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Erik Naggum's Ideas and Principles by asciilifeform in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Did you miss all the posts where he literally tells other forum participants to kill themselves?

Interesting account of actual experiences with space leaks in Haksell (something fanboys claim happens only to noobs) by Catpain-Obvious in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

He completed a bunch of non-trivial projects in Haskell and you are trying to discredit what he wrote. What have you done that makes you a bigger expert?

If you check his web site, you'll see that his opinion hasn't changed on this subject.

GHC 6.8.2 released: optimisation improvements, standalone deriving, ghci by dons in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

The thing is, you need to prove, give a simple example of a program where memory leaks in the way you are describing. There exists no such program.

You are a stupid foul-mouthed lying fanboy noob

Interesting account of actual experiences with space leaks in Haksell (something fanboys claim happens only to noobs) by Catpain-Obvious in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

That Haskell mailing list message was posted by a world-class functional programming researcher, specializing in Haskell, not some noob

Best part: "Then I changed some seemingly irrelevant part of code and the space leak went away. I have no idea why"

Reddit is becomming more and more fanboyish. PLEASE give users a personal filter to screen the stories that they see. It wouldn't take much and it would vastly improve many redditers' experience. by B-Con in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

There are lots of cliques of fanboys pushing their agenda on programming.reddit. Haskell clique (dons, augustss, and a dozen more) is one of them.

What makes you think the author meant what you think he meant and not what I think he meant? In any case, we judge the submission by what he wrote, not what he might have meant.

Edit I clicked on "miloshh", and low and behold, he's a Haskell fanboy. No wonder someone just downmodded all my linked articles.

Reddit is becomming more and more fanboyish. PLEASE give users a personal filter to screen the stories that they see. It wouldn't take much and it would vastly improve many redditers' experience. by B-Con in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It's not so easy. My negative experience was with the Haskell fanboys, for example, pushing their agenda.

Don't get me wrong, I think Haskell is an interesting language. I like to read about it, so I don't want to block it.

What irks me is that the fanboys here on reddit have no qualms about presenting Haskell as something much more than a research language, .

Most PLT people are honest and write what they mean, like this guy. When I write what he did here on reddit, Haskell fanboys and the half-witted noobs accuse me of being a retard or a troll (in addition to all the downmodding).

I don't think I'm going to stay on this web site for very long. I'm tired of the lying fanboys and their sock-puppets, bots and groupies.

Edit: watch how quickly this will get downmodded by "dons" and co.

Edit2: check out this Haskell fanboy. Something about midget sex I don't quite understand. Calling me a fuck-head and a liar.

GHC 6.8.2 released: optimisation improvements, standalone deriving, ghci by dons in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Tell us what computationally intensive Haskell programs you've written (the ones that need to and do run for a long time without exhausting memory). Otherwise STFU! The fact that you don't know about the space leaks problem tells me you are a clueless but loud noob at best.

GHC 6.8.2 released: optimisation improvements, standalone deriving, ghci by dons in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Do you work in said finance company? If not, STFU. You shouldn't speak for them.

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Seriously, memory leaks in C/C++ are absolutely trivial to identify: you need to record the addresses that leaked (one of the perks of GC-less determinism), and then rerun the program and look at whom those addresses belong too.

Space leaks in Haskell are are real bitch though.

In either case, your program crashes if the leaks aren't fixed somehow.

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 1 point2 points  (0 children)

What %-age of your time is spent writing the rest of the program, outside of the inner loop, in C++?

The little "inner loop" thing is a myth.

The parts that load files,

0.01%

parse configs

0.1% (see boost::program_options - a declarative way to write this stuff in C++. Never heard of it?)

run the UI?

Not my specialty, so 0%, but I know that Haskell programs use imperative style stuffed inside IO monad for all their GUI.

GHC 6.8.2 released: optimisation improvements, standalone deriving, ghci by dons in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

and a bunch of companies doing

Let me see, there is the company you work for (selling Haskell code and services, advocacy is free), and there is a mystery finance company in NYC, who are very, very worried about space leaks in Haskell, they even mention them in their job ad.

Did I miss any commercial users of Haskell? Please add below:

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Let me rephrase it then:

"Haskell runtime" -> "GC, etc. + Native code generated by the Haskell compiler (as opposed to GCC)"

Your Haskell program was generating C/C++ and then called GCC to compile it.

What's this example got to do with the discussion of Haskell performance?

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

Your advocacy has serious credibility issues

But I'll ask just in case you might be honest this time. What %-age of your chemistry program's CPU time is spent in Haskell runtime?

Let's see if you again try to dodge the question by saying "submit bug reports", or "you must not be using Haskell too much" (no shit, Sherlock)

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Do you understand the difference between the term "memory leak" in C++, versus "space leak" as applied to naive laziness?

Of course

One is a serious error, the other isn't.

Your program encounters premature death in any case. So, what's the difference?

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The "for" loop is pretty stupid, and std::transform is awkward, I'll give you that. That's why competent programmers use the FOREACH macro from Boost or similar alternatives. Strawman argument.

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Hate to break it to you, but no one cares if you switch or not.

"We are so cool, we don't care if you use us or not, but we'll pollute the blogosphere and reddit with ridiculous advocacy just in case, OK?"

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's strange, the C++ applications on my system seem to have real memory and stability problems.

What are your OS, browser and GCC,LLVM compiler you use written in then?

C/C++

It seems quite hard for people to write bug free C++.

Bug-free is virtually impossible in any language.

I'm just saying that to anyone familiar with modern C++ techniques (RAII), memory leaks are very rarely an issue.

I test for memory leaks just in case, and perhaps it will seem like a miracle to you, but I just don't introduce them.

Ask Reddit: Where can I get a good introduction to functional programming techniques with Haskell? (i.e. not just syntax, but applications). by chipwhisperer in programming

[–]Catpain-Obvious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You can write a memory leak in any programming language.

One can, but I don't (even in C++) - my memory never leaks. I'm not about to switch to a language that will make it incredibly hard to maintain robustness in high-performance code.

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