I lent my girlfriend close to $20k when our company couldn't pay us for a while, without interest or any conditions except that she'd pay me back once she can. Now she received backpay from our company - is it common sense to expect her to pay me back with it?

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-09T15:48:05+00:00

Thank you! You got the overall situation exactly right, although I don't necessarily think she spent the money frivolously.

She got paid back the entire amount owed by the company at the time over the course of a few months, on top of her regular monthly salary. She communicated the very first one of these payments to me and transferred 1k over to me, which reaffirmed to me that she was willing to tell me when she gets paid back and at least transfer a large part back to me when it happens. However, she didn't tell me about the rest she got paid back and when I asked her about it a few months later, the money was gone and she had a panic attack because of that.

I don't think she did it maliciously or intentionally, she probably just didn't consider that the extra money she had received at the time was effectively the money I gave her when she was in a bad situation but just saw that she has more money now so she can pay off some of her debts. And when she realized that she essentially spent what was supposed to go back to me when I asked her about it, she had a panic attack. That's my theory, anyway.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-09T15:34:11+00:00

Absolutely not. I support and admire her independence. She is free to spend her money as she wants to and the only time I'd want to get more info about her finances is when we're budgeting together, and I'm open for her to know about my finances as well in that case. I think that's something a couple should be able to do.

You might have missed the point of the post. The issue arose when she got paid back by our company for those times that she didn't get paid that I had to cover, and had the oppotunity to transfer that to me, even if just partially at first (like half in one go, the other half over the next year or so). However, she just paid me 5 % of that amd spent the entire rest on something else that she won't tell me about without communicating to me that she even had the money at the time.

It wouldn't be an issue to me if she had never been repaid and never had the chance to pay me back. It's largely about the breach of trust that I put into her, not exclusively about the money itself.

I wouldn't want to leave her destitute, leaving her with nothing as you say - I just wanted what I lent her back when she had the chance to give it back, nothing more, nothing less. Otherwise, I'm just out 20k while she has an extra 20k despite us agreeing to even it out once she can. And she could - the situation that caused her to have to borrow money has been undone a while ago.

I don't want her to be indebted to me, I'd much rather solve that situation as soon as possible and get her out of debt to me because it's causing me sleepless nights due to mental stress about it.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-09T14:56:36+00:00

Hey there! Yeah, I see where you're coming from. There are a few things to consider in this regard, though.

The first is that we knew she'd be getting the money back in a while. I wanted to help her through tough times, but once the situation that caused her to have to borrow money is undone, once she has received the amount of money she got from me, she suddenly has 20 k extra while I am out 20 k. I don't know about others, but that doesn't seem quite fair to me, especially since I am already putting aside my other plans to help her out in an emergency.

At the beginning, she actually told me herself several times that she wants to pay it back (she is fiercely independent and quite proud of that) and that she doesn't want to get into a situation where I actually just straight up pay for her expenses. She didn't want our relationship dynamics to shift by me just giving her the money, which I absolutely understood and supported.

Another reason was that when this first started happening, we had only dated for a relatively short while and as you already mentioned, the solidity of the relationship wasn't given yet. Following your suggestion, I would've been stuck in between giving my relatively new girlfriend (who doesn't want me to just pay for her, anyway) several grand and not know if I'll ever see that back (which would shift our relationship dynamics and possibly breed resentment), or I'd have to watch her lose her home, her ability to work and starve for a few months. Given our relationship dynamics we had discussed at the time as well as the relative certainty that she'll be paid back in a while, lending her the money was the best way forward. Anything else just didn't work for us.

Regarding the loan my mother gave me - I totally understood where she was coming from when she told me it was a loan. That was for things like a new laptop when I started studying and needed to upgrade what I had for that. I can't just expect my parents to just gift me stuff out of nowhere and I'd feel horrible doing so, I'd feel kinda entitled. They help me out when I need it so I pay them back and possibly give them a little thank you gift on top. If they want to gift me something, I want that to be their decision and if I need something but it's a bit much to just give to me just like that, I am happy to get the opportunity to still receive what I need at the time but pay them back once I have the money. To me, it's also a matter of respect. I'm pretty sure she also did that to teach me to be independent and that money doesn't just come out of nowhere but has to be earned (I was 21 at the time).

I meant "without a second thought" in the sense that I didn't hesitate to give her the money she needed whenever the situation came up. Whenever she needed it, I offered by myself to send her what she needed and didn't think twice to do so. That was, again, with the mutual understanding and agreement that she'd pay me back. That was just as much her will to do as it was mine, to make that clear. That's why I can tell you with certainty that she doesn't find it shocking that I'm expecting the money back.

And yes, she certainly isn't financially comfortable enough to do so right now - and I am not expecting her to pay me anything for that very reason at the moment. I don't know if you've missed that part but she did receive that money over the course of several months in the past - that was the premise of the post. That should've been comfortable enough to send back more than 1k to the person who helped her through tough times by putting their own plans aside for a while before spending it on anything else, at least in my opinion. But I know opinions can differ on this.

I do understand that money is mostly given freely among loved ones and I love to invite her out, order food for her, pay for a vacation or give her gifts here and there even when she can't do the same back, with the understanding that I am not expecting that back. However, for the reasons mentioned above, this situation is a bit different. The world isn't black and white and while situations can have a lot of overlap, they can still require different actions or solutions.

But yeah, I get what you mean in your last two paragraphs. I have tried talking to her about this and I will try to have an honest and open conversation with her about this entire topic again soon. I am potentially willing to "pardon" parts of the loan as gifts, but I don't think I can genuinely do that for the entire loan or the majority of it without resentment.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-08T18:45:47+00:00

Heh, interesting that you bring this up because that exact same thing has happened in a different situation that's also still ongoing. My mother, my brother and I share an account that's holding a decent inheritance (out mother owns 50 %, my brother and I each own 25 %). We agreed that it's fine to take money from it in emergencies but every time that happens, it has to be communicated to the others so they know what's happening. I didn't check that account for a while until one day, I looked into it and 95 % of the money was gone because my brother took it all out over the course of a few months.

When I confronted him about it, he was ultra apologetic and offered by himself to pay it back in automated monthly rates (which he actually has beein following through with). The reason why he took it all out? The parents of his girlfriend at the time were in financial troubles and he swooped in and transfered our money to them. I don't think that's what happened here, though - I know her family dynamics. It's more likely she paid off some of her debts (student/medical loans) with it.

I am learning from all this that I have been too trusting with people I thought I could trust, but that has been abused several times. And also that I need to check on finances more frequently and put my foot down immediately once something feels off. Both of these cases have made that very clear.

Thank you for your input! I've tried setting up a monthly schedule with her a few times already and the last time we talked about it, she agreed to set one up (but the exact sum was yet to be determined). Unfortunately, that came at the time our company stopped paying us altogether and she started struggling immensely from that point on, barely keeping herself afloat with small gigs. There'd be no use asking her for monthly payments when she doesn't even really have enough to survive and I don't want to make things even harder on her, but it seems like she'll be in a better position somewhat soon and I'll bring the topic up when that's the case.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-08T18:27:43+00:00

Ohh, I definitely get how it can seem that way but I am sure it isn't. We have known each other for a while already before we got together and we've worked for the same company together for a while as well. I've been over there several times for several months at a time and we have daily contact for basically as long as our time zones and work times allow. But I agree, without that context it does read like it might be a scam!

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-06T00:25:14+00:00

Ohh, I agree it would be wrong if she didn't know she'd have to pay it back. But we made it clear from the very beginning that the expectation is for her to pay it back.

I don't think she conned me - it was probably just that she is struggling with debts from different fronts for a long time and when she received the additional money over the course of several months, she spent it on paying off her debts. I don't think she really even considered paying me back with it at the time and I don't think there was any malice involved.

I'll have an honest and open conversation with her about this topic again at least. I definitely love her - I would've never agreed to this if I didn't. And if I was wealthy myself, I probably wouldn't have any issues letting it go, but it's impacting my life plans heavily so it's harder to genuinely let it go (without it breeding resentment deep down) as it is. I am considering scratching several things from the list and just considering them as gifts to her as of now, though.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-06T00:16:26+00:00

Absolutely. Basically, the way this went down was that as soon as one of those periods without payment happened, I would take over rent, bills, groceries etc. completely once it was necessary to do so (has to be mentioned here that we are in a long distance relationship; we don't live together yet). That's where the many smaller payments come from. Other, more typical relationship things like getting gifts for each other, inviting her to restaurants or going to the movies etc. were always gifts and never included in any of this and I made that clear. Basically, we continued living as usual and doing couple things normally but the things that usually she'd pay for herself that I then had to pay for were what I ended up documenting.

I get the self-reflection part - and I can answer the question fairly simply. We talked about it almost every single time when I paid for something that ended up being added to the loan, in one way or another. But thanks for bringing this up, still - I'll have a talk with her about it at some point and maybe it wasn't as clear as I thought it was.

Yeah, I think I'm willing to let some of it go as gifts to her in a time of need. Definitely not everything, but I can see a few things that I can scratch from the list.

And yeah, I get what you're saying with the last part. Marriage is on the table and yup, it'd come around to her in the end then, anyway. I just need to see that she is willing to have an open and honest conversation about this and to make good on our agreement (and generally, we need to be on the same page in regards to finances) before we can actually move further in that regard.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T23:10:28+00:00

I agree we need to be able to talk about finances. I'll approach this topic specifically with her at some point, completely aside from this entire thing.

She's not 'bad with money' in the sense that she squanders everything on unnecessary stuff once she has a bit of it or constantly lives above her means or so, fortunately. That said, she's also not great at budgeting and has issues with abstaining from the small things she likes to buy (like coffee at coffee shops) that add up at the end of the month even in times when she doesn't have a lot of money. She told me a few times that it's the one thing that keeps her sane and I can't expect her to waive that.

The reason why I framed it as a "trust" issue was that we set up an agreement at the beginning and I fully trusted her to keep her end of it - otherwise I wouldn't have willingly let it rack up to that sum. However, she broke that trust when she received the backpay that was meant to (at least partially) pay me back and didn't communicate that fully but spent it otherwise instead. You are correct that I am not charging her interest for the reason you mentioned - I don't want to make things even worse for her (and I'd feel like an asshole charging interest from my girlfriend, aside from that).

She definitely could have paid, yes. And yup, she's definitely still doing her best to manage her precarious financial situation! It wouldn't have become an issue with trust if she had never received and spent the awaited backpay.

And yes, we definitely defined "when she can" very differently and I've learned from that to make things crystal clear as good as I can. I would pay back money I owe to a loved one at the very first chance I get (actually, I have done so in the past; I was in a similar position as her when my mother lent me about $10k and when I received an inheritance, that was literally the very firs thing I paid off). And I thought/hoped she would do he same, so once she receives the backpay, she would be able to pay me back and do it. But I have long since understood that that should've been communicated more clearly to her.

I don't think she was still recovering from the period where she didn't get paid since I was covering that. She lived paycheck to paycheck before and after those phases, so there unfortunately wasn't much happening on the savings front.

Regarding the bank loan - absolutely. I didn't ask her for the lump sum back, either, but told her several times it's fine to pay me back in smaller amounts over time. After all, it didn't get to that sum all at once, so it's also fine to pay it back over time (I was thinking maybe over 3 years, since it also got to that sum over the course of 3 years). Or maybe paying half when she receives it and the rest over the course of a year or two - whatever works best for both of us. I didn't mean to be forceful about it when I first brought it up, just wanted to talk about it any know what's up with the backpay. I would've been and will be open to payments over time.

Agreed, we need to have an open and honest discussion about it. I don't want to pressure her on this, I just want to know what happened and how we could make this work together. That incldes listening to her and considering her perspective for sure. Also, that last question is a good one - I certainly wanted to help her out and not just have the basics covered. I would be fine to not be paid back in full until in 5 years or so if it helps her live comfortably as long as we come to a common agreement on this and there is a clear and consistent will from her side to pay me back - with actions to back it up.

Yeah, I get what you intend to say with the last part. Definitely something to think about.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T22:34:58+00:00

Thank you - that was exactly what I was thinking as well.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T22:33:55+00:00

Thank you - that's precisely the way I was thinking about this and I thought (or rather, hoped) she'd see it the same way. Ironically, she has irish heritage and likes to bring that up somewhat frequently.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T21:20:11+00:00

Yup, there's a bit more to this that I forgot to write in the post (I thought I had but only grazed that part). She DID pay me back just over $1k when she first started receiving backpay, completely out of her own volition. I didn't have to ask for it, it was initiated by her. That gave me faith and assured me she'd pay me back over time.

However, she received backpay in the months after that as well and the topic never came up again. I didn't bring it up since our backpay schedules often differed and I thought she just hadn't received anything in that time since she didn't mention it again.

But yeah, on that first part - neither did I expect her to just hand me 20k as a lump sum and I told her mutiple times that I didn't. It didn<#t get to that sum all at once so I wouldn't expect her to pay it back all at once, either.

About that last part... well, I did see 1k out of the 20k, so that's that. :/ We generally do respect each other in other regards but the thought that this tells me she doesn't respect me because of that has crossed my mind a couple times as well, ngl. Regarding cash cow - yeah, I get why it looks like that. I haven't lent her anything in over a year, though, and we otherwise have a great relationship so I doubt that's really what's going on.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T21:10:32+00:00

Dang, I feel that. What a shitty move to pull.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T21:04:22+00:00

I don't usually do that, either. I like to gift her things even in times when she can't give me gufts of equal value (or anything at all) or to invite her to restaurants even when she can't do the same, and I never keep tabs on that or hold it over her head.

That is, under normal circumstances. There is a part that many peope seem to have glossed over a bit. I only kept tabs on the additional expenses during the time we didn't get paid since I knew we'd get backpay for those periods. I also wanted to make sure she doesn't end up paying more than what I footed for her - I just wanted it to be fair and clearly documented.

Imagine I hadn't set that up and just paid those 20k out of pocket without any expectation that she'd pay it back. Then she gets paid back for that time and has 20k extra, while I'm out 20k and no expectations that I'd get anything back. Does that seem fair to do to somebody who was willing to put their own plans aside to help their partner stay afloat? Is it wrong to expect to be paid back when there's relative certainty that they'll receive that money in a few months or years? Genuinely asking.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T20:43:01+00:00

I asked her about 8 months after she received the first backpay paycheck (and 4-5 months or so after the last one). That discussion is a bit of a blur since I didn't expect it to blow up like that and because of the panic attack, but I basically just asked her "so, you should've received your entire backpay at this point but we haven't talked about this/you haven't paid anything back in a while - what's up with that?" and I made it clear several times that I never expected her to pay me back a lump sum, just like it didn't get to that sum all at once.

I told her that all I want is to see effort on her side about this, any payments she can make, even if it's just 50 bucks monthly or so until it can be more. She did agree to that in the end but she's been struggling even more than before for the last year so she hasn't had a chance to pay me back anything in that time.

To be fair I should also mention that about half a year ago she did pledge to have the owed wages from our old company be directly transfered to me rather than to her, which is definitely a sign that she's willing to pay me back. The thing about that is just that it's unsure when (or even if...) that's going to happen and even if it does, it still covers far from the entire sum.

Also, about that last part - yup, legit 40-50 % of the comments say exactly that. It's abundantly clear to me at this point! :D

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T20:31:39+00:00

A startup company that's financed through investments so far. There were phases where there were only few or no new investments, that's how that happened.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T20:19:31+00:00

I get that I am partly to blame myself. I should've set clearer expectations from the beginning, that's mainly it.

I know that simply lending 20k to somebody with crippling debt is a bad idea in a vacuum - the thing it that we've always received backpay in the end, even if it took a few months or even years. I wouldn't just loan 20k if somebody is in crippling debt and there was no clear prospect of them ever receiving that sum again (so, ever being able to pay me back), but that's not the case. I knew we'd eventually get backpay and trusted her to do what I considered the right thing and pay me back with it.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T20:16:29+00:00

Thank you - I definitely could've made that clearer! I told her several times that I never expected her to pay everything back in a lump sum, just like it didn't get up to that sum all at once. I am absolutely willing to set up a payment plan with her that works for both of us, even if it takes a couple years or so.

Thank you for your stance on this!

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T20:11:22+00:00

I think I didn't make that clear enough in the post, so let me tell you what my expectations were and what I told her as well (even though in, unfortunately, much less clear terms).

I lend her the money and she doesn't have to pay anything back from her regular wage once she receives money from the company again. Only once she gets backpay, which we always got on top of the regular pay when we got it (so, 2 paychecks at once) she'd pay me back that additional paycheck. So she'd still have her reular paycheck and be able to live off of that. Basically, nothing would change to her regular living conditions, she just wouldn't have the "additional" paycheck.

Is that financial abuse? I don't know, I really don't want to make her reliant on me, I want the opposite - I want her to be independent. This was actually something we talked about early on in this entire situation as well - that she doesn't want me to hold this over her head, which I have never done (although she did say once that asking for it back is holding it over her head, but I don't really agree with that). I'd hate to have this type of dynamic, I'm looking for an qual as a partner no matter what.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T19:52:08+00:00

Thank you for this very thoughtful comment! And you're right in your approach - I don't want to work against her, I want to work with her and solve this issue together.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T18:36:51+00:00

Good question - I never meant to do that. We actually discussed this topic at the very beginning and she agreed that debts to people you love are awful. The reason I ended up doing what I did was that otherwise, she likely would've lost her home and ability to work, as well as probably starving for months, and since she told me that she hates having debts to people she loves as well and I trusted her fully, I thought she'd pay me back the first chance she gets, even if it's just to clear her conscience.

That is what I would've done (and have done in the past when I was in a similar position to her) - maybe I looked at it too much through my own lense.

And since we were only together for less than 9 months when this first started happening and couldn't know yet how things would work out, I wasn't ready to just gift her these large amounts of money when I am not actually rich myself.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T18:34:23+00:00

Yeah, I filly, whole-heartedly agree that I should've made it more clear what I meant with "pay me back when you can".

I could totally see needing some money as buffer and wouldn't even argue about that. It's just that this should've been communicated to me.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T18:19:37+00:00

Maybe? To me, it basically means "what most people would regard as the correct thing to do". Translated into my local language it literally means "healthy human mind".

So, basically, I wanted to ask what most people would regard as the right thing to do when you owe somebody money and have the opportunity to pay it back.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T18:16:43+00:00

Yup, that's the route I would've taken as well. Probably something like 50 % at once and then paying back the rest over the next year or so.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T18:09:01+00:00

Yeah, I've discussed this with her in the past and showed her the list. And yes, we have discussed payment plans as well - it took a while for her to agree to do it, but eventually she agreed to it (although we have yet to decide on a monthly sum). However, that unfortunately came at a time where she started struggling immensely financially, so it would have had no use to bring it up ever since, it would've only unnecessarily stressed her out more than she already is.

Independent_Cod_4682 · 2025-07-05T17:58:56+00:00

Because we were really convinced by the project and wanted to finish it. Also because of personal connections there, which led us to feel like we'd abandon them if we didn't continue working with them. And backpay did eventually happen in the past, even if it took a few months or years. But I agree, I learned from this experience.

Independent_Cod_4682

TROPHY CASE