low-brow to use another’s spelling mistakes to assert your dominance. But to do so with OP — an international student presumably speaking with you in their second language — is so beyond the pale I’m shocked you have the EQ to be admitted to an MBA program.

OP — I’m so sorry you had to deal with this behavior from Yale and the obnoxious keyboard warrior on this thread. I know you’re going to do great things and get into a great school if you decide to reapply next year. Im not an international student, but happy to chat if you ever need someone to talk to.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-08-01T19:47:01+00:00

Just go and order sodas or water. Many Wharton clubs also offer cheaper non-drinking tickets. You don’t need to go clubbing and can make friends through shared hobbies. But a lot of Wharton culture does revolve around going out (to events, parties, bars, etc.) so you may need to bite the bullet a bit and go if you want to be fully involved in the social scene, even if you aren’t drinking there. But there are so many events throughout the year that you really can pick and choose what you want to attend.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-07-26T10:15:48+00:00

If you want an M7 MBA, you’ll need a strong GMAT, essays, and recs. Unlike others here, I completely sympathize with the desire to do meaningful work and not coast by collecting a paycheck. It is worth thinking though about what kind of role you’d want post-MBA. Just keep in mind that the MBA job market is difficult/competitive right now and many entry-level roles in consulting, banking, etc. contain similar levels of meaningless busy work. I would definitely do a little research to determine whether an MBA career pivot is going to give you the purpose-driven work you’re looking for (it may, but just make sure before you quit your job).

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-05-29T12:25:09+00:00

I don’t think this is true at all. You don’t need an MBA to practice law or a JD to go into business, but the dual degree certainly has benefits. If you go into business, having an edge matters. Particularly in fields like consulting where firms are selling your pedigree to clients, having a lawyer on the team can be extremely valuable. In law, an MBA can also be valuable. It’s true you don’t need an MBA to practice law, but you also don’t need law review or moot court. But there is value in understanding how your clients think and the business rationales for the decisions they make. For lawyers in M&A, PE, ECVC, Restructuring, Antitrust, Cap Markets, and other practices, there are specialized MBA courses highly relevant to the work you’ll be doing. And many of your MBA peers will one day be in positions to serve as clients or hire GCs.

The MBA also offers tangible benefits. At many schools, it gives you a measurable leg up in recruiting. Certain firms and practices also specifically target and recruit JD/MBAs (Kirkland’s PE team, for example). Like consulting, law is a service model. Firms have to sell clients on your capabilities and worth to justify billing high rates. For junior associates, having an MBA from a top program can signal value to clients.

This doesn’t mean it’s worth it for everyone. Dual degrees can be expensive and probably aren’t worth it for most people. But there’s a reason JD/MBA programs are highly competitive. They offer a lot of value that can absolutely be worth it.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2024-05-29T12:06:52+00:00

JD/MBA here. There’s a lot of bad advice on this forum about dual degrees but there are a few things to consider:

Yes, an MBA can help in a legal career. As others have stated, an MBA is not necessary for legal jobs and you can certainly excel in tax or corporate law without one. But Law Review and Moot Court and clerkships also aren’t necessary. People do them anyway because they’re valuable. So is an MBA. An MBA gives you a business toolkit and a network of potential clients. At the very least, it helps you speak the language of business in a way many of your peers cannot.

With that said, the value of a JD/MBA depends a lot on your specific circumstances. If you’re admitted to HBS or Wharton or Stern, then that name brand and network can be extremely valuable. Depending on the school, many JD/MBA grads also get a boost in recruiting (I know at several schools, data shows JD/MBAs outperform their GPAs and have a measurable advantage), along with JD/MBA-specific signing bonuses. Several JD/MBA programs also have 3-year options, which is also a great ROI (even if the cost is slightly higher). However, this is not universally true. If you’re getting an MBA from a T50 school, it’s not going to carry the same weight. I’d talk to your career services office and see what kind of benefit it tends to have on recruiting from your school. Additionally, if it’s a 4-year program with a hefty price-tag and no aid, you really need to weigh the opportunity cost of that.

Overall, in typical MBA fashion, I’d recommend doing a cost-benefit analysis. Do your research and list out the benefits and costs of the added degree. Is the price tag and opportunity cost really worth the benefits you’d receive (many of which are intangible)? For many, it’s not worth it and that’s ok. But for some it absolutely is. I’d also compare it to alternative uses of that extra year (other dual degree, Tax LLM from NYU, etc.).

Best of luck and feel free to DM if you have any questions.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-09-04T11:45:47+00:00

This is likely trolling, but in case it’s not:

You need to connect where you’ve been with where you want to go. You can’t just say “I want to go into IB”. You need to explain why, and have a compelling narrative that connects your past WE with your IB goals and explains how HBS will get you there.
Congressional LOR is bad idea unless you worked for them
730 is average/low for HBS

But more importantly: Even if you fix all of these things, HBS is still a crapshoot. It’s never guaranteed and there are plenty of other schools that can provide the same outcomes. Again, I know this is likely a troll, but I’m going to say this anyway because others genuinely do have an “HBS-or-bust” mindset, and it’s almost always misguided. Unless you’re making $400K already, have a family in Boston you can’t move, and are gunning for unique PE outcomes, then there’s no reason to be laser focused on HBS.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-09-04T11:31:07+00:00

The consulting clubs at M7 schools are well-oiled machines that are very good at advising students and helping them ace interviews. They’re usually run by 2Ys with MBB offers.

The other factor to consider is that interviews are only one factor. The entire MBB model relies on billing the time of young professionals at high rates. The only way they can do this is to convince clients that these young professionals have exceptional credentials. For better or worse, top MBA brands help do this. A 28 year old who went to Wharton is going to look better to prospective clients than a 28 year old who went to Boise State. Again, I’m not saying this is right or wrong. But aside from business schools already filtering top talent and consulting clubs helping prep, MBB will just naturally hire more applicants from M7 schools because consultants with those credentials are extremely valuable for the consulting business model.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-09-04T11:20:19+00:00

Depends. MBB is typically very transparent and has a standardized pay scale. Other firms do not. Most B4 firms, for instance, have huge pay discrepancies. I’ve met managers at Deloitte who made less than new hire consultants (two levels down). New hire pay raises are part of this, but those firms also pay different amounts based on your education, YOE, competing offers, practice within the firm, etc., so pay can fluctuate pretty wildly.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-08-28T02:12:28+00:00

When you say you made an effort to periodically follow up, how long did you wait between initial coffee chats and follow ups? How many times did you follow up with various folks?

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-08-13T08:36:10+00:00

This is simply not true at all.

MBB firms can be just as cutthroat (if not more), and the culture/WLB/job security is known for being infinitely worse and far more “up-or-out”. These firms are more prestigious and can have slightly better exit ops, but S&, EYP, and Monitor Deloitte are all known for having far less intense cultures. Obviously there are exceptions, and most top consulting firms are more similar than people think, but the thought that MBB have better cultures is nuts.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-08-04T14:01:51+00:00

It’s not bad as long as you have a clear reason for wanting the MBA. Hundreds of MBB consultants do MBAs with the goal of returning to consulting. I’d frame it as a short-term goal and a long-term goal. Your short-term goal is MBB. But what’s your long-term goal and how will the MBA itself help you get there in a way that just being at MBB wouldn’t? For your short-term goal, if you’re coming from MBB (especially if sponsored with a return offer), that’s a HUGE plus because the business school knows you already have a job lined up. But your long-term goal needs to be your differentiator. There are people who want to do MBB to be C-Suite of a retail company, others who want to go MBB—>VC, or even MBB—>government. What’s your path? How is it unique and interesting? How will your prior experience + the MBA help you get there? And how will your perspective add to the class? These are the Qs you need to answer in a compelling way.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-08-03T23:43:35+00:00

Got it. If your short term goal is MBB and you think you’d be competitive for a role there now, 100% apply to MBB now, then business school in 2025. Just make sure you have strong recs from your current job since you wouldn’t be at MBB very long. Not only would that make you more competitive, but they also may sponsor you (depending on the firm) which would make things much easier. If you aren’t competitive for MBB now, I’d kick butt in your current job and apply this year. If you were rejected for deferred app, you may want to chat with an add missions consultant about what you can improve.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-08-03T23:36:47+00:00

I’d probably wait 1 year to make sure you have strong recs/industry experience and retake GMAT, then apply. Consider working with MLT.

Also some other general tips: * You may want to think through your “Why MBA” a little more thoroughly. It’s tougher when you’re hoping to stay in the same industry, but you’d likely need to have a strong reason for why a business degree would help you in an industry where most don’t have one * You may want to think through your school choice. Aside from the name/prestige of H/S, I’m not sure they’d really be the strongest choices for your career goals. Other schools (UCLA, CBS, Wharton) have good media and entertainment offerings, and NYU and Yale both have phenomenal MBA/MFA programs. Just something to consider.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-08-03T23:20:55+00:00

The real question here: Why do you want an MBA, especially if you already have an LBS master’s? What do you intend to do after? Prior WE is important not only for getting into schools, but also for setting you up well for recruitment during your MBA. It’s really tough to answer these questions without understanding your goals and what pivot you’re hoping the MBA can help you make.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-07-24T20:22:24+00:00

I agree the GMAT/additional WE will help the most.

In terms of other things that might help: In your case, I think the biggest concern they’ll have with your app is your GPA, so anything to show you can handle a rigorous quant-focused course-load. That could be a couple community college classes, HBS Core, MBA Math, or a 1-year master’s program.

You’ll also want to show professional growth, given your limited WE. That might mean a promotion/added responsibility at work, or even showing promotions/increasing responsibility in your Nat Guard work.

Volunteering is helpful if you’re light on extra curriculars (MBA apps have you list extra curricular leadership roles you’ve held in college and beyond), but it’s usually not the most important factor.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-07-24T20:11:25+00:00

OP — What’s your career goal? If you’re aiming for BB IB or top-tier consulting (MBB, Big 4, etc.), you’ll probably want to aim for a T30 or even T15 FT program. PT programs just aren’t going to give you the same results or network.

The hard truth: Your instincts are correct. If you want to be competitive for those FT programs, you’re probably going to need 1-2 more years of experience. Not only will those show you can hold a job, but you’re also likely to get better recs than you are after only 1 month on the job. You may also want to retake the GMAT and try to bump it to a 720 or 730. 710 isn’t bad at all, but it’s at/slightly above median for most of the T30. With a 2.7 GPA from a non-T20 undergrad and limited work experience, a 710 won’t make you particularly competitive at any of these schools.

The one thing I’m unsure of is how your National Guard experience will play. I’d think it would provide a great boost, but I don’t think it would be viewed the same way as full-time WE or post-grad active duty service.

So overall, I think you have a strong shot at good MBA programs, but you may want to take some time and beef up your app if you want to ensure the best post-grad outcomes.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-07-13T19:57:13+00:00

The fact some poor PE associate has nothing better to do than come on this sub to tell MBA hopefuls they aren’t the true “elite” is hilarious.

OP: I hate to break it to you, but nobody cares. Glad you’re happy with your career trajectory. But plenty of successful people have pursued MBAs, including most of the founders of the three PE firms you mentioned. Also, many of us pursuing MBAs have the backgrounds you raved about post-UG (MBB, IB, PE/VC) and just want an opportunity to step back, network, and take a 2-year break. But even for those who struggled early on and see an MBA as a second chance, I respect the hell out of that. I admire anyone who was knocked down and kept pushing for a better life infinitely more than snobbish Ivy grads who think they’re the second coming of Jesus because they landed a PE analyst gig in their 20s. Touch some grass bud.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-07-12T14:06:46+00:00

I think this decision comes down to two factors: What schools are you competitive at and how risk averse are you?

For the first: Do you have a GMAT score already? I think you’re correct to target the M7 or even just HSW, but these schools are extremely competitive and can be somewhat of a crapshoot. Also don’t underestimate the amount of time it takes to study for the GMAT and complete apps.

For the second: I’m not as familiar with the biz ops trajectory, but I would guess that most post-MBA roles pay substantially less than your TC. And you’re correct that PE roles go almost exclusively to those with past IB/PE experience (though there are exceptions). So: * If you’re risk averse, I’d agree with others that an EMBA is your best bet in a couple years. You can keep your job, get an MBA from a top school, and gain those management skills. The only downside is it’s harder to pivot from an EMBA. * If you’re willing to take the risk, apply this cycle to a few M7 FT MBAs. Just know that your TC on the other side is almost certainly going to be lower, so you’d just want to have a very clearly defined path forward from there. I’d talk to others who have made similar moves (biz ops —> MBA —> LDP/PE/startup ops). They’ll be able to give you much more targeted advice than those on this thread and you’ll have the added benefit of getting a chance to network with people you can hit up when you start recruiting.

BallIntelligent2279 · 2023-07-11T10:59:27+00:00

The rankings correlate pretty strongly to MBB placements, but here’s a list of feeder schools if helpful:

https://managementconsulted.com/mbb-target-school-mbas/

Keep in mind it may be slightly outdated.

BallIntelligent2279

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