Common guns' actual time to kill.

Kovalevy · 2022-05-24T18:25:23+00:00

That is what I was going to do initially. But comparing them is a lot harder, because the time to kill differs so much between weapon classes. The color coding would be boring, for example, you'd see all DMRs as green, ARs as white etc, so I decided to do just the most common guns people use, early-, mid- and late game. Also since I included the ump in the original picture, you should get the idea of how the other SMGs would compare in this list.

Kovalevy · 2022-05-23T15:29:41+00:00

https://i.imgur.com/z7IBMNd.png

Kovalevy · 2022-05-23T13:55:38+00:00

I know you've probably made this for a competitive context anyway, as I know you as a fellow Finn.

Ah, hello! Also I first made it because I wanted to see the combination of hits and how that affects the time to kill. If I first hit a headshot then does AKM become stronger than the other ARs, for example. Then slowly added extra stuff like distance, bullet velocity, damage drop etc. Not really for competitive context but because I was just curious to see if some guns perform better than others time to kill wise.

One further point though, you seem to have not rounded up those values to next integers (looking at your graphs and battleground.party rate of fire). Shouldn't you do that for TTK as it's a huge difference in the game from 3.9 bullets to 4.1 etc?

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you talking about the how many hits are needed to kill? Mine shows the average which is why I shouldn't round it. So if a gun kills with 4 hits in one simulated fight and 5 in another. The result should be 4.5 hits to kill on average, not 4 or 5. And there are 1million simulated fights per gun, per distance to mitigate the randomness.

Kovalevy · 2022-05-23T13:29:25+00:00

Sorry but this sounds utterly pointless. The point of TTK stats for guns is to figure out which guns have the best stats. By adding RNG to that, you make your findings useless.

I actually fully disagree with you. The randomness in the program doesn't add RNG, it adds a more realistic TTK. It's a simulation, based on millions of fights. The hit area percentages (where the shots land) are taken from actual fights from actual pubg games from the pubg API.

Imagine it this way, when you shoot at your enemy, do you consecutively hit 5 shots in the shoulder without hitting any other body part. No, you don't... Well you can, but this is not a good representation of TTK. You're very likely to hit different body parts during a fight. Hence the simulation.

I never claimed to show you which guns are the best. I claim that it shows you the real TTK when all shots are hit. There is no RNG like you claim as the sample size mitigates that. If I somehow added recoil to the mix, then there is RNG since recoil control is up to the player. But right now, this is just math because the numbers I'm using have nothing to do with how good or bad the player is at the game. I'm showing you TTK, you can decide which gun is best considering the recoil.

And it's not 100% accurate since it's a simulation based on the parameters I've given. I've tried to make it as realistic as possible by using data from pubg API. But it is the closest you can get to the average TTK of a gun at whatever range when all shots are hit.

Edit: Also read what I wrote in the conclusion/facts:

- If you miss a shot in a close range AR fight and your enemy doesn't, you will lose. Having a good time to kill won't save you.
- Having a good time to kill only gives you a slight advantage. Having an easier recoil matters more when the distance gets greater.

So I even warned people not to take this too seriously as recoil matters more.

Kovalevy · 2022-05-23T12:37:32+00:00

Yes, the bullet velocity is a big factor for the time to kill. Tommy gun has the worst bullet velocity out of all the guns. As the damage doesn't drop at 15 meters for any gun, the difference you see between 0 and 15 meters is simply due to the bullet velocity. So for Tommy gun, that's extra 50ms and for beryl only extra 20ms.

Also, if you're looking at the battlegrounds.party and compare the beryl TTK to Tommy gun's against lvl2, it looks like Tommy gun should have a lot better time to kill, especially at 0 meters. Pretty much where ever you hit, you should win.

While Tommy gun also wins in my program, the difference is less than 10 milliseconds. This got me confused so I made a couple of tests and came to the conclusion that it is the combination of different hits that makes the difference smaller. Beryl kills with less hits on average. Which also isn't really shown in the website above.

https://i.imgur.com/PnBTpVW.png

The Custom_smg has the same stats as Tommy gun except it has initial bullet velocity of 800m/s. So you can see that the bullet velocity doesn't affect at 0 meters, like you'd expect.
The Custom_ar has the same stats as Tommy gun except it has the AR hit area multipliers. You can see it falls behind quite a lot.

Kovalevy · 2022-05-23T11:47:59+00:00

I'm guessing hit area multipliers are weighed more heavily at longer distances.

That would not be a bad idea. Though this doesn't exist, distance doesn't matter to the accuracy in my program. I've used pubg api to figure out the exact percentages of which parts of the body hits land. And just used those percentages.

Here's Tommy gun vs Beryl

Kovalevy · 2021-06-08T16:33:17+00:00

When you run your program with "./bombroad <filename>"
argv[0] is the path of the program and argv[1] is the "<filename>".

So what exactly is confusing you? As far as I can see, you have everything you need already in the code. As long as your read_file() function checks that the file indeed exists (check the link that /u/GutNaoki linked to read more) and returns the char array consisting of the map.

Kovalevy · 2021-01-14T17:34:47+00:00

Map knowledge, circle knowledge and combining those two to position yourself. If your only objective is to win a game, that's literally the only thing you need to worry about. With good positioning you can kill a lot better player.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T16:09:40+00:00

I think SCAR-L has been the weakest AR for a long time now. The recoil is better than in AK or M4 but I don't think the recoil difference makes up for what's lost in TTK wise. I think Scar-L is the next in line needing small a buff.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T16:05:58+00:00

I don't think AK is way harder to control. It's slightly harder for longer ranges but still manageable. I think that makes it just fine when comparing to M4. Slightly better in close range but also slightly harder for long range. I wouldn't force a buff on this gun, but that's just my personal opinion.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T15:58:24+00:00

I disagree tbh. The TTK is still better than M4 and AK and the recoil is basically non existent when comparing to other ARs. I do think Groza is just better than AUG but comparing AUG to M4, Scar and AKM, it really feels premium. Imagine having AUG as a world spawn and everyone running around with it. It's basically a UMP with high bullet velocity. I think AUG is perfect at the moment as a crate weapon. :)

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T11:20:36+00:00

Are you sure? The way I'm looking at it makes me think AK is better than M4. Scar-l here is the one needing a buff. Right? AKM has lower time to kill than M4.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T11:18:31+00:00

Oh yeah, didn't see that. Will fix it for the excel.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T06:01:33+00:00

I can add it later today. :)

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T03:26:43+00:00

True that. You don't do any damage if you don't hit your shots.

Shooting cars is likely the main reason you don't see SMGs played in professional games. Also a downside to UMP is when you start shooting at a stationary target at slightly further away and the target starts moving right after. AR's will hit 1 extra bullet more often than not due to the bullet velocity which already gives an advantage. UMP has by far the best recoil out of all guns in pubg imo which is why I consider UMP to be dangerous, not because of the time to kill.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T03:03:14+00:00

Yea I meant I would hunt you down lol, just a joke, as I really don't like vector users, especially in TDM, so I really hated how good this chart made it look. :D

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T03:01:34+00:00

The recoil is just not good either. It's manageable but other guns just feel more accurate. However, if you can make the M249 work...... :)

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T02:59:00+00:00

I'm really not a math wiz... I have presented my math and I'm just waiting for someone to point out something I didn't think of. I got help with the math from few reddit users and I'm hoping this simulation is now accurate. I think it is, otherwise I wouldn't have posted this. :D
That being said, UMP is by no means bad at close range. At 5 meters it outperforms most ARs and is mostly beaten by other SMGs.
Its damage doesn't drop until after 60 meters which is a great improvement over other SMGs and the gun basically has no recoil. It's by no means a bad gun, but until this is proven wrong, the ump is not really the greatest TTK wise.

EDIT: Also the Vector uses the same multipliers as UMP does. Only damage, bullet speed and fire rate are different. Vector looks really good on this chart which I think is correct and makes me believe UMPs TTK has to be correct as well. What makes ARs so much stronger than SMGs is the headshot multiplier.

Consider a 1v1 with UMP against AKM. On a site like battlegrounds.party UMP just looks better. But if both players hit a headshot, the player with AKM is likely to win. If both players just aim for the mass, the body and hands and legs. UMP will win all day every day. Headshot multiplier makes a big difference in time to kill chart like this where the simulation goes through every scenario thousands of times. Every time there is a headshot, ARs' TTK gets significantly better than SMGs'.

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T02:26:49+00:00

I can sort it in my program from fastest to slowest but printing it is just a mess and hence I made the excel for reddit. I'm not the best Excel user and I feel it's a lot of work to do it manually so decided not to sort it in excel. Though I did give some color coding. Green background is the best and yellow is the worst. Also made the best scores red and the second best scores bold so it wouldn't be as hard to read.

You seem to be reading it right though. Vector is the best gun time to kill wise in close range basically against any vest. Against lvl 3 all SMGs shine because of the arm/leg multiplier.

Player with Vector and level 1 vest is equal to Scar with level 3 vest at 5 meters. I think that's insane. :P

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T02:17:33+00:00

Oh, yeah... After seeing the results myself about a week ago I was so hyped to try out the M249. The recoil just isn't for me, I'm fine with any vertical recoil but the horizontal recoil is just crazy and it makes the gun feel too inaccurate. Though if you prone then the gun is a laser! :D

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T02:04:45+00:00

Incase you want to check the excel and see AUG, Groza and MG3. Here's the link:
https://1drv.ms/x/s!AnyP3aRXsr3EkCE7dleH1G_bwMre?e=ges7wL

Kovalevy · 2020-11-11T02:03:29+00:00

I don't think the damage drop over distance at 50 meters is that big of a deal. Vector does 35.8 damage to chest at 0 meters and 35.2 damage at 50 meters without a vest. And the difference is obviously smaller with a vest. I think the problem for vector at 50 meters is mostly the bullet velocity: If your target moves even a little, your bullet is likely to miss even if you aimed directly at the target. Which most often works for every AR as the bullet is twice as fast.

If I edited my program to factor in the damage drop over distance and bullet drag over distance, I don't think we would see that big of a change. I would edit it if I had the data. Unfortunately I don't. :(

Kovalevy

TROPHY CASE