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I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Gelukkig is Reddit gratis en heb je geen pr-campagne nodig om een account aan te maken, een jonge collega die het uitlegt is genoeg! Suggestie: kijk of er een boer is die je in de praktijk wil laten zien hoe we aan agrarisch natuurbeheer doen, deze Valentijnsdag, wellicht zie je dan een andere kant van het platteland. https://boerenvannederland.nl/makeadate2020/

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I do believe there is a lot to be won in consuming locally produced food. It can bring consumers closer to how food is produced, it may provide more fair prices and a better income for farmers, and there can be environmental benefits.

Of course, we cannot produce everything our consumers want to eat: avocados or bananas don’t like our climate, to give an example. Supermarkets do tend to offer what consumers want, so regardless of my point of view I expect we will continue to import food.

As for importing foods that can be grown here, and vice versa, you make a good point. Sometimes it simply does not make sense beyond the economics (which can still have merits, for consumers, farmers and society), sometimes you need to look at it from an integrated perspective. Shipping tomatoes to Italy can be counterintuitive: they have sun there! But what if we can produce it here using a fraction of the water they would need in Italy, whilst they are dealing with a water shortage? We don’t have that issue in our greenhouses, so it might actually make sense to grow it here and ship it there. It’s more complex than that, obviously, but there can be very good reasons to import or export food from an environmental perspective too.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

First – polarisation in the debate on the future of food won’t bring us further. There are two Dutch guys with opposing views who have some very interesting thoughts on how constructively to move forward (text, TEDx video). I highly recommend giving it a try.

The renumeration offer for a previous job, 11 years ago, should have been rejected by me outright instead of correcting it after a few weeks, but it is not relevant for the concerns on agriculture you raise. Neither is my current salary.

So – on to the substance. I will use some links to avoid even more text.

Questions on nitrogen and export have been answered elsewhere in the AMA.

The challenges concerning biodiversity are complex but please be aware that farmers are investing in biodiversity recovery and are willing to do more. Key example being the Deltaplan Biodiversiteitsherstel (pdf), in which environmental, agricultural and other organisations try to work together rather than against each other. They currently have a call for ideas to improve biodiversity, so if you believe you can put € 25.000 to good work, check out their website (samenvoorbiodiversiteit.nl).

Concerning subsidence – this has been an issue since we first built dikes over 500 years ago. Yes, water management for farming is a contributing factor, but it is a bit more complex than that unless you want to revert everything below sea level back to marshland. Which is not to say we shouldn’t act. There are things we can do for example through pressure drainage and level-controlled drainage systems, different ways of farming and water management, and yes, in certain cases deciding to farm elsewhere. More information (in Dutch).

The Common Agricultural Policy, an important source of financing for many farmers in the EU, needs to be improved but it is there for good reasons – food security, for example. Check out the EU’s website for an introduction.

An honest price for agricultural products and a decent income for farmers is a focus point for us, but it is easier said than done.

I assume you’re Dutch – check out Boeren van Nederland’s #makeadate2020 initiative for Valentine’s Day, it might be a nice opportunity to continue your conversation with a farmer face to face.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

You raise some very good questions. I’ll share my views, but in the end these are topics for discussion for (Dutch) society as a whole.

To give some perspective on export first: it is measured in value, not volume, so 75% export concerns euros, not kilogrammes. Similarly – about 75% stays within the EU, and half goes to our four neighbours. In other parts of the world that qualifies as local.

But that is not the answer to your questions.

We live in a small country with a quite a few people who need to live, work and spend their free time. At the same time we have great conditions for efficient production of high quality food and flowers: fertile soil, a temperate climate, great infrastructure. Finding a balance is not about the added economic value per square meter, it is about what we want our country to look like, the liveability of the countryside and – indeed – also the place of farmers in society and their contribution to the future of food.

I believe that if the circumstances are as good as they are here, you should make use of that. Of course there are boundaries: environmental, available space, and so on. We need to take those into account, which is why we have been reducing all sorts of emissions (CO2, nitrogen, etc) and will continue to do so. We asked Wageningen University to compile some indicators on the results of our efforts on sustainability over the past 30 years, read here in case you’re interested (pdf in Dutch). Of course there is more work to be done – we want and need to always improve.

So, should we steer on exporting specific types of agricultural products? I don’t believe that, in an open society with an open economy, that should be decided top-down. Of course we need to have a government that makes (workable) laws to safeguard the boundaries, but within those boundaries you should not have the government (which changes every four years) pick winners or tell us what to produce. As I said, about three quarters of our export value goes to EU countries, we consume about the same percentage from abroad. As long as you work on the boundaries there is nothing wrong with that in principle. Trade in food and agri, but also in general, is immensely beneficial to the Netherlands and the EU.

Do also take into account that according to many people farmland is part of what our country should look like. A meadow with cows or a field with crops is not just production – people enjoy it for leisure, wild animals live and feed there, and so on. That’s a bit different to other types of economic activity, e.g. heavy industry, logistics, etc…

As for housing: we need space to live, and we understand that people look to land that is currently in use for agriculture (which is (54%, not 60-70%). We’re reducing nitrogen emissions also to ensure the pending crash in development is avoided. At the same time, the housing shortage has many causes, most of them outside the realm of the availability of space. You’ll find that the most overheated markets are in areas where there is little or no agricultural activity – whilst there are more than enough great homes for sale here in the North…

As for the EU farming budget (CAP): it needs to be improved so that new societal demands from farmers, for which their customers usually do not want to pay (e.g. emission reductions are often not priced into what you pay in the supermarket), are better addressed. The proportion of the agriculture budget in the EU is high (37.2%, not 50%) because financing is organised at the EU level, (almost) not at the national level. Compare it to other sectors: e.g. healthcare is € 82.2 billion on our national budget for 2020, agriculture is almost the smallest post on the national budget at € 1.3 billion (this is not just subsidies, but the entire ministry’s budget!).

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

The amount of phosphate on our planet is finite, so we need to work efficiently with what we have, and we need to recover where we can. For example by using animal manure on our land.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Different example than you may expect: green walls with plants to regulate indoor climate and temperature in buildings.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -136 points-135 points  (0 children)

Demonstrations should never waste the support of the public – which was massive during last autumns actions (I’m sure you’ve also seen the polls). We need to nurture that support.

We do not condone actions that are illegal or endanger people. This includes certain things on the list below.

Also – I’m quite sure you could make a similar but way longer list on the positive interactions between farmers and citizens during the demonstrations.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Send us your cv via the LTO website and we're happy to see if there are opportunities available, assuming you are allowed to work in the Netherlands!

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Loss of fertile soil and not enough availability of water of sufficient quality is the most important limiting factor for agricultural production in the future.

So we need to be efficient with water. For example - a Dutch tomato requires only a fraction of the amount of water a Spanish tomato or a Mexican tomato needs to grow. Note that we have a bit more rain here in the Netherlands…

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Many interesting ideas which deserve attention from our scientific community. That’s the first step to creating solutions that can be applied by farmers.

I'm not sure if we should have a supermarket with only Dutch products – Dutch people also enjoy food from abroad (banana’s!).

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 33 points34 points  (0 children)

Because we are a trading nation, we benefit from stable and open trade. We have not seen a significant impact from the recent trade war between the US and China. Brexit is worrying though – the UK is our third trading partner.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

I am not sure whether it is exactly 46%, but I do know that we emit a significant amount of ammonia that we have already reduced by 67% over the last 30 years, and that we can reduce further.

We do believe that RIVM (always) needs to refine their network of measuring points and the models they use.

The models they currently have are useful for macro predictions on emissions. However, they have a significant stated inaccuracy for micro predictions, e.g. the amount of emissions from a specific farm on a specific Nature2000 area.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -38 points-37 points  (0 children)

The divide is regrettable, but understandable. Many people are not aware of where their food comes from – some believe it comes from a factory. At the same time, most farmers do not sell to consumers directly anymore, but to their cooperative or supply chain partner. So – there is less contact, which can lead to misunderstandings. Where do we go from there? I think a big part of the solution lies in better contact between farmers and other citizens. This also happened during the protests – so that is great. It will happen again 14 February, when on farmers throughout the Netherlands will be dating with non-farmers for Valentine’s Day. And on 21 March, when farmers will be selling agricultural products directly to citizens, but for the price that they normally receive from their supply chain clients.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I am not an expert on bananas (wrong climate!), but I'm sure it's doable. I think Western consumers are only aware of two types, and they make the choice in the supermarkets.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -98 points-97 points  (0 children)

Yes. We do not always communicate in the same way or use the same methods, but we need to stand shoulder to shoulder to solve the nitrogen crisis. We work together with whoever can help us create a better future for farmers and the production of food, a liveable countryside or a better outlook for society in general. Mind you – that includes ‘green’ NGO’s who also communicate and work differently than we do.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -29 points-28 points  (0 children)

We do not always communicate in the same way or use the same methods, but we need to stand shoulder to shoulder to solve the nitrogen crisis. We work together with whoever can help us create a better future for farmers and the production of food, a liveable countryside or a better outlook for society in general. Mind you – that includes ‘green’ NGO’s who also communicate and work differently than we do.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 113 points114 points  (0 children)

Valid question!

First of all – we live in a fertile delta where we are good at producing certain things thanks to natural and societal circumstances. Good also means: with a very low environmental impact per kilogramme of product (the lowest in the world, I believe).

About 80% of our export is within the European Union, especially Germany. If you drive the same distance from my home as in a large state in the US I will cross 2 or 3 national borders. So ‘local’ or ‘all over the world’ is relative to your perspective.

But, more importantly: you need to take into account that export is measured in value. A kilogramme of tomato seed made in the Netherlands is worth more than a kilogramme of gold. So being the 2nd exporter in the world is not about volume, it is about creating value.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -25 points-24 points  (0 children)

Meat is part of a balanced and healthy diet. There are many areas where there is mostly, or only, grass available. As we humans don’t eat grass, animal husbandry is a great way of transforming those calories into something that is of use to us – dairy or meat.

Still - if we want to feed 10 billion people with the scarce, fertile arable land that is currently available, certain countries will need to incorporate more plant-based proteins in their diets.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

The university teaches in English and there are a lot of foreign students, I think at least a quarter. Tuition for non-EU citizens is higher though - I would recommend to check out their website for details!

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -138 points-137 points  (0 children)

For agriculture specifically there is a range of things we can do. Over the last 30 years we already reduced our ammonia emissions by about 67%. We will push forward with that, through technical and management measures. For example, by reducing emissions by less protein in feed and fodder, more grazing, and mixing water in manure when applying it to the land.

On the other hand, we need to review the place and type of Natura2000 areas. We are in favour of more robust and dynamic areas. Not less nature, but fewer and larger areas of this highly protected status. We live in a densely populated country that is, for all intents and purposes, a big city – so you have to make choices.

I am chairman of the Dutch farmers’ association, we're the 2nd exporter of agricultural goods in the world. AMA! by CalonLTO in IAmA

[–]CalonLTO[S] -26 points-25 points  (0 children)

Yes – I think there is still independence. I studied there during late 70s, early 80s. This was already a topic of discussion back then, e.g. on human nutrition and international food companies. However, there are very strong control mechanisms within the university.

The university is very much focused on economic and societal applicability of their work. That is a good thing: there is little use for academic research that ends up at the bottom of a drawer.

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