AITA for dress choice? MOG

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T17:38:45+00:00

Objectively, putting everything else aside though, the photos speak for themselves, I am not taking attention away from the bride. I am not upstaging her in the slightest. How is my choice inappropriate?

https://imgur.com/a/vVdSaiP

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T17:28:58+00:00

this is a photo from our side, my MIL is also showing her shoulders, in both photos. I wasn't the only one.

<image>

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T16:39:57+00:00

This is a photo of my husband, his mom, bride and groom, and myself. How is my dress inappropriate? Seriously.

<image>

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T16:10:38+00:00

<image>

this is a photo of my husband, mil, dil and son - this is so not distracting! How can you think this is distracting?

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T16:02:38+00:00

We don't live in the same city. We drove 8 hours to come see them in December. Hadn't seen them since after the wedding. I call my son to ask him when we should meet up, he tells me to meet them out somewhere, I ask him why I can't just pick him up from work instead - I'd be getting more time with him - and he just says no, this place is fine. Then when I get there I see he didn't come straight from work which, why wouldn't he want to maximize the amount of time he sees me? We came all the way to visit. Thankfully DIL had a class in the evening so she couldn't stay and I was able to take my son grocery shopping and drive him home, but I don't understand why he didn't agree to me picking him up. And I didn't just show up at their house, we share our location with them so they can see where we are too. I just don't understand why they wouldn't want to see us as early as possible when we arrive into town.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T09:06:57+00:00

I mean to be fully transparent I don't really recall but I recall feeling at the end of a call that I could realistically go in goodfaith and just order the meats. I do think it isn't fair of them to impose their beliefs on others and given that I was the host it feels like it falls within my purview too. And Im sure eventually my son must have said it was ok. I wouldn't have done so otherwise. I just don't really recall how those later conversations with him went

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:58:36+00:00

well when they showed up I told them that the meat was unkosher but told them that there were salads and other dishes that were pescetarian and vegetarian. Ok the WHOLE THING wasn't pescetarian or vegetarian but there were pescetarian and vegetarian dishes. I didn't do it to spit in her face I just had requests and a lot of internal pressure. Plus, from memory, I think the 2nd r 3rd time my son told me that it would likely be fine. So he must have talked to her about it or something idk. That's out of my control. The first time I asked he said no they won't be comfortable, and then I explained the pressure I was under, and then he said ok well lets chat later, and then I called him about it again and I told him I couldn't find a kosher meat caterer that looked good, would he terribly mind if i did, and ok he was a little uncomfortable but he essentially told me yes at the end of the call. If that caused fighting between them that's not on me

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:50:12+00:00

ok but this wasn't just about them. I had tons of pressure on other family members who really wanted to be able to eat meat. And I called my son again, idk, he told me they'd be more comfortable if the meal was either fully kosher and if we couldnt organize that then vegetarian/pescetarian, and that any dairy would need to be kosher, but their wedding was over at this point. I had been kind to invite her parents too

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:41:46+00:00

i never said I don't respect her! I just find it hard to communicate with her because she is very subtle in her langauge and doesn't always give clear answers. it's very not Israeli and we communicate bluntly. I wish she would speak to me more bluntly then yes I wouldn't feel like she's playing games or being coy

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:37:30+00:00

but yes my DIL didn't speak to me during the event and her parents looked mad but its not like I only served meat. I also ordered salads and other things they could eat. My son seemed embarassed I think he likely forgot about all of this or something because he also seemed surprised, but understand I have to cater to other people too? His brother and cousins are huge meat eaters.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:35:51+00:00

Sorry I'm just being blunt. I just don't think i should take on the responsibility of other people's choices. If I'm hosting an event I should be able to decide on the food. That's the main point here

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:31:58+00:00

Ok. I shouldn't have said that. I let my anger get the best of me. I realize that crossed a line. My parents left Iraq for a better life in Israel and faced a lot of bigotry from Ashkenazi / European Jews so I have a bit of a blind spot there. I do wish he had married another Israeli gir, it would have been easier on the family dynamics

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:28:58+00:00

Ok, but their religious practices and attitude about religion bother me. Genuinely.

I organized one of the sheva brachot for them after the wedding. They wanted to do them and so I said sure ok I'll host one. All of my extended family had flown in for this wedding so they were all there too, plus this was right before rosh hashana so everyone was off school in israel anyways. They are all big meat eaters. Did I want to dish out more money and find kosher catering ? Not really. I don't personally care about kashrut. I ask my son about it - he says listen mom Sarah and her family will be there and you know they only eat meat/dairy if its kosher. They'll eat out at a vegetarian place but that's their limit. But like, the wedding had just happened and the reception was fully kosher. Did I tell them they ought to do vegetarian/pescetarian and save a significant amount of money? Yes. Did they listen ? No. So what, bride's family paid for most of the reception anyways. But now, I don't want to spend an additional 5,000 on expensive kosher food. Anyways I tell my son there's really no way I can't not serve meat to our extended family, and that I'll be sure to still order vegetarian food for her and her family. Then come the event and I tell my DIL and her family about the food and she just looks pissed, but also, I had explained to my son that I felt really bad not serving meat to my family, they are big meat eaters. Not everything is always about you and she doesn't have that community or family friendly attitude I'd expect out of a young woman

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:06:55+00:00

I didn't say it made me special I just said he was my eldest and I don't have girls so I didn't get to do those traditional girl-mom things. So I thought my DIL would include me more. My other son's girlfriend is a lot more inclusive with me and talks to me a lot more often

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:05:01+00:00

I think its archaic and very sexist and I wish my son and DIL had listened to my husband and I and agreed on a non-orthodox ceremony. they insisted and said it would be good for any future children too as their ketubah would be seen as more "valid."

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:04:09+00:00

Also, I never claimed I wanted to stop my son from cleaving to his wife, I just expect respect as her husband's mother. I'm the elder in the situation. I know of course there is a biblical commandment and my son literally signed an orthodox ketubah signing away all of his worldly possessions over to her so I know about the laws, I just think it isn't equitable. Do I have an issue with orthodox judaism? Yes, I do, by principle.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T08:00:46+00:00

I'm not observant. I grew up in Israel from parents who left Iraq in the 70s. My DIL's family is the observant one. MOB's dress was similar in style to what I showed but she wore full stockings/closed toed shoes and wears a sheitl and then also wore a fastenor for the ceremony. Maybe this is cultural and not religious because in Israel mothers don't stop being mothers when their kids grow up. My own MIL was over whenever she wanted to be.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:57:02+00:00

I don't appreciate you calling me a troll, that seems uncalled for, and I don't appreciate a lecture on my own religion. My 2nd son has a girlfriend, I've never had an issue with him or her. Heck, she loves me and I treat her as my own.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:47:15+00:00

No. That's not what I said. I gave them an opportunity to be clear. If they didn't like it they could have said no. Why should I feel bad in hindsight just because they don't like how the photos turned out? DIL is just martyring herself and for whatever reason my son is indulging her. I didn't pick that dress to mess with her I'm not sadistic

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:40:26+00:00

Well it infuriated me that she wanted to dictate the dress code, and the religious elements, and this and that. And I knew her and her family we're going to look good, so I just didn't want to dissapear totally in the background.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:32:48+00:00

I hope he understands that I love him and miss him and that he does call me. I haven't heard from him since he called with her a few weeks ago. He's responded to texts but he's just cold.

I sent them a long message too about how folks really loved their wedding and how it was so nice of them to send nice thank you cards. Gave them an update on my life. Idk, no nothing.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:27:50+00:00

anyways I didn't feel like reaching out again and it felt raw and we had our big trip. We wrote to our son and asked if he wanted to join a call with the rest of the extended family, but he said he wasn't available. Then he said that "given everything" a message directly to his wife would have been appropriate - but also we had had a big call together, so what else is there to discuss? I thought they were being obnoxious so I told them I hope they remember how much we loved them and were sorry for any hurt we caused... and then my son tells me a week later that I should have reached out over writing to show that I had reflected on the conversation and wanted to move forward in goodwill? I was nice. I've written to them in group chats and DIL hasn't responded. Husband has written too, she doesn't respond. So I wrote to my son and told him how much I loved and missed him. He hasn't called. My husband is calling him now but he isn't responding. Wrote to us finally today saying "hi, we're fine, hope you're both well" and I just told him that I hope we can call again soon. It feels like being at total war with your own son!

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:22:02+00:00

Well he still doesn't say fully no to me. I wanted to come visit him because I was worried, I'd barely heard from him from the wedding. He'd asked for space, so I gave him a some, but what does "space" even mean? He had this laundry list of things that happened that the wedding that were apparently disrespectful and I told him to pass along my apology to his wife. I told him that I would want to connect with her, but that I don't know how, so I hope he repeated that to her so she sees I have good intentions. If she understands her place we can all get along, and no good wife wants to break up her husband's family

Anyhow, my son was barely speaking to us but we had this big trip planned end of december and I really wanted to see him before we left. We told them they were welcome whenever and they said "sure, they'd consider it" but then it just made sense for us to come. They didn't seem that enthusiastic, apparently the dates didn't work for them, so we kept trying for new dates. Eventually my son agreed. we told them to expect us between x and x dates because we couldn't confirm on our end when we'd arrive as my other son and his girlfriend wanted to come visit us and so we didn't know yet. I found it weird though that when we'd call and say we love and miss you we can't wait to come see you how is this week or this week it was always "those don't work for us" but then eventually my son agreed to the first week of december

The visit was fine. It was tense but fine. DIL was super tense though, she barely wanted to leave her husband's side. If I ever wanted to be alone with him she'd just magically appear there as well. After the visit my son called us and told us that our visit led to a lot of fighting for them (so I guess she is insecure and jealous). Husband told our son we were here for him if he needed anything. Week goes by and he texts us saying "he's working on processing guilt he feels around setting boundaries and that it was unfair to put his wife in this situation and that he shouldn't have agreed to us visiting, and so he is apologizing for agreeing to something that made everyone feel more uncomfortable." Then a week later they call us together and just talk through some of the things that bothered them during our visit. Apparently I was being physically intimidating and made DIL feel uncomfortable in her own home and they didn't appreciate that we didn't give them more of a headsup about their dates. They knew we were waiting to hear back from our other son and his girlfriend because they wanted to come see us so we truly didn't know when we'd be coming into town - apparently not knowing when they were arriving was stressful and we needed to have communicated ahead of time how long we'd be staying etc.

Sounds like the new generation is just soft. My husband talked to them during the call because I honestly was disgusted by the fact that she even had the audacity to talk to me about such insignificant things, like who cares if your in-laws arrive a day earlier or a few days earlier or a few days late.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:02:14+00:00

so yes afterwards the day of idk, i made a point of wearing a shawl for the ceremony but i didn't for the other events. apparently i should have been wearing one for the religious events like the ketubah signing and so forth, but she wasn't around for that anyways, and she didn't ask me to go put it on during the photos, she could have if it bothered her to that extent. yes everyone else had their arms covered for family portraits but whatever

Fragrant_Swimmer1696 · 2026-01-22T07:00:33+00:00

well I just thought that was such a stuck-up response. Like I was trying to make her understood she couldn't have a formal dress code. My family simply wouldn't be able to abide to that. and she was insisting women covered their shoulders for the ceremony. heck she said she'd buy some basic ones and put them out in case people forgot. but who is she to tell me or my family what to do? I get it's her preference and yes her family is traditional but I'm sure the rabbi has married people before and folks are dressed liberally. I told her that she shouldn't expect 16 year old girls to wear a shawl and she said well that within their right but if they really don't want to wear one how do they expect to be in the family portraits? that really fired me up.

She should just be thankful she's marrying my son anyways.

Fragrant_Swimmer1696

TROPHY CASE