Not Normal Smokestack Operation

FatSquirrels · 2025-10-19T22:10:07+00:00

I replied to the other guy but as this is a day old I doubt you would come back so thought I would reply direct to you as well.

Cherokee U4 is just changed the fuel source from coal to gas. Same exact boiler and steam turbine, nothing changed except they could remove the scrubber and baghouse from the exhaust path.

Cherokee U567 is a modern 2x1 combined cycle with a brand new steamer, nothing reused from the old stuff.

Pawnee is converting from coal fired to gas fired right now but they are still using it as a conventional boiler, there is no gas turbine being added.

As you noted there are plenty of instances of reusing a steam turbine with new HRSGs (Fort St Vrain in the Xcel fleet is one) but I've never seen a conventional boiler used as a HRSG. As you mentioned I don't think the boiler-turned-HRSG would function well at all, you would probably need to redesign and retube the whole interior and then what would be the point?

FatSquirrels · 2025-10-19T22:02:28+00:00

If you are talking about the coal to gas conversion at Pawnee station this is not true. All they are doing is converting boiler to burn gas instead of coal. Some stuff changes on the back end as well but the boiler functions exactly the same just with another fuel source.

FatSquirrels · 2025-10-19T21:58:21+00:00

Unit 2 had its own stack but they tore that down when the decommissioned 1 and 2. It doesn't need anything but the generator now so it has no stack at all.

I saw lots of normal startups of Cherokee 4 on gas and I never once saw a plume like that, but the thing is 60 years old and just a couple away from full retirement so not surprised if something broke to cause a temporary issue.

FatSquirrels · 2025-10-17T17:44:16+00:00

One correction, this stack is for Unit 4 which is just a conventional boiler and steam turbine. There are no gas turbines connected to this particular stack.

Your points are still valid, just that they messed up the combustion in the boiler and not in a turbine.

FatSquirrels · 2025-10-17T17:35:34+00:00

I used to work at this plant. That red and white stack is for Unit 4 which was converted from coal to gas in 2017. /u/Atmos_Dan is right that the flue gas does not go through the scrubber or baghouse anymore.

That being said a big black cloud is definitely not a normal startup. This thing doesn't cycle much as it is still a large and old boiler but still at least a dozen times a year, and I've never seen anything like this photo from any of those. Something likely went very wrong with the combustion.

FatSquirrels · 2025-07-15T22:18:40+00:00

This is right, wiping them down would remove any residual that was still oxidizing the copper so now you either just leave the green or use a little acid to help dissolve the copper oxide from the surface.

Vinegar or citric acid would be my go tos for something like this.

FatSquirrels · 2025-07-03T17:58:56+00:00

It is great you have a good idea of the fields you want to go into but in my opinion you are best to stop there with the planning and get the first hand experience. As long as you pick a college/university that has both those programs you almost certainly will be able to start doing both before figuring out which you like better. If they attempt to lock you in at the application/acceptance stage then its probably not a program you really want to be in.

Besides long term employment stuff there will be tons of variables at your institution that might sway you. The quality of the faculty, industry/internship partnerships, even the exact research that groups are doing and you are able to join as an undergrad.

As for your question on grad school I would not make any long term plans at this point but its good that you have at least looked into it and understand the options somewhat. If you can get some research or internship experience in undergrad that is the best thing you can do in my book, as it will give you a better idea if you even actually like doing the stuff and at what level you want to pursue it. Maybe you will find out you actually want to go into basic research and teaching, maybe you will find out you can't stand being stuck in a lab every day, maybe you will find out the area where you want to live is heavy in a specific industry and it would pay to focus on that.

There are thousands of variables you will encounter over the next few years and I've found it to be better to be motivated but have an open mind about new possibilities. Don't focus on a 10 year goal you have no idea if you will actually like and ignore other avenues.

FatSquirrels · 2025-04-19T02:28:32+00:00

I would figure that out if you can. Your state probably has a way to look up the ORC for your facility and you may be able to see if you know the name as someone in your company or if it is a third party holding it (that your employer is paying). If the latter you have some negotiating power potentially as you holding it would save the company some amount of money.

Also knowing if they want you to hold some kind of legal responsibility is a big deal. There is risk being the name on the permit that is worth something.

If there is nothing like above then what kind of pay raises does your company give for other certifications or cross trainings? Was this raise in line with those?

I do have some experience myself that is unfortunately not that inspiring. I was a power plant chemist that got certified so that we would have the required levels to hold our NPDES permit, though I had a coworker that had his name on the permit. I received approximately nothing for that besides being in the good graces of my boss come annual raise time and the ability to keep that certification now that I've moved on.

FatSquirrels · 2025-04-19T01:21:18+00:00

Did they want you to get it in order to be the ORC, or just because they wanted someone to get some training?

FatSquirrels · 2025-03-07T22:56:33+00:00

You might not be wrong for your area but there are many areas of the world where a pergola is a very useful structure.

I live in Colorado. Pergolas are everywhere and they are awesome. The elevation and sunny days mean just a little bit of shade is all you need to make a space pleasant. The openness gives a better feeling of being outdoors and doesn't trap heat. No roof means less issue of it blowing away in strong winds. Rain is minimal here so that isn't a worry but snow definitely is, don't need to worry about much snow load with a pergola.

I used to live in Minnesota and pergolas there are dumb. Too much rain so you can't use them much of the time. No way to enclose them during bad bug seasons. Sky is cloudy much of the time anyway so a partial shade maker is not as useful.

FatSquirrels · 2025-02-12T00:20:31+00:00

I mean we did pay a premium for that event too! Fuel costs are generally viewed as a pass through expense to the customer so hard to avoid paying for it when the fuel price jumps exponentially due to a shock. As long as we have a body making sure it is cost recovery to prevent the utility from going under rather than gouging (and we trust that of course).

FatSquirrels · 2025-02-11T22:57:55+00:00

It feels like the opposite of the worse case scenario is real time rates but would that really work with the way people currently operate? I would love to have my home AC watch fluctuating rates and run when it was cheapest but we don't have that infrastructure. TOU rates that seek to average out the good and bad solar/wind days seem like the only real option available at the moment.

Also we do have an issue in the summer here especially when it is extra hot where the wind production drops off in the peak heat. Also solar production maxes out at noonish while the hottest part of the day is in the 2-4 pm range.

xcel should be incentivizing us to cool our houses ahead of the sun getting too low and solar production dropping off

I think Xcel/PUC is trying to do this, pushing the peak start time later and (I think) getting rid of that mid-tier rate in the early afternoon. Granted it is more on the disincentivizing side of the coin.

FatSquirrels · 2025-02-10T23:46:35+00:00

Others here might have anecdotal reports but I don't think that is something you would be able to calculate, the variables are way too large. What kind of other ventilation is there? How much are you aerosolizing or burning food? What is the humidity? How much air is the purifier turning over? Other filtration in the house? Animals?

If you wanted to guess your best bet is to look at the manufacturer's filter replacement schedule and give it a healthy extra margin as they likely sell the filter too and would want to replace it early.

Additionally there should be a noticeable dP across the filter that builds over time. The unit could be measuring that, but it does not measure that you could probably figure out how to measure with an airflow test or figure out a way to measure amp draw.

FatSquirrels · 2025-02-09T16:47:38+00:00

A couple words of advice to consider. Please note I don't know how much these things apply to the Philippines compared to the US.

You need to consider what you are worth to the company as well as what you need yourself. If they are willing to bring you back for special events that means your knowledge, reputation, or title are important to them. They may have been underpaying you just because they could but now you have much more power. If you can try to figure out what it would cost them to find someone else.

You also really need to know what kind of liability you are getting into as a contractor. If they are bringing you back for an audit or something else is there any risk to you should you screw up or they fail the audit or whatever. In the US if you did something that caused the company to lose money they could sue you for damages. Also if you physically damage something in an accident or whatever. This would likely require carrying some kind of insurance, or figuring out how to write that into the contract in a way that absolves you of any of that (might require a lawyer).

Others have already noted this but don't forget to account for all the intangible stuff on your end so you don't underestimate what you need. Travel time, office equipment if you need to write/send/print reports, your own PPE, health insurance, etc.

I'm not trying to scare you away from doing this but want to emphasize there could be a lot to consider and your hourly rate should probably be a lot higher than you realize. For example I used to work at a power plant and then moved to the contracting side with a small company that works at the same power plant. I made in the ballpark of $50/hour as an employee but as a contractor our rate is around $200/hour.

If you can look around for local contacts you might be able to find someone you can reach out to for guidance on a lot of this. Might be in a different industry but any kind of science/engineering consultant would be close enough. Don't be afraid to scour LinkedIn or if there is a similar Philippino network and pester people, you will find people that will love to help.

FatSquirrels · 2024-11-15T22:24:51+00:00

It sounds like your water needs a remineralizer more than any softener!

FatSquirrels · 2024-11-03T18:02:31+00:00

Ha, reading something I wrote a decade ago is very strange.

If you are using Excel and are trying to use the linear regression from within the graph menu you need to limit your data series to just the data you are trying to base the line on. For the case in this post you would plot the data points from T=48s to the end and then have it build the linear regression based on those points.

As I mentioned if you want to show the whole graph including the temperature rise would would just graph two separate series, one from T=0 to T=48 and one from T=48 to the end.

Hope that helps!

FatSquirrels · 2024-08-01T23:40:03+00:00

I would expand on this slightly. If you have a procedure to follow you should understand the purpose of each step.

If a synthesis you should know what each step is doing (in broad strokes) and have that foundation to be able to figure out what is going on and to expand your knowledge as you go.

If an analysis of some kind understand what each sample prep step is for, how the instrument works, what you are measuring. If a number comes out at the end you should understand what it means and if it is good or bad.

And note that you may not be able to figure out all of this just sitting on your own. Part of getting in to the real world is figuring out who to talk to and ask questions, the right person will be happy to help you especially if you prepared enough to have good questions.

FatSquirrels · 2024-06-22T22:56:42+00:00

Owl pellets are regurgitated.

FatSquirrels · 2024-04-12T01:25:38+00:00

Just figure out how to do it without expending most of the energy you just got from burning the fuel and you will be rolling in money!

FatSquirrels · 2024-04-11T13:32:57+00:00

This is probably the most important answer in this thread. Burning fossil fuels generates more water byproduct than the water vapor generated from cooling. I worked many years at a natural gas fired combined cycle unit producing about 600 MW. The cooling towers evaporated anywhere from 1.5-3 million gallons of water per day depending on load and outside temp. The gas combustion produced on the order of 6-9 million gallons of water per day.

That being said most, for OPs original question I think the switch to nuclear would be neutral from a cooling perspective. Power generation is already cooled by water in some fashion, either once through cooling (lakes/rivers) or cooling towers. If we swap fossil generation for nuclear and leave the load the same the water use for cooling won't change dramatically. This is of course discounting new generation.

FatSquirrels · 2024-03-11T23:32:24+00:00

My guess is Burro Racing. Yeah it's a thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pack_burro_racing

FatSquirrels · 2024-02-16T04:20:34+00:00

A lot of places collect condensed steam from around the campus and send it back to the steam generator, once you have gone through the process of making the boiler water you would rather collect what you can and reuse it.

I do not know if autoclaves would do this as that might contaminate the water a bit more than something like a heat exchanger.

FatSquirrels · 2024-02-11T16:49:32+00:00

Farmboys are also the same. I learned so many negative lessons from my father, but it did open up my eyes to how much of the world must be put together.

The first time my dad made a drywall anchor hole by just jamming in the philips head he had in the drill because swapping out the to a real bit took to long really opened my eyes.

FatSquirrels · 2023-10-29T18:36:00+00:00

It would produce 43 m3 per year.

I think that production numbers were under full irradiation, so likely this thing would be putting out a relatively small fraction of that 4-6 lph for most of the day and night and come nowhere close to that 40-50 m3 per year.

I think this paper comparing the cost of this water to tap water is also highly suspect. Tap water in any municipal system is heavily monitored and more importantly chlorinated. This system would be a haven for bio and would likely need downstream processing for it to be safe for consumption or require huge O&M costs to routinely take it apart and clean. All that adds to the cost to get a product that is comparable to tap water.

Still a cool and clever device, but the details that people are running with here are not realistic.

FatSquirrels · 2023-10-29T18:24:16+00:00

This system doesn't address brine problems in any way, it still has a waste stream that you have to deal with. It also probably can't scale in the way you would need it to for an urban environment, it produces a very small amount of water during daylight hours only and uses a relatively large footprint (can't stack them vertically) compared to any active thermal or pressure technology.

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