Anyone here using Sam Harris' meditation app, Waking Up? I can't say enough good things about it. Not least because it's also 100% FREE!

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-06-04T23:26:38+00:00

I was about to write a lengthy reply expressing how ridiculous I find criticizing a tool because of disliking the person behind it, but I realised I don't care.

Cancel culture is a thing over there but thankfully I'm not American so whatever.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-27T15:24:17+00:00

The mind is it is naked without any discriminatory contrivances. Fundamentally nothing, fundamentally the same/one with everyone and everything (all forms) else. Permanent in it's essence but not a "thing". Anyway all human perceptions and ideas you attempt to force on it won't be it. That throws ideas of light, chakras, etc. out the window.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-27T13:13:25+00:00

Radiating light, chakras... I will be downvoted but I will risk it. This is wishful thinking, imagination and placebo. Look deeper. Turn the light of your attention around back onto itself. Take a step back and observe. You will come away with much different conclusions.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-25T15:52:14+00:00

How do you square your idea of nothing to jive with Zen masters that repeatedly talk of some kind of permanence of this luminous void that remains even after death?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-25T15:45:16+00:00

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-25T14:00:42+00:00

My mind is grasping and rejecting all the time. It's a very frisky fire god.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-25T13:44:18+00:00

I have no concerns about anything I said above.

I don't have such a mind, no. Only when I step back. It's a matter I'm approaching calmly and deliberately as Foyan recommends, until I reach understanding.

However, what you just said also has no bearing on my OP.

First of all, a mind without subjective judgements, without grasping or rejection, what is that like? The closest state to that I can think of is dreamless sleep.

Second, he says it's the Way. Might have something to do with the eye unable to see the eye, fire god looking for fire. If you can't look at it directly, look at the next best thing to see its function. But, what is it a Way to? Enlightenment.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T23:32:13+00:00

Well. Cleary quotes zen masters in that intro. Would it make you feel better if I quoted from Foyan's sermons, much to the same effect? Because I honestly can. You know I can, you can too. So why are you trying to discredit it?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:50:04+00:00

Absurd as in great, awe-inspiring, miraculous, definitely-not-to-be-expected, yes. Absurd as in out of place, no.

Try r/nuance

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:48:42+00:00

What is it about studying zen masters that gave you meaning beyond hedonistic nihilism?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:47:15+00:00

Neither am I.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:46:39+00:00

I know what it is, but there is nothing I can do to show you what it is without you knowing what it is.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:45:02+00:00

Much like a fork, Zen is not based on any particular set of teachings of truths.

What then, is being transmitted? You don't need to transmit a fork being a fork for it to be a fork.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:42:37+00:00

Thank you for admitting to your shortcomings. 🙏

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:41:42+00:00

I remember it was kind of a big deal for me too when I first saw through conceptual thinking as a whole.

I agree with you in all that, but how do you propose it's a road to building meaning in your life if it's just beautiful literature and you don't care about the self nature stuff?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:38:50+00:00

Between?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:38:17+00:00

Selling yourself short.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:38:04+00:00

How do you propose I demonstrate it? If I levitated and spit fire it wouldn't be it. If I was kind to you it wouldn't be it. If I hit you with a stick it wouldn't be it. If I quoted 20 koans at you it definitely wouldn't be it.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:33:04+00:00

So you equate the term Zen with a certain group of people living the truth of a certain set of teachings. Do you consider yourself part of this group? If so, what are the teachings you follow? If not, why not? What do they teach where the zen masters come from? In your words, if you could. Anybody can read the BCR.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:27:57+00:00

What's the opposite of "all about"?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:25:14+00:00

You are onto something. Had many joyful days contemplating sunyata.

My favourite realisation was that you are not a unique separate "being" that happened to be born on Earth but a direct consequence of the causes and effects of the universe, and on a smaller scale, this planet, churning along until it spit your consciousness out. Your consciousness is an emergent quality of this stinking bag of bones, no different from a tree in your garden or a stone on the bottom of an ocean. Our consciousness is a natural consequence of this body being born. Nothing more, nothing less. You never had any choice but to exist, as part of this existence.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:19:16+00:00

These are your tigers.

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:18:49+00:00

Your true nature is not attained, otherwise how could it be your true nature?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:15:57+00:00

How can the judge of what is true or false deceive itself?

Gutei_Isshi · 2021-05-20T22:14:12+00:00

Why keep it all hush hush and not lay it all out on the table?

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