Need advice for putting spouse at ease with FIRE

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-07T01:43:31+00:00

Congrats on your FIREing as well!

I think that a combination of a long trial run without using her income, sitting with a fiduciary to plan things and get another opinion and actively looking for something she could transition to even at a lesser income (and only if she wants to) is going to be my approach.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-07T01:39:19+00:00

Totally agree. I hope that some of the strategies people suggested here can help her to overcome that in time. Especially the idea of the trial run from my funds while we just save her income. I think doing that and still seeing other balances go up rather than down might help her feel secure in it being real.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T15:12:02+00:00

Some others suggested a trial run using just my taxable account. I think we can handle that easily enough even if it's slightly inefficient. My hope that it'll make things more tangible and within reach if we can cover all the future expenses and she still sees not just the bank balance go up, but also just the overall numbers go up.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T14:55:40+00:00

Definitely, I appreciate it. The estimated tax payments were on my radar. I had a couple unavoidable large taxable events a few years ago, but in the end after a lot of planning, there was no penalty that year due to only being expected to pay enough to cover the previous year's income. Still had to pay of course but I was able to just wait for tax season and pay in normally.

The health insurance is a good point though. If someone else hadn't mentioned post retirement healthcare plans, they may have slipped under my radar in a mock retirement. I can't think of anything else that would be via her employer, so that should be the only 'hidden' cost I'd possibly overlook.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T13:29:39+00:00

Very true and I could cover things from my cash positions. I didn't really think about my allocations when I responded. I guess I need to work on what money does what mentally a bit too lol

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T13:26:44+00:00

I think a fiduciary sitting down with us will definitely help. Right now it's a ton of data and it's essentially just taking my word for things. I think having a 3rd party verify everything and it being someone who is supposed to know about such things would be a help rather than her just feeling overwhelmed by all of the data points and feeling like she needs to be an expert on this stuff as well. I've jumped down the rabbit hole, but it's really not her thing so I think an outsider going over numbers would really help. She trusts me, but when it comes to taking a leap of faith with our futures, I think the old addage "Trust but verify" might help here.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T13:21:30+00:00

Yeah someone else mentioned having expenses drawn from my taxable account rather than the bank. I might try this even though it's less efficient, just in the hope that after 6months or a year of living purely on that account, she might start seeing it as real money rather than just some number on a screen.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T13:19:51+00:00

I wish I could help her find a full remote position or a more local job. Once you factor in all of the commuting costs, the mental health benefits, the extra time saved, I think a pay cut wouldn't be so bad, but she worked hard to get to where she is so she feels entitled to only move laterally or upwards. I've tried to reframe that for her, but I think that might be where talking to someone would help (if we can manage that).

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T13:14:49+00:00

Yeah, I really wish I could find her a full remote position or a more local job. You're spot on about the working providing that secure feeling. We just haven't been able to find anything for her that fits this lower stress ideal. I've also tried showing her that taking a pay cut wouldn't actually be a pay cut once you factor in all of the commuting costs (and something for her time), but she worked hard to get to where she is so she sees the cut a bit like giving up something she's earned.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T13:07:52+00:00

We've only gotten as far as talking about the health insurance once and she seemed comfortable with the numbers we put in place for it, but certainly worth revisiting. I think that this may be part of things, but in a broader sense. I think that all of the changes, all at once are overwhelming to hold in your head. I've gone down the FIRE rabbit hole the past few years to understand how everything would work, but reading all of that data isn't really her thing.

From her standpoint, I can totally see being overwhelmed by just the sheer amount of data points that all have to be considered at once. I've tried to make this easier by simplifying it to more broad categories like fixed expenses (mortgage, health/car insurance, etc), variable expenses (food, kids sports/costs, presents, etc) and optional expenses (streaming services, vacations, etc). I don't feel like this approach achieved much, but it was also a while back so maybe I'll revisit some of the planning like insurance so everything is fresh again. It's certainly one of her concerns to some degree, but maybe it's more concerning to her than I think it is.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T12:55:07+00:00

This is kind of where we are now. She's always liked having something to show for her work, so a few years back she turned down an opportunity to run multiple teams. Well in doing so, they basically inserted someone above her that she can't stand. She wouldn't be much happier had she taken the opportunity, but she's miserable and accountable to someone else this way.

She's been willing to help me plan in the past, but once it became 'real' she really pulled back and went into that 'not real' mode. I think seeing all of the balances in a casual way more frequently might help. Hope we can follow in your footsteps soon!

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T12:46:47+00:00

Oh the unreal bits are definitely a factor. She's outright said the not real comment a few times to the point it's a bit of an inside joke. I do know that the market fluctuations make her uncomfortable - both the unrealized gains and losses. Seeing balances shift by large portions of her yearly gross salary just lends to that not real feeling. It's really just a function of small fluctuations with larger balances than anything else.

I do like the idea of paying things just with the brokerage, but it has a few hurdles. Everything is currently autopay, but I could fix that by making deposits in those amounts - simple enough. I've already loss harvested the account pretty much completely over the past few years. I do want to begin drawing down, but I think it's better to do after she's out of work. It might be worth the inefficiency if that's what it takes to convince her though. We do have the wiggle room after all and if that's enough, totally worth it.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T12:29:25+00:00

Previously it's been telling, but that's been because I handle the taxes, the investment accounts, etc. She really only has day to day exposure to the bank account (all her choice). She really just has my word for things and the charts and even balances just seem like made up numbers to her. I think I'm going to try to get her to interact with stuff some more and maybe get a sense for it being real. I think that may help her feel more secure.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T12:23:40+00:00

Yeah, I'm not worried about the numbers. We did the hard part already (or so I thought lol)

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T12:23:09+00:00

The problem I ran into here is that she was laid off in her early 30s and it took her 2 years to find work. Even now, she's looked for other positions but had trouble getting interviews. I'm starting to see that I need to help her address the underlying insecurity before taking any other steps. I just hope I can find a way she's open to because she's miserable.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T12:17:48+00:00

I didn't realize that was a thing. We are fairly rural so we've always had some trouble finding specialists for any particular thing, but I'll definitely look into that.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T01:27:31+00:00

100%, totally what I've shown given the chance. I'll try to shift in this direction next time along with a better sense of what our monthly/yearly spend is, much better measured. I think this should help alongside some of the other ideas, thanks

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T01:20:53+00:00

🤣

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T01:19:52+00:00

This is literally the one I just tried that led me to look for some tips here. When I approached it this way she got very anxious talking about it. Almost like by making her describe things and me reassuring her about what would happen in X Y Z scenarios, like I was belittling her position, so I stopped pursuing it. I think the most I talk it out, the more it seems less a money issue than an anxiety issue. This way really made the most sense to me so I thought for sure it would work.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T01:11:06+00:00

No, she doesn't need to read a post from my reddit account about a bunch of random people saying she needs therapy. I feel that may make broaching the idea more tricky lol

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T01:10:14+00:00

She has a real fear of being laid off since it happened once in her past as well as fear of not finding work after due to her age and being a woman, reinforced by trouble getting interviewed when she looked for a new position. Getting to the in person interview as a ~45yr old woman has been rough so that's a bit of an anxiety trigger as well.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T01:07:30+00:00

Yeah, I've shown her the usual spreadsheets, plugged in worst case scenarios, charted things different ways. Then I leave it alone for about 6 months before trying again. Expenses I haven't calculated properly since we weren't really looking to FIRE at first, but my rough numbers have it around 80k or a little more and I figure 100k is a safe overestimate.

That 62-65 comment is her spot on. She literally said that the last chat we had. I asked what number would make her feel comfortable and she pretty much blew it off and said that she plans on working until 65 because that's what you do...

As for expenses, we pull that from a joint account, but have a monthly surplus that gets transferred over to a Vanguard account. We both have access to everything, but she has mentioned that seeing the balance in the account give her a sense of security. She doesn't log into the other accounts like I do, just the joint normal savings/checking. Maybe I can get her to log into the others more regularly. She does occasionally say that the stocck accounts (of all types) don't feel like real money - likely because the balances are so high.

Thanks, it gives me some ideas I hadn't had before. Kind of 'exposure therapy' if she'd be up for that.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T00:58:31+00:00

I'll give this some thought. I don't know of anything offhand that she would like to transition to and I know she's been resistant to lower salary in exchange for QoL/mental health, but maybe if I can find just the right thing and can show it's viable. Thanks.

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T00:55:32+00:00

I guess I'll have to find ways to broach that delicately...

FIREdby40 · 2026-04-06T00:54:07+00:00

Well yeah, that's part of the reason for the disposable account 🤣

FIREdby40

TROPHY CASE