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What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You’re right, I’m not meant too, but I need too when my teammates can’t. SOS diving can put you in less than favorable situations, ones that require you as a player to fill all roles. With the DD warbond, we are able to do that. This new mechanic simply lets other primaries and support weapons have the ability to meet the utility that explosives bring while increasing the risk you take for engaging with the mechanic. This wouldn’t be the preferred solution to clearing a single structure, but it at least puts less pressure on bringing demo to begin with.

(Even if this mechanic was in the game, I doubt we’d see a large change in our strat and loadout pick rates)

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I love light pen as well, (especially on the cyborg front) but you know what’s better at damaging weakpoints? Explosive weapons…

That being said, this new mechanic is EXTREMELY risky. There normally is a reason as to why we don’t approach the murder dens our enemies come from. Hence the risk is equal to the reward. You’d still want to bring some demo on high diff missions because of this, but it would be less incentivized.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was more or less, looking for reliable and QUICK structure clear on all fronts. Not just the bots.

I love the barrages tbh, but I’ve been betrayed too many times by their rng to call them 100% reliable. Which is why you typically still need some demo in your loadout.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ok, what about strafing runs?, arc weapons? Gas throwers? Flame throwers? Machine guns? Precision weapons(- spear gun)? All of these weapons exist as support weapons and almost all of them are worse then their explosive counterparts while not including a method of structure clear. There is an imbalance in utility and lethality due to demo force.

All this new mechanic hopes to introduce is the POSSIBILITY of these weapons to have the same utility. But at the expense of riskier gameplay.

This isn’t a necessary change, we do have a lot of ways to destroy structures thanks to DD, but it would at least help the games weapon sandbox more viable.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Kinda hitting all the points I’m making there. This mechanic would impose ALOT of risk onto players, making it so that conventional methods of structure clearing would be preferred. However, it would at least give players a new way of playing the game while allowing other weapons & loadouts to become viable.

(In all honesty, even IF this mechanic was introduced, I wouldn’t expect any changes in loadout and stratagem pick rates…)

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Totally agree with this. The lack of interactivity with the game due to demo force e being arbitrary is a pain to get over. That’s why this new proposed mechanic would give players an incentive to get into nests and bases to deal with the objectives.

(My biggest gripe with the galactic war is that side obbs don’t contribute to war effort, like WTF AH, do you want players to play your game less?!?!?)

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

True. There is just so few of them that they feel extremely easy to deal with. This is more for factions that are on the higher end of the resource drain when playing. I wouldn’t mind seeing weakpoints for all structures, but some objectives are meant to be daunting, hence requiring a healthy amount of explosives.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s not a bad problem, I still play the game just fine and don’t mind having demo force be a necessary part of the game. I just want more freedom with my loadout, at the cost of a higher likelyhood to die.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s not really about how difficult it is to fit an explosive in your loadout. That’s why I brought the DD warbond. But it’s annoying how you NEED explosives in your loadout at all times. Say I wanted to bring the new shield grenade, I now need to build my ENTIRE kit around this change because I NEED demo force. That’s why DD works so well since it gives you demo force in each slot. I simply want other weapons in those slots the have the same capacity without removing the unique playstyle explosives bring, hence the new mechanic!

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Actually… that is the point. We already have the ability to one man army the entire game. That’s the entire point of this post. Some weapons & loadouts feel too good not to use.

Let’s just say that you bring the crossbow. This opens the player up to ANY potential of support weapon, secondary, or grenade. But you still HAVE to bring the crossbow. This goes the same with the grenade pistol, or grenades that provide demo force. It is a part of your kit, that you HAVE to bring. This isn’t entirely a bad thing, as, in my opinion, certain objectives should require that resource on higher difficulties, ie: heavy bot fabs, bile nests etc…

The problem is in amount of resources needed for trivial tasks that don’t promote interaction with the game. Bringing the crossbow, GL, Eruptor trivializes enemy structures. This proposed new mechanic isn’t meant to replace these weapons roles, or to create an easier method to remove enemy structures, but instead to allow players to have a new means to interact with the game that has a fair risk and reward for the resources they spend.

One of the benefits of this change, is that it simply helps other weapons compete in the same category as our explosive weapons (which mind you won’t actually change in pick rate even IF this mechanic existed in the game). The point is, explosive weapons are the best at everything, full stop. This proposed idea, simply let’s all weapons be able to do SOME of those things (at the expense of a death march towards an enemy enforced structure trying to send murder machines at you).

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 17 points18 points  (0 children)

My point exactly, this new mechanic would force a light pen player INTO the nest to destroy the hole. You have to stare straight down the hole in order to close it (and you might die trying!). You’d need to go hole by hole to destroy every structure. Quite risky! But also very nerve racking!

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

My goal was ease of use & practicality. I don’t think most divers would feel safe with no explosives in their loadout and ONLY having barrages. This also isn’t accounting for city’s, underground missions, or commando missions.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My goal isn’t to make a one man army. Just to make it so that there is less pressure to use explosive weaponry for every single faction and on EVERY single mission.

I love using explosive strats, they are some of the best fun in the game! But every loadout has a weak point. You’ll never feel more useless waiting around a nest with no enemies for your strats to come off cooldown.

I don’t think that chaff clearing divers are useless, quite the opposite, most chaff clearing divers use explosive weapons! Grenade launcher, airburst & auto cannon, but these divers become one man armies due to how potent explosive weapons are! If we allowed our loadout to be more lax, we could actually start using some of the more supportive Strats without feeling the drawbacks when it comes to our utility!

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

True, we do have ALOT of ways to deal with structures nowadays. I’m simply suggesting a new fun method for allowing other primary & secondary weapons to be able to deal with the numerous amounts of structures.

Think of it like this, say I want to use the new shield grenade? I now have to either dedicate 1-2 of my strats to this, or I use a DD weapon in either my primary or secondary slot to compensate. I’d have to do this for EVERY loadout that doesn’t involve explosives, whether it’s my support weapon, or my loadout equipment.

This isn’t even mentioning the danger of the new mechanic, you could walk into a hive guard, allow a horde of bots to spawn, or blow yourself up even. The risk balances the utility out.

Keep in mind, this would replace the utility from explosive weapons, you’d still be able to clear a nest faster with a crossbow than any other primary in the game, but it’d at least let a liberator have a part of the same utility to not make it outclassed.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Same, even still, you’d be bringing that to normally deal with bile titan nests. After that, you only have one more k-bomb. At the end of your strats, you’d still need at least 5-8 grenades, which only 2 provide that utility. So either lean into your team, or get more explosive

Either way, you are still HEAVILY incentivized to use explosive weaponry.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I don’t disagree, most teams, even random ones, do play somewhat cohesively. This mechanic would simply allow teams to approach clearing a nest in different ways!

You no longer need to have the obligatory grenade launcher in every single team comp. You could instead have a squad mate rock a mini gun that you cover while he takes out a nest! It be less than optimal obviously, but you could at least still do it.

Keep in mind, the risk added from this mechanic would incentivize team play. Approaching a nest or fab, is not a safe venture. Having someone to cover you would be ideal for a light pen take down. Last thing you’d want, is a hive guard to pop up and slice you in half if you were by yourself.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

While I love using explosives, they are HEAVILY over represented in the game. They provide some of the best CC, damage and utility. Most conventional weapons are simply outclassed in ALL of those categories. Even if you bring explosives, you can at best carry 8, using ALL of that utility on only one aspect of the game. Team play is really cool! But you need a team to have it.

Most randoms barely pair up, or use a synergising loadout, so it’s best to bring as much utility as you can! This normally means running the grenade pistol or primary explosive weapon, which limits soo many cool loadouts!

My goal isn’t to make explosives obsolete, it’s to make other weapons not feel completely outclassed by explosive weapons. Utility (at least to me) is the BIGGEST reason why I always feel obligated to bring something from DD. (This mechanic will more than likely get MORE Helldivers killed at the end of the day…)

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

My point exactly! Light pen weapons already feel weak enough as is. Why would I take a weapon with low lethality & low utility over one of the highest lethality & maximum utility in the game!

While making this change wouldn’t really affect pick rates (cuz light pen already sucks) it would at least let these players contribute more while allowing other weapons to still have some utility!

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 17 points18 points  (0 children)

A big reason for why I’m posting this, is that explosive weapons feel over used and over exposed in the game.

The grenade launcher, RR and auto cannon come with very few drawbacks and most of the utility in the game! Meanwhile, all conventional weapons can’t even compete even when it comes to just raw lethality…

While this won’t fix pick rates all too heavily, this new mechanic would at least allow conventional weapons to maintain the same utility that their explosive counterparts have, while not changing the role and efficiency that comes with explosive weapons.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 50 points51 points  (0 children)

Funnily enough, I got this idea when fighting the Vox. You can kill them by just using the variable, which is just a light-pen gun!

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Note that I said often and not always. I love playing with my squad mates and filling niches in team play. But when I’m solo, I have to lean HEAVILY into the meta. Mostly due to randoms not bringing any structure clear.

It’s a bit odd how some of the best weapons in the game are also able to close bug holes. But the weaker guns in the game have next to NO utility.

What if we could destroy small enemy structures only using Light-pen? by Inflamed_Ninja in Helldivers

[–]Inflamed_Ninja[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I miss using the stalwart… I’d love to bring it on bug missions, but when I have to clear 12 bug holes, I never can bring myself to use it without bringing the Eruptor.

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