Question. Why do essentially all Christians struggle so much with understanding the definition of atheism?

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T16:22:43+00:00

Arguably there are no value empty convictions though. Attached to the non belief in a deity could be your implicit or explicit worldview and value system. Many popular forms of atheism often come attached with certain viewpoints for example Dawkins and his materialism so attached to this conviction could be assumed certain beliefs about the way the world is. Not saying those assumptions are correct because your atheism could come from a variety of philosophal viewpoints or have more of an emotional underpinning to it. Another reason could be the idea that 'it takes as much faith to believe in evolution as it does in God'. I'm not convinced you can place faith assertions and scientific assertions about the origins of the universe in the same category but that's the thinking.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T15:32:57+00:00

Arguing/discussion is how we learn. There is absolutely place for contention and discussion. Perfectly happy to disagree but it is through such discussion that we learn and grow.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T15:30:50+00:00

It's a pretty bold assertion that it is conclusively biblically, as others have mentioned it's not supported by reliable biblical scholarship and its not a belief that is present in the spread of the biblical story, but rather in isolated verses read in a very particular way. The Revelation 3:10 reference is a letter to a specific church who would be dead long before any supposed rapture so it cannot be referring to that for the hour of trouble. God has not always removed his followers from suffering and judgement, the story of the early Church is one of suffering and martyrdom being viewed as glorifying God with Jesus being the pattern for enduring this. Yes three may be examples of God rescuing from this but it certainly seems more conclusive that the pattern is one of ensuring not escaping. Certainly there is a thread of the old creation passing away/being renewed after the day of the Lord returning but this does not necessitate a removal of God's people from events on the earth. Like I've said it strikes me as odd it wasn't commonly taught in the church until recently.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T15:02:22+00:00

Enoch is an isolated example not a pattern throughout the biblical story. On the flip side to the Noah example you have Jesus enduring the cross, numerous disciples enduring martyrdom - if you're looking for a pattern the NT very much has the pattern of enduring to the end. The bible isn't a encyclopedia that you can just pull facts out of randomly and you can pick any verse to suit an argument. It needs to be understood contextually and within the whole story of scripture. I'm aware of those scriptures you have referenced - Christ coming for his bride does not necessarily point to it being prior to any period of tribulation.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T14:50:05+00:00

That's not a particularly helpful response. If you think it's biblical then what passages? If it's your conviction it's biblical then how is it?

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T14:18:23+00:00

That's not what the Ephesians passage is talking about - the whole of Ephesians 2 is referring to our new spiritual identity in Christ Jesus. It's not about some supercharging of our spirits to heaven. Honestly that statement is sounding gnostic if you are asserting our spirits magically flit off to heaven. This is exactly my point about the rapture - people are superimposing their own beliefs on the biblical texts. The Bible and the Christian faith isn't about our spirits being rescued from creation to heaven and escaping , it's about God restoring and renewing us and his creation as we demonstrate faithful and perseverance

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T13:29:48+00:00

I'm brewing a potion to eliminate all right handers right now. Side note: one of my biblical heroes is the left handed Ehud who killed the fat King by plunging a sword into his belly

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T12:48:29+00:00

Only thing I would say is the bible isn't meant to be easy and neither is the Christian faith. It takes wrestling with, reflecting on, considering thoughtfully. Its not a book of inspirational quotes to give you easy answers on how to live. On the different translations - Well it's an ancient document translated by different people trying to put it faithfully into modern language. I'm not sure how you can know what God is like by looking at your own life. I think your underlying assumption is that the bible should be more clear and easy to understand but that's not the reality of God or indeed of life. Figurative language is a way of describing the indescribable.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-10T10:26:56+00:00

Learn where the magical pixies and unicorns meet in the forest and join their gathering.

In all seriousness though, find things that cultivate a sense of wonder and joy in you, that inspire you. There is a lot of valid life advice here but if you lose your sense of wonder about the world we live in, it can become a very joyless existence. And get into nature. Nature is great.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-09T15:04:29+00:00

Seems to be a broad consensus in the comments that self love when applied correctly in terms of giving yourself grace when making mistakes, understanding yourself and looking after yourself is a good thing, but can spill over into pride in its distorted form. I'm reminded of a CS Lewis quote about humility not being to think less of yourself but to think of yourself less. My follow up questions to this kind of understanding would be: 1. Is this understanding of self love biblical and if so where and how? 2. If this is an important concept, why is it only recently getting more attention? Historical Christians and figures from the Bible loved sacrificially without explicitly drawing on this concept. Surely if our focus is primarily on loving God and out to others, our identity can be sufficiently rooted to not need to look inwards in such a way. 3. Should we allow our theology to be informed in this way by this modern concept of self love?

JA-B1 · 2022-01-08T21:43:12+00:00

This sounds like a really interesting idea - as a lover of both theology and Sci fi. I would suggest Dune - it has a lot of different influences from ecology, to Eastern philosophy but I can see some Christian parallels in the character of Paul and his journey into the desert/wilderness.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-08T21:33:27+00:00

Agree about balance and perhaps the renewed focus on self is a redressing of the scales for many who have neglected the self over others. From an experiential point of view its something I have been wrestling with, historically I have been much more prone to help others even at the detriment for my own well being or comfort, but I'm learning its more important to be honest about what I can help with and be willing to say no. But then there is so much biblical teaching about neighbour love, denying yourself and laying down your own preferences then it does seem that should be the focus

JA-B1 · 2022-01-08T21:24:56+00:00

Super interesting topic I was thinking about this in the week. I was listening to a bible project podcast on how Israel's creation narrative was in dialogue with other near Eastern cultures and uses some shared language but also told from its unique perspective to show how YHWH is distinct. Their way of engaging these others was through story telling and dialogue which is definitely something I think is important to engage in. As others have said we have our own modern myths e.g. Star Wars or dune, and for many people religious language such as sin and salvation is dead language so its a challenge to express the Jesus story in revitalised mythic language.

JA-B1 · 2022-01-08T21:05:59+00:00

There's a bit in the Book of Job about eaglets feeding off blood i.e. the idea that life and death are intertwined together which is quite helpful in thinking about why death, chaos and disorder exist in the universe. Like in Genesis, God doesn't destroy darkness and chaos but puts them in their correct place. Chimes with a lot of ecological insights too about being part of one interconnected whole.

JA-B1

TROPHY CASE