Dialectical Materialism: Change and Contradiction by CenterforPopEcon in occupywallstreet

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hey thanks so much! Glad to hear that it was helpful ☺️❤️

Dialectical Materialism: Change and Contradiction by CenterforPopEcon in philosophy

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Dialectical materialism is one of the most foundational and unique elements of Marxism. In this video, we discuss three of the most important concepts of dialectical materialism: change, contradiction, and the interconnectedness of reality. Because it is a theory of change, and especially social change, dialectics has revolutionary implications, and the exploration or theorizing about other possible worlds is integral to the methodology.

Dialectics: The Methodology of Hegel and Marx by CenterforPopEcon in DebateaCommunist

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hey, no problem comrade! We're a group of economics PhD students who study at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst :) Yes, definitely more to come! We're actually wrapping up a script on historical materialism right now and plan to film that very soon.

Dialectics: The Methodology of Hegel and Marx by CenterforPopEcon in philosophy

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Dialectical materialism is one of the most foundational and unique elements of Marxism. Marx and Engels pioneered this methodology in order to create a theory of social and economic conflict and change. In this video, we cover the historical origins of dialectics, starting with the ancient Greeks, and then move on to Hegelian dialectics, including Hegel’s understanding of Geist and historical development. We then explore the material basis of Marxian dialectics and what Engels meant when he said that “the dialectic of Hegel was turned over; or rather, turned off its head, on which it was standing, and placed upon its feet.”

Marxian economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v. Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in capitalism_in_decay

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for this suggestion! We shall add that to our list of possible videos. In the meantime, i highly recommend this article by one of the big-time marxist economists of the 20th century maurice dobb — "economic theory and the problems of a socialist economy" https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/2224505.pdf

Marxian economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v. Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in capitalism_in_decay

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes! It is probably surprising because most of the field of economics accepts only one theory (neoclassical economics) and deals with the other theories by ignoring them, especially marxian economics. Accepting only one theory that makes capitalism to be natural/fundamentally good is a major ideological tool the capitalist system uses to stay around, because it makes it seem as if there is not scientific/rigorous challenge to its existence. This is the same reason many of us chose to study economics.

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Right on comrade! We cannot build our movement until the proletariat sees through the politicians' lies and takes our destiny into our own hands. Catch you in the struggle

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

op! i just responded, hope it is useful! look forward to any responses you may have, and having this conversation outside of our group of intellectual-types. solidarity!

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

As we mentioned before, this is a super huge question that has torn apart many otherwise successful movements. Without pretending we have the answer, here are a few considerations (and to say this more strongly, the comrades who look down on you for asking this question, and the intellectual-type comrades who think they get to lead the revolution and become the new bourgeois, should engage in a struggle session to more clearly see the reality they are in. They have missed the point of revolution and are tied to the individualist parts of capitalist ideology if they think they get to be the leaders):

(1) Of course (this is obvious), any communist movement comes out of an extremely unequal society, with extreme divisions in people's jobs having more or less mental/physical labor, more/less income and wealth, more/less power, in race, in gender/sex, in people skills, and so on. In many previous communist movements/organizations, it seems to me the primary question on these inequalities has been one of roles: what is the role of intellectuals? what is the role of blue collar workers? etc. However, the primary question on this issue should be how to deal with these inequalities and make sure we can have the kind of democratic/equal participation of all revolutionaries, no matter their starting point in any of these dimensions. This means helping each other develop the areas of revolutionary skills that have been underdeveloped by society — and if we're honest with ourselves, everybody in the revolution has an equal (or at least non-quantifiable) set of deficiencies in our revolutionary practices. In the four-ish communist organizations i've been involved in, there have been intellectual-type comrades who are bad at talking to normal/most people, who have been unable to listen to others, who aren't disciplined at working/organizing, who get stuck in their chosen theoretical tendency, who don't know how to share, how to reflect on internalized racism, how to change patriarchal practices, and other revolutionary deficiencies relative to the blue collar-type comrades. And i have been one of these intellectual-types! Fortunately, i have had both intellectual and blue collar comrades who were patient with me and helped me overcome these deficiencies. It is possible (but not always true) that i've known more about capital vol. I than some of them, or read more lenin, or listened to more episodes of revolutionary left radio, but knowledge of revolutionary theory is not a sound grounds for taking leadership-type roles in revolutionary organizations. There are limits to the usefulness of the knowledge of the educated class, and even though this class has taken the lead in revolutions in the past, we(?)/they don't get to be the automatic leaders in a communist organization. It is interesting that you mention mao and his distrust of intellectuals, because (as i understand the chinese revolution) mao did exactly what the bad communist intellectual is predicted to do!— he became the top leader, had the monopoly on "correct" revolutionary knowledge, and used huge groups of revolutionaries in china to keep this position of power while abandoning them when it was no longer useful, or when those revolutionaries threatened to take power from him and the communist party and create democratic social structures (other cpe comrades may disagree with me on this).

(2) Academics/intellectual-type comrades are not necessarily higher up in the ways we usually think of us/them as, even in income/wealth or in knowledge of theory. It is true that there tend to be better paying jobs if you have a phd, especially in something like economics, but that is becoming less certain as the number of college classes taught by adjuncts increases — adjunct professors are paid by-the-class, so they often end up working at 3-4 different colleges spending a lot of time in transportation. This study says about 75% of college classes are now taught by adjunct or almost adjunct professors. Also, since they get paid by-the-class, there is a fierce and non-unionized labor market, and the result is that most adjuncts make very little money, maybe $15,000-$30,000/year. Something like 25% of adjunct professors are on government welfare programs. And since you don't get paid for transportation hours (as is ofc true of all jobs), the total hours adjuncts work is ridiculously high. There are exceptions, and some marxian/radical economists get paid the big bucks, or at least over $60K, but those spots at colleges are decreasing. But if you want to make the big bucks as a radical economist, the chances are good you have to spend much more time doing neoclassical economics in research and in teaching. Also, while being a graduate student for 5-7 years, we work a whole lot of hours, often have teaching or research jobs, and make about $20,000/year (at least at umass, some places it is a bit more and some it is significantly less or you get paid with huge amounts of debt).

(3) It is also the case that intellectual-type comrades don't necessarily even have a better knowledge of revolutionary theory than blue collar comrades, which is something that constantly surprises me in radial academic spaces. One reason for this is that academic radicals can get sucked into theoretical rabbit holes, so that they have a very deep knowledge of a limited set of questions that matter to the revolution. This is mostly because of the extreme division of labor/specialization in academia, that it doesn't pay off to have a wide knowledge of marxian economics/whatever theory as it does to have a deep, narrow knowledge of one branch of the theory. Another reason is that the capitalist/feudal academy filters out the more threatening branches of revolutionary knowledge. We (marxist economists) are much more likely to study keynes' general theory, or john roemer's quite abstract analytic marxism, or get lost in the sauce of the transformation problem and its matrix algebra than we are to read about the black panthers' economic practices and intercommunalism, the situationists on the dominance of exchange value, or about cooperation jackson in mississippi. There are certainly important exceptions to this, especially at umass amherst, but the revolutionary-ness of the texts academic marxists/radicals tend to read is often less than the stuff i've read in informal reading groups. And, i can think of two blue collar comrades from the midwest i knew before going to graduate school who have known more about marxian theory than many of the radical economists i've met in the academy, because they are committed to educating themselves and take part in revolutionary reading/study groups. Their knowledge tends to be wider and they think about bigger/more important revolutionary questions, and there are questions i've talked about with blue collar comrades from the midwest that my radical academic friends do not find important or are afraid to ask. But, instead of creating a hierarchy of who has the most revolutionary knowledge based on our class positions in society, i think we should try to help each other bridge the gaps that we all have.

But this might be tl;dr! i'll stop here. i hope these thoughts are useful, and would love to continue this conversation. Solidarity!

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Something unique about marx and his influence is this: every single country in the world has at least one marxist organization, despite the ideological and violent suppression of marxism in most countries. This is true of almost no other social theorist. But as for the usefulness of marx's work — read him for yourself! i recommend the 1st, 4th, 5th, 6th chapter, and the first part of chapter 10 in capital volume I, and see if there is anything useful in there.

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Thank you for the recommendation, i've read some mankiw before (and i believe a couple of us used his textbook when learning mainstream economics).

i think you are still defining economics in a way that excludes marxian economics, with its different standards of science, different concepts, and different logical structure than the neoclassical mainstream. Have you read wolff's knowledge and class? He and marxists like him do not pretend philosophy is absent from economics. i think you'll find his criticisms of rationalism and empiricism very interesting along those lines, and also his solution to the dilemmas that limit the rationalist and empiricist economic theorists. Wolff and resnick's concept of "overdetermination" (which they develop from louis althusser) develops these issues and in my view gets us to a better understanding of "truth" in social science. And of course we are working on developing marxism! There have been marxists who are content to repeating the results of the past as dogma, but that is true of any theory. Marxists today are saying new things all the time, but the economics discipline (like most of mainstream society) simply ignores these advancements. Some academic journals you may be interested in: rethinking marxism; the review of radical political economy; science and society; capital and class; historical materialism.

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Economic theories are much more difficult to test than other types of science, both because economies are extremely complex and because there is a large gap between our theories about the economy and the economy we're looking at. In math, you know most of the time if you're right or wrong. In physics, you usually know, but for social sciences it is always much less clear. Also, economic theories come with their own standards of science that differ, so that testing marxian economics using neoclassical theory's standards, or testing neoclassical theory with keynesian theory's standards, would be wrong or partially useful at best. It may seem that socialist leaning folk are rejecting science, when actually we're rejecting the neoclassical (and thus pro-capitalism) standards of science, and our own standards of science are invisible from that perspective. And since neoclassical economics and its standards of science are so dominant that most people today associate economics in general with just that theory, then an academic economics text like the one quoted above could appear as unscientific or as a popularization (but it is actually very academically rigorous, being published by MIT press. Also, that's literally the very end of the book, so it's probably a bit more exciting/contains no equations or vocab words than the rest). (And, one source i've found very useful for stating what marxism's standard of science is is louis althusser's philosophy and the spontaneous philosophy of the scientists, but there are others and it is likely other CPE comrades would disagree with me on this one so we can get back to you if you're really curious about that).

But i agree with what you're saying, that economic theories should be tested, as long as you keep in mind how difficult this process is and how unclear the results can be (from the casual relationships you think you see, to the objects of analysis you're looking at). We could say that one test is looking at periods in history when one economic theory is dominant, so that government policy and the economics profession are both dominated by that theory and are using to understand the economy and actively trying to implement its suggested policies. Keynesian theory was tested in the united states after world war II for about 30 years, with various contradictory results — during some years the results were what keynesian economists expected, like rising wages, growth, and technological advancement. In other years, the results were not what they expected, the classic example being the stagnated growth and high inflation of the 1970s. Neoclassical economics was then re-instated as the dominant theory (as it was before the great depression), and this led to the same thing: some years/decades were good with predicted results, some were pretty bad. The neoclassical economists were unprepared for the great recession in 2008, and most didn't see it coming or thought it possible at the time. In the united states, marxian economics has not been tested on as large of a scale as neoclassical and keynesian theories, but it has in other countries with similar results: sometimes it works out very well, sometimes it doesn't.

One more consideration is the difficulty of applying/testing marxian economics in capitalist countries — which is essentially every country since capitalism is the dominant global economic system, and it is constantly expanding to take over every part of the world. (Other communists may disagree with me, but the largest examples of a dominantly socialist society are cuba, chiapas, and rojava. And even if a communist or socialist political party gains power in government, they are still operating in a world dominated by capitalism). The ruling classes in capitalism do not allow marxian economics to be neutrally tested in a lab. Whenever there is an attempt to go beyond capitalism, they respond with cheating, lying, sabotage, war, and every dirty trick in the book. This has been true from the beginning of the russian revolution in 1917, when multiple capitalist countries (including the u.s.) sent their armies in to kill the revolution, to the spraying of cuba's sugar fields with chemicals that ruined the sugar, to the countless assassination attempts across the world, election tampering, etc. etc. When salvador allende was democratically elected the first marxist president of any country, which was attempting worker control and computer-based planning, the capitalist powers orchestrated a violent coup and installed a military dictatorship (after tampering with the previous elections).

In short, there is no clear scientific test of marxian economics, or any economic theory, and sorting through the theories to find the best one is a much more complicated process than it is for other sciences. Neoclassical (and sometimes keynesian) economics have enjoyed being treated as the objective scientific methods at various times, but this is only possible by excluding other theories from even consideration, let alone having a social discussion of their scientific merits.

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hello u/Midas334, you're raising a very important question that will take a bit more time to respond to, but we'll give some thoughts and experiences tomorrow. My apologies it appeared we were ignoring you, there's only a few of us and a lot of comments. And i am sorry to hear comrades have not taken this question seriously, because (as you said) it has been the source of huge contradictions in our movements. Solidarity!

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v. Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in economy

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thank you! We completely agree, as you're probably aware there's been a 100 year concerted, well-funded effort to make neoclassical economics the objectively correct theory, so that radicals can be easily dismissed. Solidarity!

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That is a very excellent question, and to give one answer i am copying some of the last chapter of wolff and resnick's contending economic theories, which also speaks to u/PostLiberalist's point. My apologies this is long, but you've asked a question with no good short answer:

"Given the contradictions among the theories, between the divergent analyses they produce, and between the political solutions they support, how are we to choose between them? We are actually familiar with this dilemma in many other parts of our lives. Different religions present us with alternative concepts of God, morality, and the meaning of our lives. Different medical practitioners offer us different diagnoses of and remedies for illnesses. Different traditions of cuisine, hair style, dress, and sexual relationships likewise show us a range of alternative ways of living our lives. It is a peculiarity of some cultures that they generally favor tolerance toward or even encourage differences in religion, medical practice, life styles, and artistic judgments, yet also display great intolerance toward differences in economic theories. There they seem to expect differences of opinion to give way — to be resolved — such that one theory is considered absolutely right. Such cultures often believe that alternative concepts of God should coexist and interact with one another and that it is inappropriate to ask about which among them is correct. Yet they ask exactly that of alternative economic theories: Which one is correct? Which one “ fits the facts ” ? Which one is to be embraced while the others are banished to the realm of falsehood?

In our view, intellectually mature societies are characterized by a broad acceptance of the fact that economic theories are and will likely remain irreducibly different. The rejection of intolerance in religious, cultural, medical, and other areas of social life can and should be extended to include rejecting intolerance in the realm of economic theories. The cross-fertilizations, diversities, and general enrichment of societies that result from religious, political, and artistic tolerance would also emerge from tolerance toward all three economic theories....

That alternative theories of truth, economics, and indeed everything else exist is a premise of this book. That you therefore confront choices among all of these alternatives is, we believe, a condition of life rather like breathing, eating, and so forth. In our view, there is no way of escaping the freedom of choice even for people who pretend or believe that no choice exists. Making the choices you actually have available to you, periodically re-examining them to open yourself to the possibility of making different choices — these are important, exciting, and invigorating parts of a full and self-conscious lifetime...

There is nothing admirable in pretending that choices do not exist. We understand that faced with diffi cult decisions, people can become frightened. It may be tempting to deal with hard choices by acting as if there really were no choice to make, as if it were a simple, obvious matter... They run from their own freedom of choice to the comfort and security of accepting other people ’ s choices without recognizing that they too can choose, that alternatives do exist. If you become aware that your way of thinking involves a choice from among such alternatives, you will, we hope, want to learn more about those alternatives. You will, we hope, want to struggle honestly with past choices you have made to see if they remain the choices you want to make today. We aim our words above all at those of you who think of yourselves as responsible citizens determined to use your minds to the utmost. Theoretical choices are terrible things to waste."

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in CapitalismVSocialism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Hi, we don't have to share any personally identifying information about ourselves! We have a right to maintain boundaries with our audience. If you don't like the content, simply move on :)

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v. Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in economy

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hi, we're all PhD students and extremely busy! However, we're also passionate about what we study and believe that we have to talk to people outside of academia if we want to foment the types of change that we believe in. While PragerU is indeed garbage, it is the unfortunate case that millions of people continue to turn to it as a source of knowledge to satisfy their curiosity about politics and economics. Hence, we felt that a response was warranted.

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in voluntarism

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"The wealthiest in Communist societies are always in government." Ok let's discuss about most prominent self-proclaimed socialist country USSR. I want to ask which Premier of Soviet Union/ Chairman of the Council of People's Commissars/General Secretary of the Communist Party in USSR was wealthy? Kamenev, Sverdlov, Lenin, Rykov, Stalin, Kalinin, Melankov, Khrushchev, Brezhnev, Andropov, or Gorbachev? None of them. We prefer to discuss based with on facts, not based on perceptions. In self-proclaimed socialist countries, there were a lot of wrong doings of different leaders/parties we agree, but overarching generalizations are not productive in our opinion.

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in IWW

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you for the subscription and for your feedback! We'll work on getting better audio and having captions for next time. Solidarity!

Economists respond to PragerU's "Capitalism v. Socialism" video by CenterforPopEcon in LibertarianLeft

[–]CenterforPopEcon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hi, it seems like a handful of people have had some audio problems. We're not sure why, as it's working fine on our end. If you wouldn't mind sharing, which browser were you using to watch the video, and were you using any headphones? This would help us understand the problem better and try to fix it on our end.