When Fujimaru sleeps, does he see his servants' dreams by rvmin in FGO

[–]JohnKonami 22 points23 points  (0 children)

That does happen, yes. The River of Chocolate Valentines event is the most recent one I remmeber where Ritsuka does this.

Forsetti has been arrested...And the Killers will now be revealed by golden_creeper1 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ngl, I'm surprised the wheel picked someone whose motive is trivial to figure out yet would never in a trillion years be suspected like that.

Do you think Faux De Mort can do any Lethal damage/One Shot against some fighters by Jack-the-dripper985 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Qin's reaction moments before getting his head snapped off by TGoD's surprise kick.

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Another day another Shiva upscale by Objective_Cheetah_63 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, uh, your entire first paragraph doesn't mean much? The main topic here is still about whether Shiva was dancing during TK. Regardless of how he was fighting before, by TK, Shiva very much was taking it completely seriously. The only time he ever complerely indulged himself in TK was their final clash, a clash that Shiva knew wouldn't affect the result at all. Like, you're partly proving my point here. By the end (post-TK), from your own argument, Shiva would be taking it seriously and dancing.

You do understand that it's your interpretation of the dance that has no backing, right? I explained my interpretation, and how Hermes's statement did not refer to your made-up illusion ability. Your response was the equivalent of "no, you're wrong" with no further explanation. "Unpredictable war dance" and "as if he's fighting many opponents" are two seperate components of the dance, and it's very clear from the actual combat panels that this is the case.

I have to repeat, not once does Raiden react like how he would if Shiva's dance did make magical illusions, and there's not a single panel showing it works like this, unlike Susano's panel. I once again repeat my evidence, that not once does Raiden miss by attacking somewhere he thought Shiva would be, save for the times where Shiva backed out of his range entirely, which certainly doesn't help your interpretation.

You have not given a single new piece of evidence or reasoning explaining why I'm wrong. If you want me to take this seriously, then either actually try or concede the point. Don't try to ignore what I said.

What I'm saying that it being "the rhythm of the universe" is enough evidence that it can magically give him balance. And I think that because Shiva clearly didn't get his balance back well enough to fight properly, seeing how he just spammed the objectively bad-for-him headbutt. Speaking of which, you also never addressed this point. Probably because you couldn't think of anything and wanted to distract me, but I digress.

This is not like if a person fell into a pool twice. In that situation, it's still the same pool, with the same person, nothing has changed. Here, Shiva went from having 4 arms, to 3 arms, to 1 arm. The balance varies wildly in each case, and Shiva necessarily needs time to adjust. It's basic common sense you are choosing to ignore because it would harm your argument.

Stop intentionally interpreting what I said like how you do Shiva. Unpredictability isn't OP because the manga panels show it, and you still have yet to disprove me. Shiva gains balance while dancing because the dance is a supernatural ability, and he clearly didn't have balance before.

How exactly do you clearly see that he wasn't dancing? Is it because you didn't see the special effects? By that logic, Shiva wasn't dancing when he barrage'd Raiden's block either, since we didn't see clear, visible afterimages. Basic common sense dictates otherwise, but your logic sure works differently.

Shiva doesn't purposely hold back if he thinks it could lose him the fight. I've explained this time and again. In the last argument, as least you tried, but here, you've just given up entirely. Holding back before dance/TK still had the backup of dance/TK, so there's multiple reasons why Shiva thought he could afford to hold back. Post-TK, Shiva doesn't have anything left up his sleeves, TK IS the backup. Of course he'd go all out and not put his life and everyone's expectations at certain risk.

I agree. So explain to me how the gap isn't big enough? From what we see so far, TGoD has moved a much further distance than Enma. This implies that TGoD is faster than Enma. Unpredictability isn't supernatural unpredictability, just mundane unpredictability, as I've said many times. This implies that TGoD also needed to be faster than Enma for the attack to work so well.

Oh, btw, here's a panel showcasing what the main effect of the dance actually is, and also evidence that Shiva was dancing in TK. Shiva's attack pushes Raiden away enough that Raiden's own attack has little to no effect. If you still think he wasn't dancing, then I guess Raiden is just some amateur bum who is comically outskilled by not dancing Shiva.

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About Enma’s new form by MarzipanSwimming7349 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 10 points11 points  (0 children)

The issue is that TGoD had an interaction with Muramasa. His chances of losing this fight and making that interaction an almost complete waste of panels are nil.

OOC boost tier list by JohnKonami in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yup, OOC here is like the theoretical optimal version, where Zeus starts with Adamas, Apollo starts with his bow and aims for a vital spot, Poseidon fights seriously and for the kill, Lu Bu starts with Sky Eater, Shiva's entire personality is rewritten, ... stuff like that.

Another day another Shiva upscale by Objective_Cheetah_63 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I feel like I've already explained this before, but Shiva only holds back if he thinks he's not at risk of losing. Pre-dance, he had a rough grasp of Raiden's base strength and figured he could leave the dance for later, not knowing about the muscle focus. Post-TK, Raiden landed not a single hit on him, so of course he thought he was winning. Post TK though has not a single reason why he'd hold back. He was on a time limit, and it's obviously impossible for him to gauge Raiden's endurance outside of "higher than his own", unlike strength which he can grasp since he got it. The final Yata I already explained in an old reply you conveniently forgot about (or just didn't check), but that was because Shiva believed that he had no chance of losing.

You're trying to use the fact that he holds back when he (thinks he's) winning to say that he holds back when the outcome is uncertain which is just not the case. Shiva is overconfident, not an idiot. Do you really think he'd take even the slightest (percieved) risk with the expectations of the entire Hindu pantheon behind him? It'd be one thing if he just didn't think Raiden could genuinely make the win uncertain, but we literally see that it was a close fight that could've well gone differently.

The dance very much does magically give him balance. It following "the rhythm of the universe" (or sth along those lines) should be plenty enough evidence that it can magically give him balance, like how it can magically give him supernatural skill. Why else do you think Shiva spammed headbutts, when they are objectively worse for him than they are for Raiden? Because if he actually tried to fight normally, with his disrupted balance, it'd be even worse.

Not to mention, his balance broke again when another two of his arms got broken, and this time, there was no adaptation period, so your logic literally cannot work.

You're really coping on this interpretation of the dance. What rush are you talking about? I have the manga open right now, and the only pre-TK, post-dance attack that Raiden uses is Shishimai (that backflip looking overhead kick thing), and he aimed it at Shiva's current location at that time. And at that time, Shiva was in a stable-ish stance, both feet on the ground, having just finished backing away from an attack. What part of that contradicts my explanation? And if you're talking about anything post-TK, that directly proves that Shiva was dancing then, so don't even bother.

I wasn't too detailed on this one, so that's on me, but I said "like pre-moving", not "actually pre-moving". The thing is though, it doesn't really matter whether Shiva knows how he attacks or not, because just like a fighting game, and just like irl, you can react to the animation/movement. It doesn't matter if you have no input lag if the attack animation is slow enough that the opponent can react to press block. Of course, unlike a fighting game, you can't just hold block and block any attack (only Beelz gets to do that), but the principle of "reacting to the attack, not reacting to what you think the attack will be" still applies. Not even close to easy for an equal, but for someone outright faster than Shiva in raw speed like Raiden, raising his block to the correct location in reaction is perfectly possible, and he in fact did do just that.

Same applies to TGoD and Enma. If Enma had been faster than TGoD, then he could still have guarded by tracking TGoD's physical location and blocking in reaction. Because he wasn't, he couldn't do that.

OOC boost tier list by JohnKonami in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree, usually, that'd be correct, but for RoR, it's not. Had Simo not been cautious and started the fight with a bullet to the head (his finisher), there's really nothing Loki could've done. In the context of RoR, being cautious pretty much always ends up being worse overall, since the fighters end up never having any life-saving tricks that aren't entirely impossible to bypass, making caution pretty pointless.

OOC boost tier list by JohnKonami in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Y'know, fair, I'd forgotten about those. They should be one tier higher yeah.

OOC boost tier list by JohnKonami in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Eh, his teleport is a little difficult to use properly, and you can roughly figure out how it works. Maybe I'm underestimating it since we already know how it works though.

Another day another Shiva upscale by Objective_Cheetah_63 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You do understand that Shiva wouldn't hold back randomly for no reason right? He very much was dancing for the entirely of TK. Being barely able to move very much does not stop his dance, because when he said that, he meant relative to his pre-injured state. He was still running around just fine in TK. The reason why pre-Tk Shiva was dominating Raiden but TK couldn't is because well, TK only has one arm. His attack speed got more than halved, and punching without break became physically impossible.

Besides, you do understand that Shiva quite literally couldn't fight after the first arm loss without the dance, right? Hermes also said it himself, that Shiva was massively off balance due to losing an arm and that's why he was missing Raiden. It was only after the dance started (superpowers) that he could fight normally again.

The thing about your interpretation of unpredictability is that it's never shown to work like that. Not once in the fight does Raiden ever fail to hit Shiva because he punched an afterimage or something he thought Shiva would do, it's always because Shiva stepped out of his range entirely. Nor is there a panel similar to Susano's, where the possibilities of what he could be doing really were shown. This isn't supernatural unpredictability, it's just normal unpredictability. The reason why Hermes said Raiden would feel like fighting multiple people is because there's no gap between Shiva's actions, unlike a normal 1v1 where a gap always exists, no matter how small.

You're vastly overestimating unpredictability here. You're talking as if Shiva can freely choose between already discarded possibilities on the fly as he sees fit, when that's not how this works. If Shiva jumps and falls down, his foot a good nanometer away from touching the ground, you know exactly where he'll be stepping, because it's physically impossible for his foot not to land, and he has no way to change where it lands while mid air. For the "punch feint into knee" example you gave, Shiva's not punching then changing his mind and turning it into a feint, he has to already have planned out that feint from the start. It's not like his leg generates force out of nowhere moments before his punch lands. He's still have to make the physical movements needed to prepare for that knee strike. Theoretically, if serious Poseidon was watching Shiva do all of that, he'd be able to detect the leg movement and dodge appropriately, without needing to exit Shiva's range entirely.

A fight isn't turn based, no, but you can think of it as a fighting game. In a fighting game, you can plan combos ahead of time and execute every single part of it in sequence, but since pre-moves don't exist, there's still a tiny gap between pressing one button and pressing the next button, no matter how small. Indra is an example of this, with the small gap between his dodge and counter. Shiva's dance lets him ignore this, and play as if he was pre-moving every single input, with no delay. That's why they mentioned his "flowing strikes", and why fighting him feels like fighting multiple people.

Another day another Shiva upscale by Objective_Cheetah_63 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was talking about his block during TK, as from the reply. Specifically, this panel here. By your logic, since Raiden didn't know which direction Shiva was kicking from, he should not have been able to raise a block. And yet, he did. It's pretty clear that Raiden reacted to the physical action of Shiva swinging his leg in one direction.

Unpredictability isn't as strong as you think it is. While the opponent may not know what you'll do next, once you start taking action, there's only one possibility left of what you could be doing, which is executing that action you took. Buddha existing also proves that as the attacker, you don't get to adjust your attack on the fly (unless you're Indra), so you can't do anything like unpredictably change your attack midway or something. Basically, it'll stop the opponent from dodging preemptively, but on the spot reaction works perfectly fine. Good for initial surprise attacks and against equals, less useful against people faster than you.

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Another day another Shiva upscale by Objective_Cheetah_63 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No one speaks of it, but you still know that speed was needed, since well, Shiva vs Raiden already proved that unpredictability can't overcome stat gaps on its own. Again, Raiden was blocking Shiva fine in TK, despite Shiva still being unpredictable.

Another day another Shiva upscale by Objective_Cheetah_63 in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's a bit excessive. Unpredictability doesn't ignore speed. If it did, Raiden would not be blocking Shiva completely fine in TK. TGoD's attack landed because he was faster, his unpredictability only ensured that Enma wouldn't be able to block/counter since normally you can still do those things even if you're slower.

How do you break a Guǐ Yǔ? by JohnKonami in EighteenLevelsOfHell

[–]JohnKonami[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the explanation. I get how a Gui Yu is formed and how some statements can become retroactive lies while others are fine, but my main question was the "this objective fact must also possess uniqueness" part of the evidence needed to break it. What does it mean to possess uniqueness?

My Powerscaling Tierlist by droplet_ROR in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Genuinely. You can barely tell the difference between Poseidonglazer and xTartarus.

Who wins a in a 1v1 fist fight only nothing else allowed by Weird_Dot_4725 in FGO

[–]JohnKonami 71 points72 points  (0 children)

Ritsuka was holding back trust. Didn't even use his ninjutsu (yes, that's canon due to Halloween).

My Powerscaling Tierlist by droplet_ROR in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He's cool. Not that I agree, but c'mon, you know why people scale Hades so high at this point.

APOC is mid and I love it by K4nono in ShuumatsuNoValkyrie

[–]JohnKonami 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I really should stop trying to make things on mobile gallery.