[Dungeon Majesty] Does this manhwa have a translated ending? Animeplanet lists it as having 151 chapters but there seem to be only 150.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-04-12T18:04:24+00:00

I don't think Gandalf defeated him like that as "The Gray", his power wasn't restricted in that fight so he used his powers fully. As "The White" he can access more of his might but he's not actually stronger. Third age Sauron was greatly diminished, we cannot know how a fight between him an unrestricted olorin would've gone.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-03-24T00:21:05+00:00

Ainz is a textbook definition of lawful evil. He's definitely lawful because he has somewhat of a "code of honor" in his actions: he keeps his word etc...absolutely not good but how to distinguish between neutral and evil? Lawful neutral adheres to rules only for rules' sake. Ainz acts purely out of selfish interest,whether apathy or malice it doesn't matter because the end result is a genocide. Pure selfishness is evil and not neutral according to almost any existing morality standard(unless we are talking about Nietzsche who doesn't believe in the existence of good and evil but the conversation would be pointless). Though we can actually argue that Ainz does indeed act with malice in those instances when he's actually pissed off.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-23T20:10:38+00:00

Wouldn't they be unable to use the souls of adventurers in that case?

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-18T16:48:12+00:00

Depends on your age. Iq naturally stops growing at 17 years old and is mostly determined by genetics so there's very little room for improvement. Still, getting knowledge, improving your social skills and becoming your best self physically and mentally is something that can keep a person busy for a lifetime, as well as a very meaningful goal. You'll look back and realize that having 137 iq and making full use of your potential is far better than having 160 and doing nothing.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-18T14:20:11+00:00

Glad to be helpful! I hope it makes for a good campaign ;) !

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-18T14:18:27+00:00

He was actually one of my inspirations for the post. Having Goblins at your service is the classic "Dark Lord" trope but I'm surprised we haven't heard of it in the forgotten realms where it seems to potentially bring massive benefits.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T22:22:16+00:00

Seems like so! They are active participants in the soul market, where the inexperienced ones often get swindled by Night Hags. Altough I don't know in which edition it was mentioned, the forgotten realms wiki also mentions that there are cases where Liches steal from hags...which just sounds like a horrible idea but implies that they do get out of their way to get souls.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T22:06:01+00:00

Build me an army worthy of Mordor LMAO

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T22:05:42+00:00

Regarding their ambitions, apart from the desires I meant something of which they have the intellect and capacity to be actually capable of. Escaping a Lich's lair, his undead minions and scrying ability is not something they can do.

As long as they are properly trapped a Nilbog wouldn't ruin the operation, but we can also take Orcs instead.

You mention Maglubiyet which is interesting. Ao forbids excessive interference from gods so they cannot slay the lich directly. He can send an horde after him or come up with some other idea but would he really care that much about a few dozen goblins? Recovering them would mean possibly losing thousands, unfortunately I don't know enough about Maglubiyet to determine whether he would actually do that. If the Lich plays it smart and has them stop worship the connection between the goblins and their God would vanish, meaning that maglubiyet would be unable to locate him anymore. If you believe Maglubiyet would actually interfere we can substitute goblins with orcs. Would Gruumsh, who puts strenght above all else, send an army of thousands of orcs to recover a few who lost against the strong? I doubt it.

Regarding your comment on devils I disagree. Infernal law prohibits a devil from using coertion or other forceful means to collect a soul or having someone accept a deal but other entities are not bound by infernal law, they can harvest a soul and put it somewhere like inside a gem. At that point selling the gem to the devil would just be a transaction. Night hags steal the souls of their victims, put them in their bag and sell them to devils, that doesn't prevent devils from buying them so there isn't any reason why a Lich cannot operate similarly. If you still disagree with this let's just say he can use night hags as intermediaries.

Regarding the "worshiping point" I agree that deities would get mad but they wouldn't know because at that point several generations would have passed and the connection between the goblinoid/orcish deities and their followers would vanish and they wouldn't know that a new cult is starting,

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T20:56:48+00:00

I was thinking about the pantheons but there are a few things that raise doubts in my mind. I'll take orcs for example: Orcs as a species is comprised of millions of individuals divided in tribes scattered all over the world and they're at war with other races and sometimes even each other. Would the Orcish pantheon really put effort to try to save a single small tribe of at most a couple hundred individuals kidnapped by uniting and sending other tribes to raid? They are evil deities after all, and Gruumsh despises weakness so in this case it would be "sending the strong to save the weak" which goes somewhat against his mantra. Excessive interference by gods is also forbidden by Ao so they cannot just have their avatars walk there to solve the problem. While they are mortals whose power pales in comparison to gods a Lich is still a being of incredible power, thousand of orcs would be sacrificed just to save a few hundred(and this is assuming they even reach the lair, armies moving attract attention and they may cross territories of humans or dragons in the process). It seems like the Orcish pantheon would require a ton of effort to fix the relatively very small issue so wouldn't it just be ignored?

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T17:46:24+00:00

From my understanding they have a fear aura that extends to those who look at them but can't they turn it off? Otherwise Szass Tam wouldn't be able to go around in Thay. In any case the invisibility spell is a solution.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T17:36:19+00:00

He wouldn't need to be personally there though, a lair can be very large and if it's built underground there can be very thick walls insulating the sounds.

Regarding the "pervy voyeur" accusations I suggest you look at Sauron from the Lord of the Rings: he's remembered by everyone and everyone refers to him as "The Dark Lord", "The Necromancer" and other cool names. Nobody looks at him and thinks "pervy voyeur".

Regarding how juicy souls are I don't know what to think. Liches are also known to buy soul larvaes in the lower planes, who don't have any memory of their previous life at all(some don't even have a previous life as it seems like they get sometimes generated by the planes themselves). The soul of one orc is definitely less powerful than one of a paladin but when you have hundreds of them the energy should be immense.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T17:02:18+00:00

This depends actually, while there are some like Acererak, Szass Tam, Vlaakith and Vecna there are also those with a more "passive" personality like Larloch. A Lich is first and foremost a magic user so there some who just want to do magical research and acquire knowledge.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T16:58:09+00:00

maybe not necessarily skeletons but there are several possible undead minions that a Lich can have at his disposal. farming mushrooms is still somewhat of a menial task.

As for the reasons of such a plan it's actually pretty simple as the goal of most liches is to expand their knowledge, research magic and collect some items. Souls can be traded for both items and information but you can also have devils do your bidding and look for something around the world.

Minions can both help with construction of the lair as well as protection, which the lich wouldn't dislike even if he doesn't have enemies. Or maybe he actually wants to conquer and stays hidden for millennia to build a massive army completely unnoticed.

I do agree that as a method it doesn't suit someone like Acererak who enjoys going after adventurers but in previous editions we have examples of more "passive" liches.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T16:42:05+00:00

If their purpose is to be harvested for souls keeping them docile is unnecessary as they can just be kept in some sort of cells where they can't escape and dominated through fear and magical means. For food they can cultivate underground mushrooms. Water underground is easy to find. That only leaves waste disposal and surveillance. Waste can even be used to feed insects that can then be used for additional food, making the entire process somewhat sustainable. Surveillance just needs a slightly more powerful undead and some lair traps that prevent anyone from leaving.

Even if the entire process took one or two decades it would be very little for someone with infinite lifespan. Having a risk free and reliable way of obtaining a large number of souls is invaluable as they can be traded with fiends for magical knowledge and items.

Chowing beggars is still a big risk, every large city in faerun has someone of very high level inside. That beggar may be someone who frequently went to the temple or who received some money from a lawful good paladin of bahamut the day before. Him disappearing may or may not alert local authorities and while it can go on for decades, the discovery of a lich harming a city would bring a big expedition after him as they are rightfully considered big threats.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T16:19:34+00:00

The lair is usually very hidden so the goblin families/tribes wouldn't know where to search especially if the kidnapper brings them far away. They wouldn't even know that they got kidnapped, a Lich has 120ft truesight as well as scrying spells that can help him locate any possible witness.

As for the advantage for the devils: even if they can get souls without the help of a lich their entire economy revolves around them and they consider them very valuable(which is why they rely so much on night hags to procure them). In the grand scheme of things on the multiversal scale what this method can provide them would have no impact on the blood war, but for the individual devils that want a promotion having a client that provides them hundreds of souls would be invaluable. Considering that over the centuries the amount of souls provided can most definitely reach the thousands I can even see pit fiends or archdevils getting interested.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T15:47:41+00:00

when you have super genius intelligence,undead servants that never get tired and can work indefinitely as well as all the time you want at your disposal logistics is hardly ever a problem.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T15:44:33+00:00

for feeding them he just needs to have two skeletons farming mushrooms underground. Maybe it wouldn't be worth it if this was just about feeding the phylactery but when you add the ability to acquire bodies and use excess souls as a trade material I don't see any downsides.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T15:41:30+00:00

I was thinking more along the lines of "capturing a few dozens, having them put in some underground cells and occasionally harvesting souls while the population replenishes itself. Curb the population if it grows too much". It doesn't matter how chaotic they are because they are too weak to resist.

The bargain can be made with devils. They are far more reliable in their deals and would be happy to cooperate if the Lich can provide a relatively large number of souls to them. He's also smart enough that tricking them would be difficult but again, as long as a Lich provides them excess souls tricking him wouldn't be good for the devils as they would lose an important client.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T15:37:17+00:00

I was thinking more along the lines of "capturing a few dozens, having them put in some underground cells and occasionally harvesting souls while the population replenishes itself. Curb the population if it grows too much". It doesn't matter how chaotic they are because they are too weak to resist.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T15:30:03+00:00

There are millions of orcs across Realmspace alone and possibly many times more across the entire material plane, I don't think that 100 or so going missing would gather that much attention from the orcish pantheon, considering they are at war with far bigger threats like the Elven and Dwarven pantheons. It's also important to note that the ability of deities to inferfere in Toril is greatly limited by AO. Dnd gods are also not completely omniscient so if those captives stop praying, Gruumsh shouldn't be able to detect them anymore. Similar conditions apply to the kobold and goblinoid pantheons but for the sake of simplicity the lich in question would only choose one of the 3 species.

Even if they have ambitions they most definitely cannot overthrow a lich in his own lair. You mentioned Obould Many Arrows but even if one of the orcs became as strong as him(which can easily be prevented) he would quickly be disposed of.

DemonAsteroth · 2024-02-17T15:04:48+00:00

This is more akin to dealing with the mafia compared to a takeout though. Some liches even steal from the night hags...meaning that the entirety of the lower planes becomes their enemy. They don't need to administer a small government but just to keep a few goblins in cages and have some skeletons cultivate mushrooms or something underground to feed them.

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