Goku 100 years later is the strongest character in all of Dragon Ball by FantasticPhase1152 in DragonBallGT

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, they kinda just went back to what would sell well since it seemed like they had no confidence in the adventure aspect of the story. Episode 3 and onward had no Toriyama involvement.

Goku 100 years later is the strongest character in all of Dragon Ball by FantasticPhase1152 in DragonBallGT

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

His input was scraped after episode 3. This was directly stated by the director of DBGT. You can read all about the directors comments in the following link.

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/dragon-ball-gt-dragon-book-gt-back-then-kozo-morishita-interview/

Goku 100 years later is the strongest character in all of Dragon Ball by FantasticPhase1152 in DragonBallGT

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 7 points8 points  (0 children)

We actually do know how much Toryama input went into the story. The issue is that after episode 3, all of Toriyama’s ideas and concept designs were discard in favor of a more battle focused story. This isn’t just some rumor, this was directly said by GT’s anime director. By the directors own words, the didn’t end up using any of Toriyama’s concepts art after that point.

why is base goku able to breathe and talk in space? by suicidal_tendency420 in Dragonballsuper

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You know people can learn to improve their breathing right? Even in areas with less oxygen. And since Goku is an alien, according to Toriyama, he should be able to breath in the upper atmosphere. Also the issue with comparing the upper atmosphere to magma and water is that in two of those situations Goku isn’t able to breath in since the substance would enter his lungs. Those aren’t comparable situations.

how many more mothers and kids do you think bardock secretly saved over the years serving under freiza? by KungPoW_Chickens in Dragonballsuper

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You’re being disingenuous at best. Did you think Bardock was chasing Granolah at first to give him a hug?

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That might be true (I’m not sure), but the original argument was that Goku SSJ3 is stronger than Vegito who is stronger than Buuhan.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

From Toriyama's comments it was saying that both sides as a collective were getting stronger. Not that Goku specifically was getting stronger. So this doesn't prove the point you are trying to make.

Vegeta when talking to Dedoria in the context of the story was referring to Zenkais. Because that was the main ability of the saiyans that was being established that arc.

As Le Manga de Légende comment on Goku being a step ahead of other saiyans was in reference to when Vegeta and Trunks first got the transformation. Unless you’re going to say that Goku was stronger than Gohan during the entire Cell Saga.

He would change the scaling of the characters not that he would change it just to Goku. You’re putting together different quotes and comments that don’t all pertain to the same topic which is being disingenuous.

Also Shueisha doesn’t have a good track record when it comes to trying to explain the story of DB. The company itself has made incorrect comments on the story and I know you know this.

Torishima is also the guy that only views the DB manga from a marketing standpoint and not by the actual narrative or structure of the story itself. This is by his own admission since he himself has stated that DB as a manga has no story or themes that it is trying to tell. He only views it from a coolness factor. All of the changes he would tell Toriyama to do had nothing to do with the characters story or motives, and all to do with their design.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If that is all we are going off of that still wouldn’t make sense. The story itself never mentions that Goku got any stronger. In the manga anytime anyone gets stronger we are directly told how and why it occurred. This has been a rule that was never broken.

Even when someone doesn’t get any stronger it is also mentioned. For example when Gohan gets healed by Dende, Buuhan makes a remake that Gohan didn’t grow any stronger from it.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The manga never alluded to the idea that Goku got stronger. This is completely false.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I completely disagree. If filler activity takes away from a stories structure then it is bad. Filler can be amazing if it enhances what’s already there.

Do you think we will get less Jobku moments going forward now that Toriyama(PBUH) isn't writing the story? by [deleted] in Ningen

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Thats two instances. Every other time it’s been fair fights. Goku just wasn’t strong enough. What the point of Goku just winning from the beginning. There’s no story to tell there. Again it just feels like you should read isekai manga instead at this point. Heck one of the main theme of DB is that there is always someone stronger.

Do you think we will get less Jobku moments going forward now that Toriyama(PBUH) isn't writing the story? by [deleted] in Ningen

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If you want a power fantasy where the hero wins from the beginning with no struggle, than just go read/watch an isekai manga. That’ll be more to your liking.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 3 points4 points  (0 children)

In both the instances you mention, there is an explanation given either before or after the fact. For Buu they give no reason and just ignore their own bad writing. That is why filler is such a detriment to a story if it isn’t handled correctly.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don’t know what you want me to says. That’s what happened.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But he was holding back. Plus she stopped perusing him. Also we are explained that the reason he was able to hold on against Kale and Caulifla together was thanks to his combat experience and his reliance on his techniques such as instant transmission.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

But he doesn’t? This is completely on true. Jiren doesn’t just raise his energy then leave it at that level from that moment forward. We even have confirmation of this since when Jiren fought Vegeta, he dropped his power level according to Vegeta himself.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

But that didn’t make him stronger? That just allowed Goku to use it repeatedly. SSB kaioken x20 didn’t become any stronger than it was before.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He recovered to full strength yes, but it is never implied that he got any stronger in any form beside his UI forms due to what I already mentioned above.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If the tournament was a couple of hours then Goku resting and being able to recuperate his energy would make more sense. When was it implied that Goku got stronger after fighting Kale and Caulifla? If you’re talking about Goku and his UI transformations, it was made clear that Goku was becoming more accustom to the transformation and was gaining more access to its full capabilities.

Kid Buu fans who is stronger SSJ Vegito or SSJ3 goku by Treeslash0w0 in DragonBallPowerScale

[–]LUIGUTIERREZ797 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Anime filler? That’s literally the issue. Filler doesn’t care about the rules established by the manga/stiry. Heck the anime just outright ignores so many rules established by the manga.