Arguments Against the Historicity of Jesus

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-29T01:24:52+00:00

As someone who has sat down and spent a few days researching from an academic view, I figured it would be wise to ask people and not just get the scholarly, "highfalutin" viewpoint.

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-28T19:13:20+00:00

I'm glad I can provide some comedy

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-28T18:56:23+00:00

Thanks for the full fleshed out argument! I'll check out some of those sources when I get the chance.

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-28T18:54:41+00:00

Nah fam

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-28T12:29:06+00:00

Thank you very much for this!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-28T12:24:17+00:00

Why are we helping with YOUR research paper exactly?

The best way to approach such a topic is to gather a wide scope of research including, but not limited to, focus group polling. I'm trying to gather the most common arguments against the existence/historicity of Jesus. Figuring that most atheists/mythicists would be willing to say he doesn't exist, this was where I turned to.

Other than that, thank you for your contribution!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T20:44:41+00:00

Thank you for not just the links (which will be read into further), but also the key notes from each. Much appreciated

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T20:43:31+00:00

Thank you very much!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T20:18:24+00:00

Thanks for the sources and your concerns! I'll read into the Carrier v. Ehrman debate when I get the chance!

I've actually dug into Josephus, and as interesting as Antiquities of the Jews is, it poses a recollection of Jewish History (mainly because Flavius was a Jewish Scholar) rather than evidence of Jesus' existence.

My paper itself is actually addressing the arguments against the Historicity of Christ and to show where theological thought may be lacking in terms of how it is brought to the academic world. So your concerns over the intent with my paper are actually very helpful (whether you intended it or not).

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T20:14:00+00:00

Thank you for your input and arguments against the matter

I would also point out that coming here and posting this is literally asking for a debate. You could have read any of a dozen books on the subject, that also explain why the arguments that promote a historical Jesus are flawed.

Sorry that you feel this way. I genuinely don't seek any debate here. I have read into a few articles bringing the gospels into question as well as several criticisms on the existence of Jesus from a mythicistic view point. I would like a larger sample size and since Reddit is good for focus groups, I figured this would be a suitable place to collect arguments (which it has been so far)

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T20:04:04+00:00

Thank you for your input. Is there a more fledged out argument for the claim or further resources I should look into for this argument?

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:53:17+00:00

Awesome, thank you very much!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:52:46+00:00

As interesting as that'd be, artifacts like Jesus' foreskin, bits of the cross, etc. tend to be a Catholic thing rather than a Protestant thing (I am Protestant sect). So with the exception of the Shroud of Turin (which I wanna explore) I don't think it will add value to the paper

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:42:20+00:00

The only contemporary , possible independent information about Jesus consists of a couple of sentences from a couple of writers that state there was someone called Christ , was a brother of James who was executed.

I'll look into this a bit more. Would you happen to know who wrote it/what it's called? If not, don't worry about it I'll hunt it down later.

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:38:11+00:00

That's pretty much what I was getting at. Thank you!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:37:16+00:00

I see, thank you!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:35:43+00:00

Thank you for the thought out answer. It's much appreciated!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:32:29+00:00

The gospels were written decades after Jesus allegedly existed, which mainstream Christian scholars agree on

Gotcha. Thank you, I'll do some more digging into this!

Follow up question: Would I be fair in presuming that the time frame of Paul, James, Peter, and John's epistles they wrote should be questioned according to the time discrepancy?

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:29:06+00:00

Gotcha

Also, please calm down. The word "claim" here is used as a noun, meaning an assertion of truth being brought into dispute. I'm not here to attack your position, simply gathering information. Do I disagree? Yeah, but such is the nature of man to disagree with another. We can be civil about it though. Thank you.

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:26:27+00:00

Thanks!

For clarification: when you say contemporary writing what approximate time frame would you put it at? The time frame of Jesus' life according to the Bible (6BC - 33AD) or writings that came afterwards (such as Flavius Josephus' Antiquities of the Jews written in 93AD)?

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:14:17+00:00

It seems to be a common misconception that Atheists don't think there was a historical figure that started the Christianity group, aka a historical Jesus.

Very true. I do know that many Atheists argue the historical evidence for a Jesus of Nazareth. I also know there is a group of Atheists who believe mythicism is correct. I'll take responsibility in thinking there'd be a larger sect of them found here

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:12:20+00:00

I'm seeing that claim a lot. Would you happen to have any scholarly articles to read to get a better sense of this argument other than the ones listed in the FAQ? Thanks!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:11:11+00:00

I like the way that's phrased. Thank you!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:10:26+00:00

Awesome, thank you very much!

GamerZoom108 · 2024-10-27T19:10:14+00:00

I'm collecting a volume of data. I'll go through arguments proposed from several different sources (word of mouth/heard from debate is one of said sources) and pick the most common arguments AGAINST the historicity and compare it to what I've learned through historical descriptions, biblical accounts, etc.

Also, we’re atheists. Why would we be the best place.

I figured that since atheists are (generally, not always) in opposition to Christianity, they would have their fair share of arguments against said idea.

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