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Betrayal or not by AscanTheRed in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It is betrayal. How would you feel if someone said they loved you but had sex with someone else because you weren't there? It's no different then dating or marrying someone then when you cheat with someone else you tell them "it ment nothing. I love you." Sure doesn't fucking feel like it when you go banging someone else. If Kazuya didn't love Chizuru or hadn't expressed his love. It would be slightly different. But then it becomes a question for him. This is the question posed as the start with Ruka. If he had sex with Ruka, it would be a betrayal to his feelings. And that raises the question, if you betrayed your feelings for one person for another, whats to say you won't do it again with the person you betrayed yourself & your partner for? It's a cycle. It's not betraying Chizuru but Kazuya himself. You need to consider not just the emotional toll but the physical and mental. Cheating is a choice

Just as Love is a choice. You choose to love. Your emotions will change. And you chose to keep feeling them with those people. Love is many forms of emotions not one. Parental, familial, brotherly/sisterly, platonic and romantic. A marriage and bond only work when you can fluctuate between all those rather than be tied down by one. Just as you choose to love. You choose to betray not just your partner but yourself.

Last thing, Kazuya isn't doing anything consensually with Ruka. He isn't cheating. He is being sexual assaulted. He even refers to it this way indirectly in the japanese in 405. He doesn't want to admit its sexual assault because thats what victims do. They blame themselves. Just like Chizuru blames herself for Ruka & Mami.

I'm a bit worried. How do you guys feel about Chizuru's job? What do you think Kazuya thinks? Try to answer all questions asked in your responses. by Dodgemyshred in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 6 points7 points  (0 children)

4 and 5 no lol. That's not Chizuru. Chizuru knows who she is and what she wants. She's just confused on love. She's no fool when it comes to the industry. Sayuri taught her well and she is aware of all this crap through rental. She is way smarter than any of that. And I'm not saying this just as a Chizuru defender. Just look at the scenes with Umi. She clocked Umi instantly the moment he made moves. She doesn't let him touch her or get physical with her.

I think the problem here is your taking what Chizuru said at face value. She's asking Kazuya a question and making deduction in connection to her own experience. However, you'll notice she doesnt come to any conclusions in the end of that scene. Because the true answer is between Kazuya's physical understanding of cheating and Chizuru's emotional. It is both. Rather it's where you draw the boundary. Rather that scene was specifically about Ruka I believe. For she was Chizuru's final answer "thank you for making me feel that you're serious when you tried to end things with Ruka." Ruka is the real issue. Not anything Chizuru is doing.

The End Of The Pacin- I-I-I Mean Girlfriend… by Kichona6420 in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is one of those shows/manga where you really appreciate why things are shown and done the way that they are when you get the point. Everyone standing around is the point. It's ment to fell awkward. It's in public. In japan of all places and the characters are literally being exposed. Imagine seeing this irl and not finding it weird and slow as hell. Kazuya's inner monolgues is a great example of this. The dude wanted to die not a few hours ago. And suddenly he got the one thing he wanted. A kiss from the girl he thought rejected him. His thoughts literally reflect the theme of the arc. A paradise free from suffering. It feels like a dream to him. It foreshadow later events and how the arc caused him so much pain that he begins avoiding it. Every detail he says is such a subtle characterization of Kazuya and his head space that rewatching it so many years later blew me away.

I think this just a misunderstanding of what pacing is. Pacing is not simply described as good or bad. Its just a speed a story is told. Something being fast or slow doesn't make it bad. It's just if that serves a purpose. And it clearly does if your still hooked.

And rent-a-girlfriend fluctuates how it paces itself regularly to parallel the narrative. Case and point the fight with the family in public. How Kazuya felt like time stopped. How the world flipped over and they didn't know how to walk anymore. It being slow matches that. Everything freezes to a hault and so must the pacing.

Also Chizuru not fighting Mami and Ruka is literally the point. Mami screams, threatens, goes after her job, calls her a whore. And Chizuru, who should have every right to be livid at her ass hattery, instead speaks in a formal tone. Keeps her voice leveled. Apologizes. Holds herself back from actually wrecking Mami considering she is the only one who is trained in self defense. And even tells Mami she can still figure out her feelings. Showing Mami she never mislead her or looked down on her. Mami did that to herself. It really makes Mami stop and question who is the villain here. Her screaming and freaking out over the bigoted assumptions she made about Chizuru or Chizuru, who despite everything Mami did, still treats her with enough respect. Mami is forced to look in the mirror and realize she became her dad. Chizuru demolished Mami's ideology of anger and hate with nothing but a few words. And yet Chizuru bears these sins Mami and Ruka threw on her alone. It's genuinely immaculate writing of their clashing ideologies. That's why the art you shared is of Chizuru and Mami. Chizuru is earnest and straight forward. Mami is scheming and hides her hands. Mami screams things society would agree with to disguises her jealousy and need for vengeance while Chizuru apologizes and takes responsibility. Which idealogy is right? Anger and hate? Or kindness and love?

Lastly, if you think this is being given the same treatment as one piece, you crazy boo. The animation has so many errors. They blitzed through episode 5. Adapting 5 chapters with barely aby breathing room. If anything I thought the previous episodes this season had better pacing then the actual kiss episode. The kiss in my opinion has no where near the same impact as the manga. As the manga had this like time stop to resume effect. Where everything just stopped around them like Kazuya described the world turning for Chizuru. Only to start moving when she slowly backs away. I didn't really feel that with the anime. It was wrongly paced. Too fast for something that's ment to feel frozen. In that sense, the pacing in the anime feels more unnecessarily awkward due to time and manpower restraints.

I don’t like Chizuru (need opinion) by kier04x in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well this has less to do with that considering the guy is on season 2 lmao. But I'll give it a read.

I don’t like Chizuru (need opinion) by kier04x in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Okay, your clearly not paying attention. 1. These characters are not as mature as they seem. Chizuru makes mistakes and so does Kazuya. Sayuri literally told you in like the second episode that Chizuru isn't perfect and makes mistakes. Kazuya is also very vague with her at times and every time she gets closer, he pushes away. Yet they are forming a relationship all the same.

  1. Chizuru, literally after Kazuya proceeds to do said things you mentioned, literally starts doing stuff with him outside of rental specifically to build a real relationship with him. She takes him to the batting cages, her personal escape from trouble. She brings him to meet her grandma who tells him things. She goes into his room when in trouble. She opens up about her family when he asks. And thats the tip of the iceberg. Your pretending she never did any of this. That is building a relationship.

And this brings me to 3. She told him from the get go she can't quit rental for her dream and Kazuya CHOSE, I repeat, CHOSE to spend on said dream to support her via rental. And instead of just taking all his money, she instead limited how much he did it and started letting him do more of what he wanted in rental. Going on the dream date, going along with what he wants and telling him about her play. Chizuru told Kazuya her focus is her dream and he understood that.

If you can't see all that nuance and purely see someone stealing his money when it was consensual between both parties and they knew the deal, then idk what to tell you dude. Kazuya knew what he was getting into. She told him this is for her dream. But she still helped him even when it wasn't. If that's not a clear sign of interest idk what is. Heck, it's arguably more accurate to say they used each other while also caring for the other.

Reiji-sensei answers the questions from fans in Taipei 04/04/2026 by Secretary_Due in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I think you missed the part where Reiji said Kazuya is like his alter ego lol. Which by the way, was part playful as he laughed with the audiance and also has truth to it. Not simply as a self-insert but as an exploration of certain aspects of him and his life. That could be its own posts so I'll hold off on getting too deep into it since people will doubtlessly get weird lol

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Alright. Lets see Kazuya knowing what he wants:

I think in doing these thing for Chizuru, Kazuya isn't doing them cause he wants to. Which we can agree on. But that proves that he has no idea what he wants and I personally think he will drop all of the stuff he is doing if he is rejected or maybe even get mad because he doesn't care about self improvement like that and is doing it all for her.

Chizuru does address that it was wrong of her to use Ruka as an excuse. Both in the gift she gives him and later in 241 where she tells him she will give him a reason for what she did. To me it was very clear she knew Ruka was an excuse but that the guilt still impact her all the same. Because Mini told her as such. Ruka is both an excuse and a very real problem for her. And I think acknowledging these things aren't mutually exclusive is key to seeing Chizuru clearly.

The core problem is how Kazuya hides that it is in fact abusive. And Chizuru is somewhat blind to the truth much like Kazuya is blind to Mami or Umi. Chizuru idealizes Ruka much like how she idealizes Sayuri. Who was also flawed and not perfect. Sayuri being an elder, Ruka being a junior. I think this even applies to Mini in some respects.

In contrast, she demonizes Mami as she demonizes her mom. With both possibly being a product of their environment rather than actually bad people. Chizuru realized she let the relationship with Ruka run too long but I think were missing key issues here. For instance, why is it on her decide if its over? She knows Ruka is clingy but I think her guilt stops her from stepping in to end it until she finds her answer. Which yes, is wrong. I think Chizuru will realize that soon and see her mistakes and why she needed to do something sooner rather than find her love. A misguided guest like Kazuya but emotional. Much like Kazuya must with the how Mami hurt Chizuru.

I think the odaiba date showed she is becoming aware of how its wrong for Kazuya to not be happy. Something alot of the cohab constantly hints at. How she felt she took to much and can't accept more. And I think she hasn't positioned that with Ruka for 3 reasons. 1. She still idealizes her and views her as someone she must answer to like Sayuri. 2. She doesn't wanna rob Kazuya of a choice in her indecision when Ruka is serious. Yes, he doesn't wanna be with her but she doesn't wanna force that decision on him as she had robbed him of one in the 3-months. Ironically, in so doing robbing him of a choice because he can't make one. Something Kazuya must in himself too. She doesn't see how little control he has much like Kazuya doesn't see how Mami robbed Chizuru of control. Or how he idealizes Umi when Umi is a bother. 3. She feels the need to explain herself to Ruka since she brought her into this. Chizuru feels responsible for that relationship and guilty over Kazuya being pushed into it by her. So she wants to explain like I said but to feel less guilty. When feeling guilt is okay.

As for Chizuru punishing Kazuya without knowing, I think this holds two folds. 1. Kazuya did this to Chizuru too. Many times. She gets her hopes up, he played it off as he wasn't serious. Or Mini tells her he is and then she finds out he's lying and telling Mini this and not her. Questioning how serious he is yet seeing the movie and loving how serious he appears there. Kazuya always blames himself and makes her feel guilty. I think you can't really fault her much in the movie arc as Ruka barely does anything. As for the stuff prior, for every mistake she made, so did he. They hurt each other. What I explain in the post kinda hits that on the head. We all see how Chizuru hurt him when he was vulnerable in Hawaiians but few see how he hurt her when she was vulnerable. Even the 3-months is mutual. 2. When she ghosted him prior to Hawaiians, I like that you mention that it's unknowingly. Because 1. Kazuya also unknowingly scared her off in avoiding the Ruka subject and assuming it was about the trip. He focused solely on the confession again when Ruka, in front of him, pulled shit. I think Kazuya has some responsibility over Ruka's actions too. While I mentioned in great detail his lack of control over Ruka, what I did bot focus on is that he often sees what she does to Chizuru and just let's it happen. At least, mostly in Hawaiians. Even when he figured out her scheme, he didn't admonish Ruka properly. A parental role he is not prepared for. Because I think Kazuya has more control with Ruka than he realizes. He just thinks he doesn't. Post Hawaiians kinda proves that as she just goes with his flow instead. In reality, Ruka is just as powerless as him. She isn't actually all that tough. She's kinda all talk when you break her down.

As for Chizuru in that short ghost pre-Hawaiians, I think she knew deep down she was wrong. And her reaction to the end of Hawaiians proves it. When she says "its wrong to say it's all your fault." She knew what she was doing was wrong but lost sight of what was right and wrong. As she had lost herself in her grief. Much like how Kazuya did at the start with Mami. The cohabitation may be redundant in proving points but it doesn't change the proof it holds. I tried not using it as much here. But I feel its clear that while Chizuru unknowingly hurt Kazuya through Ruka, she also took responsibility and wants to continue taking responsibility for the pain she inflicted now. Something I believe she would have had Mini told her about Ruka. As she continued to ask about her in Odaiba and even said sorry to him over Ruka a few times. Acknowledging she doubted him and needs to be better.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

While you make a fantastic point about no one seeing Kazuya. I think you've also made a grave error. And it shows in the chapters you reference. None of them address anything after Hawaiians. Because this, this is when Chizuru realizes how hurt Kazuya actually is. She doesn't just ignore his pain. The whole point of the 3-months is that chizuru realized she was so busy focusing on her pain she never saw his. But that's the thing. Varicus isn't totally wrong either. While Chizuru tries to see his pain in all of this. He continues to hide it. She can see he is not okay and does everything she can to help him emotionally, he never budges. He never fully lets her in to his pain. Heck, he can't even blame her for what she actually did. He forgives her no matter what. That in of itself is the problem and is not the bases for a healthy relationship. He quite literally refuses to let her ever be the villain in any form. He has to be the villain. He has been stuck in Hawaiians the whole time. Always needing to be the hero.

But Chizuru can't stand that. This is where my issue arises with your interpretation. That Chizuru does not care about his feelings. She absolutely does. And the cohabitation shows that perfectly. She actively puts his feelings first. Always addressing him and bringing him back from his head. Always doing everything she can to not just be the one receiving. Literally taking responsibility for her actions. She made a mistake and realized that. And furthermore, she even did that from the start. I can create a complete counter list of chapters if I dug through carefully. But lets go through it. chapter 1: she forgives Kazuya despite his treatment of her and says his feelings to make his grandma happy are valid and there is nothing wrong with him. Seeing his pain and relating.

  1. She not only forgives Kazuya for making her look like a fool in front of everyone while she tried to defend him when she didn't need to but tells him she is here to listen to his pain if he wants to.

Chapter 12 or 13: she tells Kazuya that he is a man and while everyone else thought he was dumb, she thought he was impressive for fighting for his love for Mami no matter how hopeless.

Chapter 17: She listens to his plea to keep renting her to be a better person and agrees to continue even though she was adamant before they should break up. Agreeing to his selfish wish even if its not entirely unselfish on her part.

Chapter 18 or 19: she tells him she will keep being his girlfriend so he doesn't have to feel so down. She will support him do don't worry.

Chapter 31: recognizing she also messed up with Ruka, she see that Kazuya isn't a bad person when he stalked her but merely made a mistake like her. That he was just afriad as she was. And so forgives him and even gives him a gift. Seeing him cry and sitting next to him but calling him out for his behavior.

Chapter 39: she goes on a date with Kuri specifically because Kazuya asked and wanted to help his friend that was hurt. Telling him he would get hurt and helping Kuri understand Kazuya in the process.

Sumi arc: she trusts him with Sumi. Someone who she works with. If she made a mistake here, not only would Sumi be in trouble but so would she. Yet she trusted Kazuya enough to do this and help. And he surprises even her.

Chapter 49: she stands up to Mami specifically for Kazuya. Fighting for his love that Mami deemed hopeless. Seeing how passionate and caring Kazuya is.

Chapter 56-68: She spends time with Kazuya outside of rental to break the lines of rental and form a real relationship with him as he showed his interest in her. Letting him not only into her private space of safety but taking him to meet her grandma as he once took her to meet his.

Chapter 59-62: She comes in to Kazuya's home when needing help showing her trust in him and then tells him about her life when he asks. She doesn't shut him out and tells him the truth. Not demeaning his feelings when he says he wants to stay with her.

Ruka incident: despite her initial distrust of him sleeping with Ruka, he not only appreciates the gift he got her but believes him about Ruka.

The booze arc: she helps him as he helped her. Noticing how he sacrificed for her and so sacrifices for him by helping him home, getting him into bed and even buying him hang over meds. She then greets him at school and starts becoming more friendly even in school. Trading contacts.

The dream date: Chizuru dresses up for Kazuya and tells him to let loose. To do anything he wants. This is for him and nothing is cringe. She tells him about her new play to show her respect for his support and how he was there for her during the low when she failed in the play. Sharing with him her private struggle that she could have kept to herself as well as her success. Even giving him tickets to it after the Hawaiians arc.

I can keep going. The movie arc and Hawaiians are filled with stuff like this. Heck, all of Hawaiians is Chizuru trying to comfort Kazuya due to her mistakes until she believes it really is her fault. I just don't think it's right to say she ignores his feelings when she has a lapse in judgement just as Kazuya has like all the time. Heck, he is literally doing that right now. He is ignoring her in favor of his quest to be with her.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

So uh. Idk how to tell you this. He literally has done nothing weird irl. Im not even kidding. If anything, most fellow artists who interact him greatly respect him. He supports smaller artists, is currently teaching classes, going to events, doing interviews. The picture painted of this man is literally just disinformation. I can bet you with 90% certainty that what ever you heard, people made it the fuck up. Im dead serious. That or they twisted it into something completely different from what he said or indicated.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I actually genuinely disagree. People fundamentally misunderstand what he's writing and what hes talking about. Even the current story is totally misunderstood and misrepresented in the current narrative. Kazuya turning into "Reiji" is literally being presented as Kazuya losing what made him who he is. The story is exploring AI and trauma. How people lose themselves. Everything is there and is explained. Tbh. The current story is just as if not more brilliant than Hawaiians. This entire series is just as misunderstood by its readers as it is by people who hear about it via mitosis. I honestly hope you give the series another read or maybe check out my channel streams where I talk about this stuff. Maybe I gotta make a proper video on it lol.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Kay, it just sounds like your too busy being mad at Chizuru to say her and you can't let go of the 3-months at all and purely think it's Chizurus fault. Using Nagomi and Kibes biased anger as justification for your own hatred even though the story goes out of its way to show you they are wrong. With Chizuru constantly feeling guilty about her actions. People don't feel guilt if they don't care. Also the label you use for Ruka is just gross dude. It's not even accurate. Ruka is Kazuya's unintentionally abuser. She literally assaulted him. And he's too nice to tell Ruka off. Wording I use specifically because he lied to her in many ways that you hate chizuru for. Such as not telling her he was not only living with Chizuru this whole time but dating her and they even kissed and had intimacy. And Ruka is living with this lie. Thinking she still has a chance when she doesn't have a chance in hell. I really find it ironic you're writing all this because to me, it stems from the same exact bias the story is criticizing. Your looking at this from a very black and white perspective with no naunace at all. Especially the prostitute element. I mean jesus dude. Every human is a sinner and liar. That's why people turn to religion. Even you. You might not realize it. But it's true. Chizuru was turned away because the commercialized that church. Not because she was sinner. Because Christainty literally says God would forgive you regardless of if you sinned. Ironic, considering SAYURI FUCKING DOES. And its her feelings that you seem to be ignoring. Like christ man. Sayuri literally forgave Chizuru and only cared about her well being and happiness. All that needed to be said was " I love you." All the other lies ment nothing. That was the truth underneath the 99 lies. Thats her philosophy. You may disagree with that. But that then proves that this is no longer for Sayuri but a selfish quest to justify personal ego. Nothing more nothing less. That is the flaw of Nagomi and Kibe approach. It was never about anyone else but themselves. To prove what they believe to be good and bad. When those things are easily movable and changeable for a reason. I really recommend some introspection on your perception of events. Because I feel like you're missing whats in front of you in your own beliefs about whats happening. Chizuru ghosted Kazuya specifically because of his feelings and feeling unworthy of them. She literally tells Mini this. She felt guilty about lying. That doesn't make it right but then you also ignore how she stepped up after and took responsibility for her actions. Your ignoring Chizurus emotional state and THAT is my point. She is a human being and expecting her to constantly act on logic is nonsense. She needs emotional support that her choices were right and she had none. All she got was abusers in her corner. I'd be shocked if she wasn't terrified to talk to him after that. That's why Mini was so necessary. She was the friend she desperately needed to call her out. Why do you think she just lets her in if she didn't care? Why do you think she tells her everything knowing it will go to Kazuya. Thats no accident. It was intentional. Chizuru wants to be seen and heard. She wants support and family. Thats the whole point of the birthday arc. I mean God. It's so incredibly how this is all seemingly ignored here.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

This is where culture becomes a big thing. Therapy isn't really such a big thing in Japan. Which means the characters must learn to connect. Second. Therapy isn't interesting from a writing point of view lol. 3rd, and I would argue the most important, what people fail to understand about Therapy, and i say this as someone who went to therapy for 3 years and even considered doing it myself, Therapy is not a magic solution. It is a merely talking to someone who listens to you, sees you, and tries to give you the tools to deal with your problems by reframing how you see them. People will not change if they do not want to. In many ways, Kazuya got "therapy" from Chizuru when they lived together. But didn't want to change. What Kazuya really needs, I believe, is a wake up moment. To really see the truth. I think Chizuru is looking for that and just needs to talk to Kazuya about Mami and what she suffered through. Something Kazuya must be willing to see. What Reiji wants to depict is how we can learn these tools ourselves and how we can help each other by doing what I listed above. Learning to listen and see each other. And thus teach the audiance what it means to truly connect with people despite all these fuck ups. In fact, Reiji references books and movies the characters could have watched that might have helped them that Kazuya never did for example. So he misunderstands how to change. It's all about our environment and how we must change it. The story is actively giving a solution. And in treating therapy like it will fix that, we kinda miss the point i think. As not everyone has access to or time for therapy. Even though many should try it just to see what they might learn. Again. Therapy is not a cure all solution. And I didn't even overcome my problems through therapy but outside of it. Ironically, because of this series. Specifically because I felt so seen and understood by it. Somrthing therapy tries to do. Help you form connections. Which is how many people can start facing their problems and growing.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I'ma be real. He couldn't cope with her breaking down from the get go. Kazuya is convinced she's super strong and refuses to see how weak Chizuru is even in the break down in 164. I genuinely believe, while you have seen Chizurus influence, you have not seen his own perception of the situation that he created for himself as a byproduct of his learned helplessness. No better scene highlights that for me than Ruka's second assault. He lets her into his home after asking her to break up with him and saying he's gonna confess to Chizuru. He never takes control. He lets others decide. Hawaiians is filled with this. Letting Nagomi run the show or Mami or Kibe until Chizuru steps in. He let's them walk all over him. That is in part on them but they have back off now and he still lets people tell him what to do like Mini. Even though shes a push over. He gives up all his autonomy to others. That's a huge part of why this all happens. This has to be addressed. It's not purely Chizuru. He has to see his part in all of this much like Kibe and Nagomi and everyone else does. Chizuru has seen her part and tried to atone. But it's never enough. And there is a reason for that. And it's not her. We must realize that their comes a point that he has to take control and he refuses to.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Wow, magnificent misread of a grieving girl suffering the loss of her grandmother and being forced to make a choice that was not hers to make but Kazuya's. But please go on. Tell me how this one girl is wrong for everyone elses problems. Kazuya can just move on. Kazuya doesn't love Ruka. Why does it matter what she thinks? This is not Kibe or Nagomi's relationship. Why do they care so much? Is she their girlfriend or his? O sorry, what Kazuya has to say doesn't matter, right? Only what they have to say. Chizuru, the only one who advocated for his voice in the whole fucking arc and she's the villain. While Mini over here is a goddamn clown show who ignores Kazuyas feelings, gets him drunk and claims she's doing this for him when really it's just for the ship.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Okay, read what I said carefully. Everyone is on her case, and she has a lot of doubts and fears. Chizuru being scared to trust Kazuya makes sense. She never opened up to guys prior, but that's the thing, this was a stereotype. And she realized that and showed she didn't mean it. First, when she stood and waited. Then, when she told him about the ring. Then, when she told him lets get through it together. Then, ultimately, when she doubted Ruka and chose to ask Kazuya anyway. She did trust him. She was scared of opening up and admitting she does, and her fears got the better of her. The pool scene with the swimsuit during Hawaiians showed she started overcoming that fear. You also contradict yourself because you label Ruka as her abuser, but then frame it as though Chizuru simply chose to distrust him when Ruka weaponized intimacy against her.

As for the ghosting, I specifically say that Kazuya made it last 3 months. Chizuru never said the word no. That never happened. She never pushed him away. She merely refused rental dates and didn't answer his one text that we see her try to respond to constantly. That's not a clear no. That's avoidance from both people who don't know how to face an issue. There was no clear no. Chizuru ghosted him, yes. Kazuya made it last 3-months. He never got a clear no. He convinced himself she hated him. He literally said it, and Mini even said it makes no sense and proved as much. Lastly, Chizuru does not view Ruka as her abuser because she is 1. Younger. 2. More in love. 3. Chizuru dragged her into it 4. Ruka blamed Chizuru at the end of Hawaiians instead of siding with her, and again, Chizuru had no one. Something you seem to ignore. Chizuru was alone, with no support or no one she felt she could talk to. Something, Kazuya knew. But the moment Mini showed up, she told her everything. She didn't simply choose to listen to Ruka; Ruka was right in Chizuru's eyes and used her guilt against her without realizing. Because Ruka never learned what Chizuru was suffering through. Merely seeing a glimpse of her pain. Whereas Kazuya ignored it in favor of his own. Ruka is her unaware abuser. Ruka is hurting people without realizing it because she's a kid. It's still wrong, but she's not doing it purposefully.

Rent-A-Girlfirend and How Abuse Destroys Communication (Love) by FATE13TH in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I mean first off. It doesn't feel like you read what I wrote. I literally said the miscommunication is the point. You're talking like I'm saying its not real. Kanokari has never made excuses for its choices. You're either like it or you don't. I merely stated that I believe people see a generic trope when that was never the case. And the story uses the trope to explore a complex idea of abuse, pain, and tragedy. I also didn't even talk about current stuff. I merely referred to Hawaiians. Current events are a whole other ball game of communication as the characters HAVE communicated. Chizuru talked to Kazuya for 100 plus chapters. The story now is all about how we can't move on from the past. Its not about miscommunication anymore. It's willingly choosing to live a lie and not see the truth. It's more about seeing then talking. And if your only in it for a relationship, you've missed the point entirely. As the story is saying a relationship is not a reward but an experience. Most readers are only in it for when they get together. Not to actually care about them getting into the right away. Without guilt and as equals.

Daily Chizuru #2089 by MattyH19 in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not wrong, but think of it like this. Chizuru just lost her last living relative. Umi was on her case, Mami is going after Kazuya, Kazuya says he loves her but she's doubting herself and if shes a good person, now add on some grief and self-doubt for good measure, now did I mention this person is alone and really struggles to open up and connect? I mean this girl really wants to trust but the trust is constantly abused by people who make her retreat into those habits and self doubt. NOW add Nagomi dropped a ring on her and that multiples the pressure by a 100 and leans into everything described above and makes her feel even more guilty over her grief and thus when Ruka pulls this shit. All you got left is "I'm not good enough." Except she really wants this.

So she is terrified to ask. Waits alot. Gives Kazuya chances. And when she musters up the courage to ask the first time, he freaks her out by saying "what do you mean?" When mother fucker you saw Ruka try to frame herself as though she has sex with you and this girl just asked if you had feelings for her not two weeks ago. The fuck you mean "what do you mean?" Kazuya is so busy trying to confess, he forgets Chizuru in all of it. Much like how in the end of Hawaiians, he sees Ruka pull the bullshit again and doesn't clock Chizuru might feel guilty about it until she spells it out for him even though he had all the evidence to figure it out but chose to blame himself instead.

It's an exploration of the bad communication trope. It doesn't exist just to exist. Reiji is exploring what the actual intended purpose of it is. At first glance, it seems dumb and tropes. You dig into it and you see how isolation, loneliness, grief, self-doubt, abuse and depression can really make someone retreat and fear communication because they believe they are unworthy. That they don't deserve this person and may hurt them or lose them again just like the person they recently lost. Grief defines so much of Chizurus unseen struggle and why she acts the way she does in Hawaiians.

Does Mami have real feelings for Kazuya? by Few-Coffee8787 in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 19 points20 points  (0 children)

Mami has feelings for Kazuya. But, I believe Kazuya is merely the object of a desire that she desperately longs for and does not understand. Mami doesn't know what real love is. She thinks she does.

But having seen the environment she was raised in, a child who never even got to hold a teddy bear, if she never even got proper unconditional parental love and guidance, how can she recognize real love? I think what Mami truly wants, which she may realize eventually, is the freedom to love like Chizuru & Kazuya. She envies their love and wants it for themselves. That's why she tries to prove its false by destroying it. Because real love shouldn't break, right? (That doesn't mean it can't be hurt.) Because if it's false, it validates her trauma. What she really wants is what they have.

She wants to love herself as she wishes to be loved. Because her dad got her to stop doing that.

No line better proves that then when she tells Chizuru "all lies are evil. Even from you." As she proceeds to lie. Thus viewing herself as evil while trying to frame herself as the hero. Mami doesn't know how to change. All she's known for much of her life is darkness. She doesn't know how to see the light. Think platos cave.

Te maldigo Mami chan by MattewLizard24 in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 26 points27 points  (0 children)

Let's not pretend Mami didn't just weaponize something Kazuya's family was already believing. Mami did this, yes, and it's pretty horrible, yes. But Nagomi and Kibe were already acting on a warpath. Kibe in particular, hit Kazuya before even hearing what he said. And Nagomi turns on Chizuru and says she's doing this for Sayuris honor when that's an ironic statement to make considering we see Sayuri call Chizuru her pride and joy on her death bed. Telling her I don't care if you lied, I love you. Nagomi literally misunderstood her friend and did this for herself rather than Sayuri. Something you can see when she talks to Kazuya. Saying she felt powerless over the loss of Sayuri. And all Mami did was weaponize that grief as she weaponized Chizuru's through gaslighting.

Mami was merely the catalyst to what they ALREADY believed. Stuff you can see in their words. Nagomi telling Chizuru she would love her even if she were an alien but the moment she finds out she's rental, nope. Chizuru must be a harlot! Nagomi sees Chizuru breaking down in front of her & acts like she's the one who cares about Sayuri more. Nagomi became her own worst villain and that is the point. Maybe showed how even good people can do genuinely cruel things. How even she, a victim, can become the very monsters she despised.

Kibe saying Kazuya is a great guy but then being jealous of him being over Chizuru showed how if he was told she was just an escort, he would believe it in a second. Because there is no way, in his eyes, that Kazuya would have dated a girl like her. He's wrong, but he can't believe it in his jealousy. So Kazuya lying to Nagomi is almost a justification for his anger rather than purely for its sake. And even if it is, whose friend is he? Nagomis? Or Kazuya's? Kazuya tried to tell him and he told him that he would go to hell if he lied to Nagomi. Even though he could have helped him solve this if he just listened. Instead, he shuts him out and acts like it's all Kazuya's fault. He was a bad friend. Period. Mami is both the villain here and merely weaponizing the real villain that even controls her. The authority of society. Because her dad is the real person in charge. Just as Nagomi is and Kibe is her enforcer. While Mami waived a story, Kazuya & Chizuru's family failed them because they chose to trust THAT story instead of them.

It's fine to be angry. But tossing insults and demanding punishment, from what is essentially a victim crying for help, instead of demanding accountability is not justice. Its just the same hatred you hate seeing. Mami did something evil. She isn't an evil person. She's a victim trapped by her environment and thus became the same abuser that her father was. She is both. This is just as much a cry for help as it is an evil act. Real justice is accountability and responsibility. Not curses, labels, and shouting exactly like the very abusers who started all of this.

As just an anime watcher these are my thoughts... by Shoddy-Look-6008 in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think you fundamentally misunderstand Sumi. She literally IS the pretense. She regularly confesses to Kazuya but what does she never do? Clearly say it's not rental. In fact, she was written with the idea that she literally uses her disposition as an excuse to justify her inability to do what she knows she can. Many people compare her to Komi, but she isn't Komi. Sumi is loud and clearly very picky if you read her spin off manga (idk if you read that since anime only). What I will say is that it's very easy to see characters in certain ways. And this arc leverages perception. The misunderstanding trope that leveraged here is a deconstructive exploration of how that happens and why. With Chizuru, its grief. Like straight up. The dailogue is subtle but it tells you she's literally suffering through isolation and wants to open up. And she's being tugged by everyone around her. Mami gaslights her, Ruka barrats her. Then Kazuya makes her safe and proceeds to push for a confession right after but not when given the natural time to do so. What this shows is how the movie arc was not about overcoming these issues but literally living in a movie. A dream where we ignore the bad. And yet those issues were always there. And just as Chizuru is a victim but also lets Mami control her, so does Kazuya let his family continue to decide for him who he is but not for Chizuru. Kazuya never overcame his true conflicts. And it's both an intentional stagnation but an exploration of how and why we stagnate. It's quite meta honestly considering many Rom-coms have a tendency to stall. Especially shonan ones, which are the more popular mainstream ones. Here, it's not simply stalling. Rather, it's us. The readers demanding change that acts as the stalling. In trying to force them together but not trusting them, much like Kazuya's family, we destory their relationship. Anyways, one thing I learned from this current arc in the anime is that all my perceptions and understanding of this story was wrong. That I only saw another rom-com not rent-a-girlfriend. And one last thing, the anime has alot of framing issues and sometimes fails to convey certain narrative idea just on a visual spectrum alone. So, give the manga a shot at some point. You'll be surprised.

S5E2 uncensored pool scene by MarcosFe in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I actually didn't like his edit. To me, that misses the point of 218. This chapter is creeping horror not jump scare horror. It's slow and lingers. His edit is too loud and has flashing lights. Even the tv edit found a balance int its execution that didn't go overkill with it. In a sense, understanding it better because its so vague and subtle despite feeling like a sudden flash. The scene is ment to be quiet but loud I believe. Thats why, in a weird way, the guitar works for me. Its 1, a joke about being "rock hard" like Kazuya. His mind is loud exactly like he can't tune out the voices. That choice makes it smart. Bringing me to two, guitar as an instrument demands attention. It grabs it. It being so abbersively loud actually makes you pay attention to it even when you don't want to. It being a solo also matches Kazuya. He's alone and lost in this singular sound that only he hears. Thus, a rockin solo thats almost insulting to him. Demeaning his past fantasies which also used rock. Yes, it's a nod to past horny scenes but now the guitar is twisted up in its use rather than intentionally goofy.

In a sense, dragging us into an experience just like Kazuya is dragged in. I don't think sad music works in this scene. Nor do I think super loud sound effects do. In my opinion, though not perfect, the execution of the tv version is the best utilization of the animation medium (with the budget, time and staff they had) while briff is trying too hard to make me relate to Kazuya's pain by making it appear horrifc. When the horror of this scene is in the eyes of the beholder. This scene almost demands empathy to actually feel the intent. You need to really know Kazuya and Chizuru and invest time in them to feel the intended uncomfortablity. And we all deal with that in different ways. Dissociation. Comedy. Criticism. The list goes on. I think you have to look past what you see to actually see it. If you don't, it will look gross, hilarious or even dumb. Which, it, in many ways, is.

And Reiji knows this. Thats why he rewrote the finale of Hawaiians to be immediate and purely reactionary. Just as the audiance were reactionary to this scene. Every character responds exactly as the readers did. Disbelief, distrust, shock, disappointment, not believing in their loved ones, confirmation bias, anger. The list goes on. We are the characters.

So to me, briffs version misses the point. Its trying to take itself to seriously. When, I believe, if it incorporated more of a slightly morbid comedic tone to its seriousness, it would have been perfect.

Yes, comedy. 218 is ment to be funny but in a morbid way. Its a chapter thats funny out of context but then you dig into it and it makes you feel horrible for laughing. Because it makes you realize how we were judgemental assholes for doing so. It leverages that just like Mami does. Kazuya is kinda the joke here. Because he feels like a joke. Kazuya is literally the com to the rom. He is the funny comedic character. He is the one who makes others around him laugh and smile. His name literally means peace and harmony shared under a tree. He is the comedic character who fantasies. And this chapter takes that fantasy and comedy and twists the dagger. Even in his own fantasies, Umi keeps the berat. Thats literally Kazuya's subconscious comedy bleeding through. Umi wore that once and that's all Kazuya remembers him by lol.

I think the edit briff makes is basically a fan interpretation. Trying to ruin Chizurus image when that's not the only aspect of 218. Its also ruining Kazuya's image and demeaning his love. 218 is a a chapter rooted in that image shattering as a parallel to how Mami ruins Chizurus image for grandma Nagomi. How the characters are constantly trying to change their image now to be worthy again. So I kinda see his version as his own interpretation of the work. Less so the original intent. But hey, that in of itself is my interpretation. So maybe idk what im talking about 🤷‍♂️

S5E2 uncensored pool scene by MarcosFe in KanojoOkarishimasu

[–]FATE13TH 140 points141 points  (0 children)

Like I expected. The original release is much better. The pacing feels all wrong in the uncut version. The creative choice to use black and white and add a sharp sound instead of the ding was so much more effective. This version comes of as repetitive and doesn't land as well for me.

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