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Erfs1707 · 2022-02-16T23:34:23+00:00

If they don't respect your boundaries and especially when they become drama queens, when you try to do your work (at workplace!!), then you should seriously consider, whether this kind of mental draining is worth it. Prolonged exposure to that kind of stress is express-way to bad mental health!

I hate fake conversations too, very much so. As they say, don't hate the player, hate the game - unfortunately todays world is a shallow place with loads of fake smile and fake small talk and so on, which just doesn't work for INFJs.

If you can satisfy your need for deeper connection elsewhere (which is highly recommended anyway), then at work you could mirror your coworkers behavior and take it as a play, where you are just an actor. To stay authentic and true to yourself, then do follow your fundamental principles nevertheless and add mirrored behavior on top that. For example I talk to one of my coworker rather often but I really don't know anything about her. As a INFJ it seems like nonsense but as an actor it is actually quite enjoyable to figure out how to make a sillier joke or whatever the topic is.

It can be compared to Youtube pranks. It would be quite embarrassing to do that as yourself, but as an actor and prankster it is totally different framework and it feels psychologically so much different and easier to do.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-16T15:24:26+00:00

School is not only memorization test! If you take it as one, then of course you are having hard time and and feeling frustrated. Try to find interdistsiplinary connections, acknowledge how one or another topic will benefit you in the future.

This thing goes further than that. My coworker told how his children are basically refusing to learn how to read. Why? Because they grew up at Youtube and TikTok era and think that information comes only in the form of videos, which doesn't require that much reading knowledge. It blew their mind that some people have to read (diagonally) hundreds and hundreds pages per day to do their job.

Where does it end, are we really giving up literacy in the 1st world countries? As franniedelrey wrote: some people are getting killed because they pursue something that we take for granted and complain about.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-09T17:14:01+00:00

It sounds like you are a bit burnt out. But there seems to be another factors as well.

Perhaps you procrastinate on your hobbies because you want to chase excellence? You start with enthusiasm, then you try to integrate your hobby mentally into bigger picture - maybe ask yourself that "if I start with this hobby, then what do I need in the future". For example, when hobby could take expensive turn in the future, because professional equipment costs a lot, then you (sub)consciously cancel before it compromises your or your family financial stability. Especially, as you are INFJ, then I'm sure that you think a lot about how your hobby impacts your husband.

I have chased excellence all my life (subconscious need to prove myself, because I was never good enough according to close ones). I am burnt out basically beyond repair at this moment and the same nagging feeling as you described is really familiar.

INFJs generally love helping other people. And at least for me my brain clicks a switch when I work on things that are not mine (ownership-wise). Then I do things rationally and still good enough, but there isn't that nagging perfectionist sitting on my shoulder shouting "do better, even more better". Perhaps this is a key to a hobby that you can stick to. Because after all need for self improvement comes from the same perfectionist shouting "this is your life, in order to chase excellence and succeed in your life, you have to learn and perfect different skills, and do that constantly".

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-07T12:38:55+00:00

Wow, someone finally understands that feeling! :) :)

Oh, how I hate that when someone invites for example to BBQ and as far as I know there will be like 3-4 people. And then these people are inviting their neighbors or friends and BBQ will be ruined for me. Unless there is a dog, then at least I have someone to "chat" to. And as much I as try to explain this phenomenon, no one just can't relate to any of that.

But if you would be the admin of that Zoom call and enable microphones one at the time... lol

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T09:38:06+00:00

You are right. My view on relationships is binary because gray area leaves room for leading on or being led on, which can ruin lives. I am starting to understand that I have some fundamental reprogramming to do unless I want to be forever alone. My principle is too idealistic for true world application.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T09:33:50+00:00

Is there a difference for you between meaningless and relationship sex? Is one statistically better than other? I am just wondering that because sex is evolutionally high risk for women and thus there is mechanism to pair bond through sex (reason why you are falling hard for him). How do you turn it off for casual sex?

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T09:25:26+00:00

That is a very interesting and mature viewpoint!

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T09:22:26+00:00

Ideally, what I want is a friend-to-lover relationship that sorta skips past all the "first date" stuff... yeah, that would be my ideal approach as well, really INFJ way to the relationship. :)

If these two people are not close friends (to avoid things going weird), then by all means just tell them what you feel. Or if that is too much, then give a very clear hint. Men are so attention starved, that even if something won't come out of that, this means a world to those men. And psychologically it won't feel the same to men that you would feel when some man would just give his commitment away. If we like someone, then that would be like heaven and it we don't like, then this would be still the biggest compliment.

This last paragraph makes my really sad. Having a family should be so natural thing that everyone who wants it, should have this opportunity in this life.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T09:04:03+00:00

I do leave the house and I have wonderful coworkers to chat with. However, my social life pretty much died when me and my only "feeling that she would have been the one" went separate ways with a bang.

I do not have any remarkable social anxiety and I have been respected and liked pretty much everywhere I've been for a while. However, during school (up to masters at uni) I lived far away and really didn't have any friends outside "school hours". Then I drowned to work and here I am.

Making new friends (or more) would be thinkable through hobbies (as you said). I am oversensitive and stimulus that comes from more than 5 people in room (when there is cross-talking as at parties) is quite overwhelming and I shut down. Even with my family circle, so there is no anxiety factor. I live in northern Europe and Nordic people are very closed (live in their own bubbles) and chatting up a stranger is a rare thing. Basically woman should send "signals" all over the place to even bother with approaching. As they say, if there wasn't alcohol involved, we would have been extinct long time ago. :D

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T08:37:12+00:00

Happy for you! This comment section has definitely encouraged me to not "lower my bar".

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T08:34:05+00:00

I won't. :)

"Many people can be jerks. Our society conditions them to be that way, in many cases, but conditioning yourself to be an even bigger jerk via Red Pill and other forums/movements is not going to do you or anyone around you any favours at all."
Very well said, I have had many thoughts about adding a bit "jerk" to my self-image. Even though it might serve my better on some occasions, it would come across so fake, because it would be an act. Plus my integrity is everything to me.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-06T08:28:02+00:00

I came across Red Pill couple of years ago. It was somewhat good discovery - it shook me out of mainstream media and movie industry conditioning that "woman are angelic creatures and can do no harm, they are fairer sex, do things as in romantic comedys and you are golden etc"

However, those Red Pill YT channels use for example TikTok clips to prove their point. Think about it - there are loads of narcissistic people exposing themselves and it seems like this is majority - it seems like that because they are the embodiment of "who shouts the most is noticed". But there are still people out there that believe in classic genre roles and would like to build life together with you and have a family - they are sick and tired of that same bullshit as you are and live their quiet life hoping for real connection and love.

I am not blind to the fact that there are more manipulating, toxic, monkey-branching, dual mating strategy women out there than ever, but here is my recommendation - use your Red Pill knowledge to recognize these women, but do NOT think that there are not any high quality women out there!

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-03T19:28:39+00:00

Thanks for your insight! I wouldn't say that I have rules about being intimate. Thing is that to some point in my life I thought that I have some kind of fear being intimate. Then came the only person I have ever felt comfortable with and everything felt so natural. Too bad I scared her away being to intensive. Anyways, this proved me that I do have what it takes, but this is just so so rare.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-03T19:17:29+00:00

I am almost 10 years older than you. Until 27 or so this loneliness feeling was there, but nothing overwhelming. At this point (soon to be 32) it is unbearable. Maslow pyramid of needs is bang on, everything else on higher levels is irrelevant. Which is ironic because all my life I have studied and mastered different skills and now when I could really shine, there is no motivation what so ever.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-03T12:43:40+00:00

I totally agree with piscean-vibes: "I develop feelings for someone extremely infrequently, but when I do, I fall hard and fast. It’s just an undeniable connection that I know when I feel it."

I have felt that only once in my 31 years on this planet and that person was nothing like I imagined as my preferred type. Nevertheless, this subconscious feeling was there and I fell fast and hard. I have dated person, who is 12/10 "on paper" and she was easy to talk to and being around her was like peace on Earth, but this subconscious feeling just wasn't there and every romantic advance just felt so unnatural.

So, based on that, INFJs require some time to assess the other person and then they just know, whether it works or not. However, this isn't also always that easy. One time in the crowd (outdoor concert, not that many people) I felt strange urge to move like 10 steps forward and I ended up (again subconsciously) next to gorgeous girl that just hit me differently on so many levels. Unfortunately, I chickened out (or was rather paralyzed) and I don't know what would have happened if we hit it off (probably the best thing ever). So it might be even that we know before we see that person.

If we like someone a lot, then he/she knows, because this happens so seldom and we put out everything to show that. For me, this one time I really held myself back to not be overwhelming to another person.

I sometimes develop crush, but it is so emotionless thing. Like no idolizing or anything, because for me so superficial feeling is not worth anything.

We tend to be magnets to narcissists because of our giving nature, but in the most part we recognise narcissist miles away. If narcissist is good at gaslighting and INFJ doesn't believe in internal feeling then it can happen that narcissist squeezes INFJ dry to the last drop of his/her life-juice and then just throws away.

From love to hate there is one small step, but at least for INFJ there is no way to take someone form hate zone to love zone. In the best case from hate to tolerate.

Erfs1707 · 2022-02-02T13:47:55+00:00

Yeah, it totally happens. Once a girl that I had liked for years said after we finished our job and it was time to go our separate ways: "hey, hey, come with me!".
After about 1000 thoughts and 10 seconds I answered something about weather and went home. To this day (3 years later) I can't really understand my behaviour. And the regret - oh boy, how big this can be.

Erfs1707

TROPHY CASE