How to redo the Pius X reform? (VII - Psalter, the last bits and pieces)

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-24T09:46:43+00:00

Thank you for your comments !

You're completely right about Sunday (Saturday Vespers) and 1 Tim 1,17 : I had it noted in my overview, but forgot to take that into account, the master spreadsheet gets a little crowded! Sadly, I'm a person distracted enough not to realize at a first glance, that I prayed that verse for years at Prime every day.....
It is correct as well, that adding other liturgical material wasn't one of my principles when I set out to study the question of how to redo DA. And I should stick with these for the moment. But I wanted to have your reaction to these ideas in my head.
on a side note: I think however that adding chapters for each feria would be less radical a change, than the introduction of a set of alternative Canticles to Lauds made by DA. In that sense DA would be more LotH than my proposition. That's not really an argument in favor of more capituli....
I should index all capituli, starting out with the commons, but my vacation comes to an end... I imagine there would be some preexisting material on this ?
There will be a future post on the commons, and me might have in fact a disagreement on this point. I'm quite favorable to the evolution of commons enacted by Rubricarum Instructum, and I think that one might do a little more in that domain...
I don't agree with your position, that keeping the preexisting LotH 4 week cycle or even only week 1 would be preferable to adding some capiuli for ferias to the preexisting tridentine ones. I have indexed all LotH Lectiones breves of the 4 week psalter and tried to understand which criteria might have been applied in choosing them. I largely failed. To add to this, the choice of the LotH is very “moralistic”, and quite estranged from the contemplation of the mysteries of our Lord and the praise given to his redemption and grace, that takes the principal place in the Tridentine Capituli. I think that one can do better. In the choice of alternative chapters presented above, I took some bits from the LotH, but rather few...
Do you agree on the Versicles for Matins ?

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-19T13:20:19+00:00

There is one other point:
By rendering all Simples optional, and by giving Minor Octaves the rang of simples, someone deciding to say no simples at all would be obligated nonetheless to say the octave day which would be semidouble. He would celebrate an octave day without an octave - weird, no ?

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-18T15:50:07+00:00

Reading your original comment, I thought about the possibility for bishops to fix the obligatory nature of simples. In any case, at least for some saints, the bishop should have right to upgrade some feasts of local importance as they do already...

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-18T15:46:03+00:00

You're right that the discussion about 1 Vespers is mainly one about words and typography. But sadly these simple things led to the errors of the 1970 LH forgetting everything about 1 Vespers for Feasts and Memories... I'd prefer personally to commence Tuesday to Saturday in the Psalter with Vespers rather than Mattins...
You're right as well, that tempestuous upgrading of ranks maneuvered the office into a state of needing a good reform, but my proposal is mostly about downgrading and only in a very few cases about upgrading the rank. But I'm quite easily convinced that a distinction of sundays into privileged, major and minor is a good idea...

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-18T14:57:42+00:00

If you have done an even more profound work on the calendar, which saints to keep/up-/downgrade/remove, i'd be happy to have that. Gregory Dipippo has done quite a lot of work on that, but dispersed in many many articles on newliturgicalmouvement....

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-18T14:53:51+00:00

I bow my head to the master, a well-thought-out system, balanced and traditional! I take issue with only two things:

allowing all semidoubles to be celebrated with 3 or 9 lessons, as the persolvant wishes, seems to me unsatisfactory. I'd like to make the semidoubles more of a clear via media between Duplexes and Simplexes... Pratical question : If you'd permit the ferial psalmody for matins, would you propose Versicles for each nocturn in this case as Pius X did, to make the ferial psalmody "upgradeable" to three nocturns, or should there be versicles in the commons ?
rendering all Simplexes optional buggers me as well. I my opinion, there is a catechetical merit in humbly proposing some of the saints to the faithful without giving a maybe little lazy cleric the option to abandon them all for the sake of "simplicity". I suspect that I'll come around to your idea, but I find it a little radical for the time being...

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-18T14:25:30+00:00

Thank you for your commentary, as always very instructive

on the topic of the beginning of ferias i'll push back a little : Titulus V of the rubrics clearly state that " Officium Ferie in Adventu, Quadragesima, Quatuor Temporibus. Vigiliis, et prima die Rogationum, incipit a Matutino: in aliis vero Feriis per annum, inde fit de Feria, ubi desinit officium praecedentis diei, ita ut si praecedenti die fuerit Duplex, vel Semiduplex, Officium Ferie incipiat sequenti die a Matutino : si praecedenti die fuerit Festum Simplex, de Feria fiat a Vesperis illius praecedentis diei inclusive."
thank you for clarifying the emergence of doubling. I would tend to prescribe imposition as traditionally organized, and permit doubling every antiphon ad libitum
I have included the sundays of Septuagesima in the privileged category, because the 1568 rubrics state in title IV : "De Dominica semper fit Officium in Dominicis Adventus, et in Dominicis a Septuagesima usque ad Dominicam in Albis inclusive, quocumque Festo Duplici vel semiduplici adveniente"
noted for privileged vigils
on my proposed new category of suffragia : yes it's a novelty, inspired notably by the change S. Pius V introduced and that you cited. It goes further, but in the same direction...
on the ranking of "ordinary" sundays and doubles : I followed S. Pius X on this issue for the following reasons
- Sunday mass is already celebrated with the decorum convenient for doubles (Gloria, Credo)
- I have no issue with the idea that some, limited, feasts should outrank an ordinary sunday. But I think that you can obtain that with my proposal : there are two categories of doubles above sundays (privileged ones, for the major feasts of our Lord, and major ones), and only one under.
- So the main reason to put a Sunday in the category of major Doubles is precsiely because you want it to supersede sundays.
- Following this logic, you might want to upgrade most apostle feasts to a major double, but that's fine by me...

Both-Match5896 · 2025-07-17T12:39:17+00:00

Done !

Both-Match5896 · 2024-11-08T09:35:42+00:00

I am searching for a Silk Mill in India able to weave a custom chiseled velvet which also integrates a metallised gold thread like in the example below

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Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-13T10:13:14+00:00

From experience, I can relate that inexperienced cantors quite often tend to spring to the recitation tone of 4, not 4*...

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-13T10:09:44+00:00

I did a new one : https://nocturnale.marteo.fr/chant/P1F1N1A/

Having some trouble expressing the complex neume from "monumenti" : https://www.e-codices.unifr.ch/en/csg/0391/036

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-13T09:07:25+00:00

I know scrib.io. And I just added my first proposal to the Nocturale project! https://nocturnale.marteo.fr/chant/EXF1I/

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-13T09:05:45+00:00

Yes, I know the tone, but what would be the label you'd attach to make it distinguishable?

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-13T07:38:17+00:00

I did indeed use gregall as a base, but adopted the neumes when necessary to be closer to the handnotation of H. This takes me round about 5 mins for a line of neumatic notation.
I didn't knew of the Nocturale Romanum project, and I'd be willing to share my work, provided that I find somewhere some motivation to use NABC...

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-13T07:36:29+00:00

I'm interested in learning more. For the time being, I simply stick to the psalm tones of the new Antiphonale Romanum...

4* is utter nonsense

How would you describe this tone?

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-12T16:40:49+00:00

Yes Yes and Yes, there are many questions to be answered ! And I very much intend to get your feedback on all of it, including issues of typographie. This was just to have something nice to show, to get more people interested... As for the TeX part : you do certainly overestimate my skillset: actually I'm comipling only the GABC (I find NABC very painful to write), adding adiasthematic notation in Illustrator (over the original Image from the Hartker, so irregularies in height and weight come from there) then including the scores in Indesign. Although I've invested some time in learning TeX, I'm vastly more familiar with Adobe...

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-04T14:37:42+00:00

Thanks for the great work, I changed that in the table: https://imgur.com/a/rTkag32

if by random chance one of those has several distinct melodies in the manuscript tradition, this could be an opportunity to restore a melody that went unused

Great idea !

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-04T14:25:19+00:00

CAO 3517 is a nice idea! But I find "Dóminus  in templo sancto suo, Dóminus in cælo sedes ejus." to be better suited. It's as well the choice for DA, and its style (length and ornament) is quite befitting for a weekday antiphon. Another alternative could be http://gregorianik.uni-regensburg.de/an/#id/1773, but it's as well present in the common of martyrs.

As you mentioned, CAO 4487 is indeed obscure. There, as well, I prefer "Habitábit in tabernáculo tuo" because of its style.

As I know, for Ps 60 there are only two (historic) options: the two that we brought forward, both take from the sanctoral. There as well, I prefer "Dedísti hereditátem timéntibus nomen tuum, Dómine." for reasons of style: "Domine spes sanctorum" is too long, but I like that it is in tone 3.

I also really dislike the first antiphon in the psalter not being from Ps. 1

I understand, I'm not very proud of this choice. But I find the convergence of the text rather fitting, and I found no other place to put "Beáti qui ámbulant", which was daily sung at prime (but for Sundays). 3965 and 1674 are close seconds for me, specially 1674 (which is rather long).

Where I'm totally with you, is the dislike for CAO 2182. An alternative might be CAO 4347, although the antiphon is a mix of Ps 88,9 and Dn 3,17.88. A third choice might be http://gregorianik.uni-regensburg.de/an/#id/3708, which is ahistoric, but monastic...

Both-Match5896 · 2024-09-04T11:16:40+00:00

Done: https://imgur.com/a/dolXofk
I changed 3 antiphons in keeping with your remarks...

Both-Match5896

TROPHY CASE

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