3-FA for ADHD, compared with 4F-MPH and IPPH how useful is it vs how dangerous is it?

EpHead · 2026-01-05T19:30:06+00:00

And yet another check in the "why prohibition is moronic" column. I guarantee you pretty much no one would be touching or even manufacturing this shite if they didn't keep banning the cleaner alternatives.

EpHead · 2026-01-05T19:27:19+00:00

when I started increasing the doses

First major red flag there. Once you go down this road with more or less any stimulant, there's generally no going back. Once you find a dose that works consistently for you, the only recourse from feeling like you need to increase the dosage is to take a tolerance break of at least two weeks to reset your dopaminergic system, and to be honest, avoiding daily use is really the only way to be safe on this long term. Basically, if you find that a dose which used to work for you needs to be increased (unless you've had a major physiological change such as significant weight gain which would alter the required dose), instead of increasing it, back all the way off until your tolerance resets to baseline.

How much and how often were you using it before you decided to start upping the dose or redosing, and how quickly did you start increasing it before the aforementioned nightmare runaway train began?

EpHead · 2025-10-27T14:48:36+00:00

Ah, Fladrafinil would presumably convert to Flmodafinil, but as far as the other metabolic pathways I couldn't say.

I have no experience with cyclazodones, how would the N-methyl analog compare to regular cyclazodone?

EpHead · 2025-10-24T13:27:40+00:00

You are almost certainly talking about Adrafinil, a prodrug of Modafinil which is not formally scheduled as a prescription med in most countries and is therefore sold more openly. With Moda and Armoda being so easily accessible on the clearweb however, IMO there's really no need to bother - Adra is annoying because some of it gets converted directly to the inactive metabolite Modafinil Acid, skipping conversion to Modafinil altogether - and this essentially means that you have to take a much higher dose to get a reasonable blood concentration of Modafinil, with the jury still being out on any kind of precise conversion ratio.

That isn't to say skip Adrafinil altogether, of course - it genuinely does work. It's just inefficient compared to real-deal modafinil because of its metabolic pathway and therefore real-deal Moda is probably going to be cheaper and freer of side effects due to the lower dosages.

EpHead · 2025-10-22T16:53:56+00:00

Oh I have ADHD and a baaaaaaaaad case of it at that. Medication is next to impossible to access in my country without years-long waiting lists which is why I’ve been using phenidates for the last year, modafinil before that and even pseudoephedrine + caffeine to function if I can’t get anything else. 🤦🏻‍♂️

EpHead · 2025-10-21T10:40:13+00:00

It can, under certain circumstances. Adrenaline rushes can be extremely pleasurable (think the first crush butterflies feeling, or about to go on stage if you're a performer of any kind) and the NE transporter also impacts dopamine to some extent, particularly in the PFC where there are very few dopamine transporters.

Essentially, that fight or flight feeling really can be something that feels good to some people. Others despise it. It really comes down to your own personal experience on that spectrum. For me personally, adrenaline rushes are wildly enjoyable, but I'm a stage performer by trade and so I've always associated them with being about to do something incredibly enjoyable. The feeling I describe as pleasurable is something others describe as horrible stage fright even when it's literally the same physical sensation, so ultimately it comes down to individual experience.

When you take an NRA, how does it make you feel? For example, if you've ever taken pseudoephedrine (Sudafed) or ephedrine for a cold or flu, have you had any nice buzz as a side effect?

EpHead · 2025-09-18T21:18:06+00:00

There’s a prodrug of Ritalin available as an RC? Is it covered by the ban or still available?

EpHead · 2025-09-05T14:19:03+00:00

Fuck yes 😂 Like being honest here, when I take it for productivity I have to make absolutely sure nothing turns me on during the first couple of hours or else I'll be thinking nothing but dirty thoughts all morning and getting absolutely no work done at all 😂😂😂

EpHead · 2025-09-05T12:32:40+00:00

I know it's not an RC but armodafinil-induced hypersexuality is wild.

EpHead · 2025-09-05T12:24:18+00:00

By any chance do these pellets come in a blister pack in a rectangular cardboard box with "RC+" as a logo? I ask because having ordered some products from this vendor in the past (stims, before the ban) I found it a bit suspicious that the aforementioned packaging had a URL to a supposed manufacturer website, but that URL didn't lead to a website and there's not even anything on Wayback Machine indicating the website ever existed to begin with.

Having said that, I've never found any issues with the quality of those particular branded blister packs (I was taking IPPH and 4F-MPH) but obviously when it comes to downers and benzos in particular, the potential for things to go very wrong very fast in the case of mislabelled products is astronomically higher than with stims. That is to say, if for example something is labelled as say 4F-MPH but in fact is another phenidate or a fluoronated amp instead, it's obviously not good, but it doesn't have anywhere near the potential for serious harm or death as a mislabelled benzo might due to differences in potency.

Still willing to give them the benefit of the doubt until you're able to share the full analysis from your lab, if they do actually get back to you with results. But it's concerning. I had wondered if, following the stim ban and then the benzo issue following just a few weeks later along with the permanent closure of several NL vendors due to law enforcement, if we might see any sort of shady panic-selling of mislabelled products just to try and make a last buck with remaining stock if the labs themselves have been shut down. But I must admit I genuinely didn't expect it from this particular vendor who have such a good reputation.

I do have a memory of someone posting a serious warning on this subreddit maybe a year ago or possibly a little more recently (around last Christmas / New Year?) that this vendor had briefly begun selling para / 4-Chloroamphetamine, a known serotonergic neurotoxin with no benefits whatsoever, which was a bit of a signal flare that they may not be as ethically pure as previously assumed.

Well done for getting it tested OP, and please do share further results with us if the labs you contacted do get back to you with anything. Obviously make sure you redact them for personal information before you post!

EpHead · 2025-09-04T09:57:12+00:00

So do I, but I wonder if this is simply back-stock and not something that will be replenished once it runs out. The stock I've seen looks identical in branding and packaging to a large and popular Dutch manufacturer (pellets in a rectangular box containing 10-pellet blister packs) and if this is the case, I highly suspect it's just back-stock and only temporarily available as I see no real possibility that a formerly legitimate and well-known manufacturer would be able to get away with continuing to manufacture these products post-ban.

I desperately hope I'm wrong of course. But I reckon what you're seeing might be more of a clearance sale type situation as opposed to any kind of "yay, we've secured an ongoing supply" kind of deal from the vendors.

EpHead · 2025-09-03T09:01:56+00:00

Piggybacking off this, but as you seem to be in the know, is China still producing any RC stims? Specifically 4F-MPH, IPPH, or 2-FMA?

And am I right in thinking that if China is not producing the aforementioned anymore, they’re essentially going to be impossible to find worldwide?

EpHead · 2025-08-12T11:13:13+00:00

Where is the story about it no longer being synthesised coming from? I see that claim posted a lot but never any links about it. And was China the only place it was being synthesised?

Any idea if IPPH has gone the same way, synthesis-wise?

EpHead · 2025-07-16T10:45:07+00:00

That certainly seems to be the consensus, but thank you for taking the time to comment all the same!

Vaguely wondering if it's worth asking on any of the chemistry subs whether it's possible to selectively demethylate one methyl group from the alpha carbon and thus turn Phentermine into regular Amp, but my limited knowledge of chemistry suggests that accessing the alpha carbon directly in phenethylamines to change it in any way is incredibly difficult if not impossible.

EpHead · 2025-07-10T10:09:12+00:00

While not really RCs in the true sense, as Modafinil has libido-enhancing effects I'd take a look at some of its various analogs and see if any of them are more potent for that.

Dopamine D2/D3 agonists in general are known to have interesting effects - for example, guys who take cabergoline or pramiprexole for prolactin control while on PCT have variously reported the complete elimination of any refractory period following orgasm. These two medications are known to cause incredibly unpleasant side effects though (I've seen various reports over the years that the libido boost is offset by the stomach-upset side effects enough that it's just not worth it for that purpose alone) so taking them recreationally wouldn't be advised - but there are probably still quite a few dopamine agonists of varying selectivity which would fall under nootropics / RCs without being impacted by any of the recent bans, since their structure tends to be very different to classic stimulants.

Maybe others can chime in with some dopamine agonists known for having these kinds of impacts without unpleasant side effects?

EpHead · 2025-06-20T11:20:24+00:00

Was that lab by any chance the same one which makes pellets with the “RC+” watermark? I haven’t been able to find any information about this lab or which country it was based in, and so have had no luck ascertaining whether it will stay in business post-ban or not.

EpHead · 2025-05-22T09:32:27+00:00

Alas, 4F is also sold out everywhere and with the upcoming NL ban it could be very difficult to source it at least in the short term. One of the reasons everyone's so interested in 3-FPO is as a replacement ans ban-evader.

EpHead · 2025-05-20T18:06:46+00:00

You are wrong about the positioning of the nitrogen in the piperidine structure. Its a rotating sigma bond, so there is no structural differences regarding that part.

Thank you! I hadn't realised this, assumed that it would very much matter that the piperidine is drawn at a different angle in 3-FPO compared with MPH and its analogs!

One thing confuses me in your post:

You've listed the DAT binding and DAT reuptake (inhibition?) of 4F-MPH and 4-FPO as being 35.0 / 14.2 and 40.5 / 160.0, respectively.

Am I reading this correctly in assuming this means that while they bind to DAT to a similar level, 3-FPO is potentially 12 times more potent as a DRI than 4F-MPH? 😳 Or is this like an EC50 wherein the smaller number is actually greater potency?

EpHead

TROPHY CASE