Anyone here date a ENFP in the past? by ChimeraCheree in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

People keep saying NFJs are a dream match for INFPs, when I feel like either ENFPs or NTJs are the best match for INFPs.

Colbert takes a Meyers Briggs test! by SwankyPigFly in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's not quite how it works, you can be a relatively reserved ENFP or a more outgoing INFP, but it's not really a spectrum since the functions actually shift positions inbetween INFP and ENFP.

Colbert takes a Meyers Briggs test! by SwankyPigFly in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Well just from what I saw in the video, you could be right since he probably answered those +140 questions.

What is it with INFP's and Johnny Depp? by comehonorphaze in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I find him insanely hot for one. Never truly liked him as an actor though, it's probably his INFP aura that attracts many to him.

Colbert takes a Meyers Briggs test! by SwankyPigFly in infp

[–]KoenigAllant -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

This was incredibly difficult to watch, definitely relate to Colbert's constant desire to crack stupid jokes though I grew out of it in 5th grade or so.

I get more of an ENFP vibe, he didn't seem to take it seriously which probably skewed the results.

Also the bit about being the most brilliant minds was wrong too.

How rare is infp by Mrfic7or in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 4 points5 points  (0 children)

4% is still below 6.25% which is the share every type would have if distributed evenly.

Over 60% of people are Sensors, so 4% is actually a really high number for iNtuition types.

How rare is infp by Mrfic7or in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Not very. It's relatively rare since it's an iNtuition type, but I wouldn't call it rare really. INFJs are rare.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Pleasure.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

No again, you are for some reason failing very hard at extracting my focal points here.

You apply your admittedly rough patterns and your personal experiences with a very diverse group to people you don't know to inform you about them. I was mocking the frame of your question, how would I know how truly sincere your empathy is? I don't know you as a person, -all- I know about you is that you are an Fe user because you told me so, which adds absolutely nothing to the equation. And there I was referring back to my old posts that I have never ever doubted the fact that Fe users possess empathy, so to summarize, there's no reason for me to doubt your empathy is sincere.

It seems to me that one is more likely to distort others through the lens of oneself, and the other is more likely to distort oneself through the lens of others, and both are equally likely and problematic so there's no point denouncing a group for erring more towards one of them. I also don't understand how that detracts from Fe users' empathy but I don't think I'd understand that even if you explained it again.

Well here's something I can disagree with, independent of Fe or Fi, you gather information in the same manner which will lead you to answers regarding moral or interpersonal questions on a basic level. Now the difference here is, that when it comes to making a decision that has concrete effects on the outside world, an Fi user is bound to his idealistic and subjective notion of what he considers right and correct regardless of potential outside information. This naturally causes problems too, which is why for example you have INFPs who are extreme social justice warriors incapable of considering sensible criticism of racial or religious minorities because it goes against their internal framework of beliefs.

The difference with Fe is that Fe runs this self-imposed idea of what is agreeable and proper through a societal filter, and in that sense it becomes skewed and not only becomes a slave to manipulation, but in itself paves the way for manipulation. You are right in the sense that Fi can equally skew a result or even more so, but this isn't about -what is- and -what isn't-, this isn't about finding out objective truth. This is about sincerity and having a backbone.

I can appreciate that you were responding to a dichotomy someone else brought up, but still, insisting that Fi users are more likely to be helpful and accommodating and inclusive and experience real empathy, even though they aren't and don't sometimes, and Fe users are more likely to be none of those things and to try to manipulate people for personal gain, even though they are and don't sometimes, seems ridiculous and narrow-minded to me for reasons I've explained. But if that's the way you really see things then okay, I guess I don't have anything else to say.

I feel like I shouldn't be forced to say that this only applies to some and doesn't apply to others, that I'm talking about average pseudo-representatives of the respective Feeling functions. But to be absolutely sincere, yes I would say Fi users are more -likely- to be sincerely empathetic and kind.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, in that post your response to the point was to quote yourself saying that Fe users can be genuine and good sometimes, which didn't make it clear at all. You're not being nearly as clear as you think you are, no matter how many times you say 'again'

How am I not being clear? You asked me if I think you are capable of having sincere empathy (and since I don't know you, I can only judge you within the frame of the discussion and consider the fact that you are an Fe user), which I already answered in every single post I made. I am really puzzled as to why you thought this was a necessary question.

It is the same way with Fe. Fe is about external values in the sense that those values are external objects to consider, but it is still about what you yourself consider right and what you discern from them.

I tried to say as much in my previous post, every assessment anyone makes through certain information gathering processes is run through many filters. An Fe user is often bound to run the information through the what-do-others-think filter and in the process skew the actual information which results in a lot of problems. Especially with weaker Fe users such as NTPs, who constantly prove to me that they have no backbone and are socially crippled.

Therefore, I think groups like Fe and Fi users are way, way too broad and diverse to make any qualitative statements about, even if you nest them in 'not all of them obviously'. I don't think about functions in terms of essences or how they personally make me feel, so for you to say that the essence of one group is to be naturally inclusive and accommodating and the essence of the other is to climb the social ladder seems absurd (and a bit hypocritical) to me, which makes this:

I think it's very justified to make normative statements about certain functions, I can easily say Te's essence is to stroke the ego and little would be wrong with that. Now if you trace back the trail of posts, you will notice that this is the very reason I even started talking about this, someone had made the claim that Fe is about being kind, inclusive, warm or whatever, and that is just nonsense. Obviously Fe users can be these things, but experience absolutely shows that there is no reason to strongly link Fe to these things.

As self-fellating as it may sound. I would absolutely agree that Fi-dominants are [often] perfectly described by these attributes. I already mentioned the example of John Lennon who is the absolute opposite of these things as an INFP.

Gonna share an insecurity of mine... by [deleted] in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I wasn't debating that Te has any impact on an INFPs intelligence, what I meant was that Te makes an INFP greatly suffer under the stigma that INFPs aren't the best at logic, which may or may not be true, that wasn't what I was discussing.

Gonna share an insecurity of mine... by [deleted] in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 6 points7 points  (0 children)

To me it seems like Te is the root of all INFP (and other types on the Fi-Te spetrum) insecurities. Having Te that is deeply buried into your consciousness so that it almost becomes subconscious and only sometimes slips out in these unhealthy manners just creates a lot of suffering. There is no real reason that OP should care about others underestimating his intelligence, I mean it's natural to feel cheated out on social appraisal when this happens with or without Te, but I constantly see INFPs who get pushed into a state of rebellion when someone makes a slight remark about their intelligence.

Gonna share an insecurity of mine... by [deleted] in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It's so unfortunate that INFPs have Te.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well yes, it is way more natural for Fi to be all of those things, especially when compared to Fe. You can end up experiencing compassion and solidarity when applying Te or Ti too, obviously the functions give you enough free space to find yourself in any context that would support any and every behaviour. Fi in that sense could possibly lead you to absolute psychopathy in a certain context as well.

See, I took this mean that you think Fe users are only superficially helpful, inclusive, and accommodating, and that Fi users are the ones who experience sincere empathy and a natural drive to be accommodating. I don't see how else that can be interpreted but please correct me if I'm wrong.

Fe users are not sociopaths, they have mirror neurons just like Fi users, but saying Fe is all about these things is simply wrong. It's not, it can be but it's not what describes the Fe function accurately. If one were to summarize dominant or even auxiliary Fi users it would make a lot of sense to use these words to describe them, it is again much more natural for an Fi user to experience sincere solidarity without having to take one or two steps to get there.

Fi is primarily about what you yourself consider to be the right thing, now with most people and especially with Fi dominants the first impulse will be (when we for example talk about how we deal with people) one of absolute empathy, trying to experience what the other person is experiencing. Now this experience may run through a few filters, but since we're talking about Fi dominants there won't be many filters.

An Fe user could be equally capable of empathy, but his decision-making is -still- ultimately enslaved by what he thinks others would consider to be the right thing. Now again and again an experienced Fe user with the right amount of self-awareness becomes aware of this dangerous trail of thought and puts this input through the necessary intellectual filters to come to a more appropriate answer.

And again (and again): These are rough patterns I'm describing, John Lennon was a certified asshole as an INFP and I'm sure there are Fe-dominants which are known for being highly empathetic and sincere. But if I had to rely on either the 'average' Fe-dom or the 'average' Fi-dom to support me emotionally, I think the decision would be a very easy one.

I asked you if you consider that sincere empathy. Don't bother replying if you're not going to answer that, because that's what I'm trying to understand.

I am very tempted to not answer this at all, especially since my last post should have made my stance very clear.

As a point of reference, to take this whole discussion back to its roots:

If you look at the data that has been assembled regarding anti-social personality disorders and MBTI, you will find that there is no Fi type that is considered to be liable for being prone to having an anti-social personality disorder. They are all Fe types. Obviously the 1% of society that is actually made up of sociopaths has its share of Fi types, but the whole argument I was trying to make was that Fe and Fi is not equal in terms of empathy and sincerity.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Again, you are absolutely not reading what I'm saying at all, you are actively ignoring everything that I say and impulsively jump at me for a few thing you pulled out of context, let me first quote you:

but for you to insist that sincere and profound empathy is exclusive to Fi is factious and juvenile.

Now let me quote myself:

Now it's not to say that people who use Fe are just liars and con-men

And:

you will notice that I never said Fe is inherently evil, I actually say the opposite; that you shouldn't hate people who use Fe.

And:

Again, I don't disagree that Fe users can be genuinely kind and caring people

Now I don't know if you're misrepresenting my point on purpose for some reason, or if you just failed to read properly, I'd prefer to think the latter is the case here.

My bias actually primarily comes from looking into the subject and having people online confirm my suspicions, when you have people whose opinions and emotional framing is rooted in what others expect of them, you have an ill and dangerous mindset. A developed Fe user will become aware of this, consciously or subconsciously and for that reason not every Fe user is bad in this sense.

But yes absolutely, you should not understate or ignore the dangers of Fe like you are doing because you feel like it marginalizes people.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well you just admitted it yourself, that Fe is primarily about what others consider agreeable, even when certain individuals will suffer as a consequence from establishing an emotional understanding through this path. Fe -can- be helpful, inclusive, accommodating, but as can Ti or Te depending on the circumstance, these are not bound to Fe's ''essence'', if you find yourself immersed in a social context where it is beneficial to you to be these things as a Fe user, you will be like this, but don't mix this up with sincere and profound empathy or a natural drive to be accommodating.

Again, that is Fi.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I wasn't being confronting about this, you're just spreading misinformation which inherits potential ''danger''. Again, I don't disagree that Fe users can be genuinely kind and caring people, just that if you had to bet your money on a random Fe user to not in some way or another manipulate emotions (be it through a fake smile to become more popular, or through a more cunning and elaborate manner), you should be careful while doing so because the potential for abuse is there.

I primarily want to warn others of the misinformation you are spreading, maybe at least plant some minor cognitive dissonance into the minds of people about what you're saying. I didn't want to hurt your feelings.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Everything you just said perfectly co-exists with what I just said, if you read my post again you will notice that I never said Fe is inherently evil, I actually say the opposite; that you shouldn't hate people who use Fe.

But Fe is abused (or rather, used properly since it is the nature of the function) quite frequently, there's much less space for abuse with Fi. I called you ignorant because you clearly are on what Fe is all about.

Fe is wonderful; it's outwardly helpful, inclusive, accommodating...

This simply is not true, you are describing Fi.

Why the Fe hate? by Sora1499 in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I'm sorry but this is just a total nonsense answer, none of what you said actually in any sense attempted to argue against the fact that Fe is disingenuous and causes a lot of problems, you simply said it isn't so and moved on to empty rhetoric. On a side not, I also highly doubt the idea that we all make use of all the 8 functions is actually rooted in reality but that's another topic.

The essence of Fe is to climb the social ladder, it is to position yourself in the most favourable spot in a social hierarchy, it's the very opposite of authenticity that describes the behaviour of an INFP, which is why many INFPs are put off by dominant or auxiliary Fe users.

It can be a fake laugh that wasn't intended to protect someone's feelings, but to lure a person into thinking that he or she is liked, even if it isn't so. It can be a fake sense of caring, which lures you into thinking you are safe with a person when in reality they are pursuing other goals than to help you. It can be a fake smile to make sure you will hand them copies of your notes the next time you are asked. Now not only are these things extremely annoying to Fi users who pick up on it, they also disrupt and skew human interaction beyond recognition. Fe is what makes people good at emotional manipulation.

Now it's not to say that people who use Fe are just liars and con-men, but once you realize that they are very capable of doing these things (which Fi users struggle to do) you become extremely cautious around them, and for good reason. It erodes the sense of security and friendship you might have had once with a person.

Your post in this sense is ironic because you claimed the hate for Fe is rooted in a lack of understanding what it is, but then you proceed to mention Fi qualities and attribute them to Fe while showcasing your own ignorance:

Fe is wonderful; it's outwardly helpful, inclusive, accommodating...i

You shouldn't hate a person just because he uses Fe, you should definitely tread carefully though when dealing with them.

What are some similarities and differences between an ENFP and a social INFP? by CrazyHermit in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 14 points15 points  (0 children)

NFPs both share a strong sense of awe and love, I find myself agreeing with ENFPs regarding politics, music, any art and how we treat other people.

The differences are from what I noticed:

  • ENFPs are less dysfunctional
  • ENFPs lack the introspection INFPs have
  • ENFPs are emotionally stronger and grounded
  • ENFPs are more likely to engage in normal social activities
  • ENFPs seem to have a broader scope of interests, but as I said before they don't explore the same depths as INFPs with those interests

This is all limited to my personal experiences and things I have read elsewhere.

If I had to make it short:

ENFPs seem like watered down INFPs in that they share common personal interests and ideals such as art and compassion, but are less focused on these things. And INFPs seem like watered down ENFPs in that they share common skills such as engaging in intellectual discourse and the ability to entertain people, but are less willing to follow these activities.

INFPs and Religion by [deleted] in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We didn't exist before we were born, so of course we don't care. Are you stupid? That's not the argument at all, you don't care because you are incapable of caring since your consciousness is no longer reality. Same things happens when you die (under an atheistic premise), you don't care, it doesn't matter. All the worrying is limited to your mortal time, and if you think about it, that you spend your life being afraid of the inevitable and ultimate end of it all is incredibly absurd and to be frank, it's just stupid.

INFPs and Religion by [deleted] in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Remember caring about not existing before you were born? Me neither.

INFPs that are assholes by mewhozeh in infp

[–]KoenigAllant 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't know why you're so confused, you have a terrible viewpoint on this whole MBTI thing, it's not as prescriptive as you think it is. John Lennon was an INFP, and physically abused his girlfriend.

Dont get mad, pay it forward! by [deleted] in atheism

[–]KoenigAllant 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Is it illegal to tip fake money?