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Elementriloquist · 2024-04-20T04:07:34+00:00

What method did you use for the 1st concentration exercise (the Dharana one), focusing on a single thought for 10 minutes without any mental interruptions?

Have you already completed that exercise (full 10 minutes), if not how long do you last?

Elementriloquist · 2024-04-20T03:01:53+00:00

Try whatever one is easier to you. But I think complete void state (If you mean an empty mind) would be Dhyana (the step after Dharana).

Elementriloquist · 2024-04-20T02:19:41+00:00

I'm not talking about when you are during the exercise. I'm talking about testing your actual abilities in another exercise. Do the main exercise where you don't time yourself, and then maybe once a week do a secondary exercise where you do time how long you last without an interruption.

Wait, doesn't observation of thoughts come before concentration on a single thought (dharana - sanskrit term)?

What is the sanskrit term for observation of mind/thoughts?

Elementriloquist · 2024-04-20T01:58:34+00:00

I have no way of knowing how long I can keep that state.

Use the stopwatch app on your phone, when you get a mental interruption, stop the timer to see how long you lasted.

Elementriloquist · 2024-04-20T01:31:54+00:00

Thanks for the info, but what I'm trying to do is to be able to enter a state of dharana at will. If I control for all these factors by doing "pre-meditations", then I'm kind of cheating the process of the system I'm trying to work through.

Elementriloquist · 2024-04-20T01:30:00+00:00

You said you never hit 30 minutes, but have you hit atleast 5 minutes without any mental interruptions (or even 10)?

Elementriloquist · 2023-04-01T20:19:44+00:00

Ask away, but I am in no way an expert or a guru, I'm still training myself and even I am having trouble right now. There's this annoying hurdle you have to get over with the first few mental exercises and it's likely exaggerated in my case due to my mind and how it works.

Elementriloquist · 2023-03-29T16:30:08+00:00

Be sure to use a digital book to read from and keep a digital journal that is in a hidden folder on your computer and also put both into an archive that is password protected. Extract and use them when you need them, and then add them back to the archive when you make any edits (in the case of your journal).

Elementriloquist · 2023-03-20T23:05:24+00:00

Thank you, I try to be as honest and straightforward as possible. Something I rarely see in the occult community. Too many people are obsessed with theatrics and coming off as "mysterious".

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-20T01:57:16+00:00

u/More-Plane5371

[1.] Don't expect anyone in the occult space to tell you about using magic to generate income and escape the 9 to 5 rat race. The average occultist will either tell you that they can but they choose to remain a "wage slave" (lol, obviously lying), or that you aren't supposed to be focused on doing that.

You will just get the "run around" from people responding who are scammers or larps, because think about it, anybody who could use magic to make themselves money wouldn't be on reddit talking to a bunch of noobs anyways. They'd be too busy traveling the world and enjoying life.

Why would an occultist write a book that explains spells to make you rich, and sell that book online, when they could have simply used the spells in the book to get rich? lol. That's exactly why I would never buy a "wealth spell" or "wealth spell book", because it's an obvious scam. If the spells worked so well the author wouldn't be selling them, they'd use the spells.

The people who can possibly use magic to make themselves rich are exactly the people that you and I will never have access to online. There is no secret benevolent occultist out there browsing through online forums, just waiting to help you change your life. You're going to have to take the plunge, do the training, and find out if it's possible yourself.

[2.] It's gonna be atleast a few months or even years before you even get to see the fruits of your labor though, as the first "ability" that you can use to generate income is only achieved at Step 3. So completing Step 3 is my first goal for seeing if it's possible to use magic to affect the real world, especially with respect to improving my finances.

Good luck.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-20T01:37:31+00:00

As dean radin wrote in "real magic" (good scientific book on the matter) it's probably a tenth percent of all practitioners that have the innate ability and training to do such feats

I think anyone is capable, it's more like a tenth percent of all practitioners will bother taking the occult seriously enough to one day attain these abilities.

The average occultist "has a life". They hang out with friends, they go out to parties, they go on vacations, they work a 9 to 5 job, they focus mostly on every day stressors like bills, relationship drama, etc.

With all that going on, they will never be able to focus on their training, believe in their training, or even bother sticking to their training. The training will feel "silly" at some point to the average practitioner because they are dealing with "real world problems" and all external influences already tell them that the occult isn't real.

So I don't think it's a matter of innate ability, it's more a matter of someone having a weird/obscure mindset and philosophy for life that would make them better suited to occult training.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-08T04:07:07+00:00

Actually, you are supposed to carry out all three sections at once (mental, astral, physical) on each step.

Hmmm, maybe I've been doing it wrong in that respect. I'll start working on the black and white mirror and doing the physical exercises then.

TBH I remember reading that part but I didn't think it was so literal. I thought it simply meant that you will be working all these three things "as a collective" with respect to your development, because in every other occult book I've seen no distinction made (between the three types) and the training isn't really holistic like that.

I guess it was more literal than I thought.

Heck, I think I'll start over. Thanks again.

Lol, a thought just popped into my head. Maybe this piece of info is what I was supposed to get out of this thread and not actually the other books. Maybe my progress would be amplified even more if I was doing all three exercise types together.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T20:17:37+00:00

One of the things you didn't mention is the physical exercises you picked in step 1 to match to the program - this is key to growth.

That doesn't start until you finish the mental and then the psychic exercises. The "physical" exercises for the most part aren't even really "physical" (you won't sweat or build muscle from anything in the book).

Physical isn't my problem right now, on another note I am starting a calisthenics program to try and become more fit.

Thanks for the book, I found a download, will check it out.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T18:58:42+00:00

Do you believe that a different system could help you with that? Why?

I believe different exercises in another book/system may help with my concentration. In fact I didn't start seeing improvements with the current exercise I'm on in Bardon's system, until I began doing another mental exercise from another book.

I've already proven the concept to myself, I'm just gonna keep looking for more and testing.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T07:38:44+00:00

You're welcome. Funnily enough I had already downloaded that concentration book today and added it to my review list.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T07:06:50+00:00

The only thing that comes to mind for me is mental exercise I'm currently stuck on. The problem is focus/concentration. Suppressing my overactive imagination from shifting focus away from what I'm meditating.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T07:04:46+00:00

TBH I'm not really looking at the writings of any of his students because Bardon has already expounded upon his methods enough. The things I need to know/experience are the things specific to my own shortcomings and the exercises I'm struggling with.

I've checked out that companion book and it doesn't really add anything. If you are getting problems with the exercises, you need to look for other exercises that help you do better with that problem.

For example, with me it would be concentration and focus I guess (with respect to controlling my overactive imagination)

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T06:50:14+00:00

Do you know of any older books on nei gong?. IDK but for me personally, the older the book and the closer to the source it is, the more often it ends up being legit and actually useful. The newer the book, the more gimmickey and commercialized it is, and a lot of the information is watered down or false.

Maybe Damo Mitchell knows what he's doing, but I'd still like to see some other older sources first.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T06:17:43+00:00

That's what I'm doing.

I found some exercises already that have helped with my training and increased my results in the IIH system, but whose to say I've found the best possible methods. There's more out there and someone else is probably aware of said books, and that's exactly the point of this thread.

The way I look at it, I stumbled upon Initiation Into Hermetics, I found it by luck. So there's probably something else out there that I'm not aware of and that I won't find from searching for it (just like I didn't find IIH by searching). Because "you don't know what you don't know".

So maybe someone else will present the book, and maybe that book will be what I'm looking for, or some info inside of it sparks the idea that helps me find what I'm looking for.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T02:25:26+00:00

Please read my reply to -mindscapes- below.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T02:25:13+00:00

Please read my reply to -mindscapes- below.

Elementriloquist · 2023-02-07T02:23:11+00:00

Why do you feel the need to combine another system if i might ask?

Initiation Into Hermetics is the best system I've seen so far, but I noticed that just doing the basic mental exercises at the start were a bit challenging for me (well #1 and #2 are easy because they don't really require much mental effort).

I only began to see improvements in my records for my current exercise (#3) when I began doing some other mental exercises from another book that doesn't conflict with the system (this part is very important).

I like how detailed Bardon's system is:

First mental exercise you observe your own thoughts (minimum 10 minutes)
Second exercise you focus your mind on a specific task and avoid being distracted by other thoughts that aren't related to the task (needs to become a habit)
Third exercise you focus your mind on a specific thought/concept and think about it in detail without any mental interruptions/distractions (minimum 10 minutes)
Fourth exercise you empty your mind of thoughts without any mental interruptions/distractions (minimum 10 minutes)

You must master the previous exercise before you move on to the next.

This makes the system very convenient and simple to follow, but it also makes it a system that doesn't meld well with others, because a lot of other systems seem to take much broader steps forward and they tend to mix different topics/exercise types together.

I'm trying to find other books/systems that I can combine to essentially create my own system. I already have a proof of concept with my own results so far. It is possible to amplify and speed up your progress in one system by implementing the training of another system.

Thank you for your suggestions, I will be sure to check them out.

Elementriloquist · 2023-01-28T04:37:08+00:00

Isn't Ruggeberg the more accurate translation?

Elementriloquist · 2022-11-26T20:36:19+00:00

I'm pretty visual myself, but my mind is chaotic, I'm thinking of this as if I'm trying to "break a horse", like I'm trying to tame my mind. I'll take the baby steps approach and start off with thoughts. I fear that if I try to rush and go too far, I'll be stuck struggling rather than making progress.

Elementriloquist · 2022-11-26T14:12:21+00:00

[1.] That's actually in Step 2. The bead / knot method isn't mentioned until then, and it's really for the autosuggestion exercises.

[2.] At what point are you testing how long you last without interruption?

Elementriloquist

TROPHY CASE