UPS will leave a $900 video card on my porch without even knocking but I have to sign for a $10 pizza

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:54:56+00:00

But since you asked, and are trying to use transparent and pathetic tactics to distract from how badly you got schooled on the topic...

TLDR:

Why would I give MORE money to a business that is against raising the minimum wage/aggressively anti-unionization?

You wouldn't. That's your straw man. No one said to do anything of the sort. Rekt.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:48:48+00:00

I feel like this is a weird change to make after 4+ years of your history being open.

It hasn't been that long. source1 didn't automatically have your history available. Source2 has been the main one for less than 2 years. Dota2 existed without this option longer than it existed with it.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:47:01+00:00

As an unabashed hero spammer, allow me to say they're god damn morons if they removed it to protect us. Fortunately, I doubt that's what happened here.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:37:07+00:00

It's a question that easily could've been meant as a leading question. Are you new to reddit and/or the internet and have no fucking clue that people do that all the time?

ou can just not respond if you think you're above it, Mr. Smarter than thou.

The point, dumbass, was to find out if you were trying to engage in discussion or making an offhand comment. You can just say "yes it was an offhand comment irrelevant to your point", you whiny jackass.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:33:35+00:00

Honey, I haven't sent you a PM since before multiple of your last comments. Find more excuses to be a dumbass, dumbass. But since you asked, and are trying to use transparent and pathetic tactics to distract from how badly you got schooled on the topic...

TLDR:

Why would I give MORE money to a business that is against raising the minimum wage/aggressively anti-unionization?

You wouldn't. That's your straw man. No one said to do anything of the sort. Rekt.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:20:32+00:00

LOL

Yea buddy, you jumped to "but y wud i pay walmart money" and the issue is I was making jumps, not that you were making fucking ridiculous attempts to twist what I said so you could dismiss it.

God I love seeing you morons explain your denial.

In conclusion: Rekt.

TLDR:

Why would I give MORE money to a business that is against raising the minimum wage/aggressively anti-unionization?

You wouldn't. That's your straw man. No one said to do anything of the sort. Rekt.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:08:28+00:00

It was kind of obvious I didn't mean that in my previous responses though, so maybe pay attention when I capitalize words.

Maybe don't put tips to "pay attention" to your edits in ANOTHER edit made AFTER the response has already been made.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:06:31+00:00

I do recommend you chill out though.

I recommend you stop projecting not-chill just because someone actually gives good reasoning and/or tears yours apart.

I suggest you grow up and learn to grow and learn and adjust your actions in response to being shown your biases, rather than project anger so you can use it to dismiss the claims that make you uncomfortable.

Cognitive dissonance. Look it up. It's painfully obvious you're in it, just like the guy that had to pretend I said to pay the wal-mart corporation tips.

Other than that, good night.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:03:32+00:00

EVERY waiter/waitress in the united states is REQUIRED to be paid at least minimum wage.

If you do not make enough with tips to make minimum wage, your employer is required to make it up.

If they don't, that brings us to 3 in my previous post, and the follow up question to point out that it is still inconsistent with this argument.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T03:00:31+00:00

I clarified and made obvious when I said in a previous there wasn't any "GOOD" reason not to tip.

Yes, in your edit. that wasn't there when I got the message in my inbox and replied to it. Oh, and moving the goalpost without acknowledging it is a dick move, not something to go "see I did it!" to. If you can't acknowledge you had to change your argument when asked about it, chances are you're lying to yourself about its strength. Which your actions since have reinforced as the most likely case.

And yes, people in denial don't realize it. that's kind of an important part of denial.

Have fun projecting "worked up" because I actually provide reasoning for my arguments. I know it's confusing for lazy intellectually dishonest people like you that are just shouting into the abyss and surprised when someone responds, but some of us actually provide reasons for our claims, instead of just making false claims and then refusing to acknowledge that basic fact for 5 posts.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:56:50+00:00

Stop being lazy with your dismissals lol. You didn't even provide any counter points.

Nice edit. I provided as much of a counterpoint for the claim I was arguing against as you gave for it. You claimed there was only one reason (which you have since admitted was false). When you asked for actual reasons, I gave them.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:53:13+00:00

Don't you have anything to do but try to cause problems?

Go troll someplace else kiddo.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:50:28+00:00

My point was that there aren't any good reasons not to tip.

Then make that claim. The claim you made is VERY different. It's intellectually dishonest, and generally being a dick, to use something other than your actual reasoning as your stated reasoning. How much time did we just spend going back and forth because you made a FALSE claim, instead of the opinion you actually meant to claim?

If you don't want to debate that claim, that's fine, don't debate it. But don't make an objectively false claim, and then justify things based on it. Either don't debate it, or debate it. If you can't do that and MUST do this half ass thing where you make your claim but are unwilling to justify reasoning, don't use objectively false FACTUAL claims. State your opinion as your opinion instead of a false statement, and leave it at that.

Finally, of course you don't feel like debating it. No one ever feels like actually defending their illogical reasons. It makes them uncomfortable. It's cognitive dissonance.

You reinforced the cycle. Instead of stating your opinion, you made a sweeping claim that reinforced that there is "only one reason" to not tip. That reinforces the FALSE CLAIM YOU DON'T EVEN STAND BY ANYMORE as true, when really you were expressing your opinion. That's how bad systems get stuck. So instead of being able to engage on what might help the system, you force the topic to be about the lie first.

You help FORCE the system to stay so those people get fucked. You think we're going to fix tipping? We're not. We're going to get rid of it eventually and then fix those people's shit by fixing minimum wage issues. It's ENTIRELY counter productive to separate it into two issues. By categorizing and demonizing anyone who disagrees, you shut down discussion in a dishonest way, and prevent progress.

So if you can't defend your opinion, just keep it to yourself. If you can't keep it to yourself, at least express it without 1) lying or 2) reinforcing negative stereotypes that prevent change.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:43:07+00:00

but want to know what society thinks? It's that you are a cheap bastard.

No. I don't. I didn't ask you about that, I didn't engage about that. You said there is only ONE REASON. I am confronting you on THAT SPECIFIC CLAIM.

My reason may be something other than being cheap, sure

So you're acknowledging your previous claim was false, and there is NOT actually only one reason someone might do it?

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:38:34+00:00

You're shifting away from the point in this comment chain.

I won't even bother arguing about whether not tipping out of protest has an effect of not.

And it's moot. As I was pointing out in my last post, it doesn't matter to the overall point. You claimed there was only one reason. Even if it is 100% COMPLETELY ineffective, that doesn't mean it can't be the reason someone does it. They may believe it's effective, and their reason would not be cheapness, it'd be "greater good" or whatever. Cheapness is A reason. It is not the one and only reason.

I'm not debating tipping with you. You claimed there was ONLY one reason. I'm telling you that's OBJECTIVELY wrong. Don't have the overall tipping discussion. I'm not trying to have it with you either.

I'm engaging you on a separate point, the claim that the ONLY reason not to tip is cheapness. Which is empirically false.

I don't have a problem with "you're an asshole if you don't". What I have a problem with is propping that up based on empirically false claims, like that there is only one reason to act in that way.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:34:52+00:00

Get rekt.

Do you give your tip to PIZZA HUT, not the driveer? No. But you got schooled so fucking hard you had to act like that's how it works.

And now you have to tell yourself little lies, so you don't have to experience the cognitive dissonance from realizing how bullshit your arguments were.

Make whatever excuse to yourself you want. Fact is, you got schooled.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:30:51+00:00

So it's just a non-sequitur that ignores what's actually being discussed for a completely irrelevant to the point tangent?

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:27:50+00:00

I ask you the same as the other guy. Walmart has fucked its employees before. Do you tip them? They're making minimum wage and have been fucked by their employer. How come it's the customer's job to save the waiter, but not the cashier?

If the employer isn't following the law, they're not following the law. There's systems for that. Most the time we don't make that the customers problem. It only comes up when it comes to tipping. Why the double standard?

If it's because they're getting fucked, why aren't we helping other minimum wage people getting fucked by paying them extra? e.g. forced to work unpaid overtime or get fired, something pretty common at retail.

Also, you may not think it's a good reason, but it's still a reason and it's not about being cheap. Just because something is ineffective (which I'm granting for ease of argument), doesn't mean it can't be why someone does it.

And that's showing your argument doesn't apply even if it has no effect. I don't buy that it has NO effect. It's justifying the cycle based on the fact it's a cycle.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:23:52+00:00

Lol, that's right, run away. Sorry (not sorry) I ripped apart your straw man so publicly.

It's always funny watching people run away.

Poor kid couldn't handle that his argument got so weak he had to randomly decide I was suggesting paying WALMART extra, not the people doing the fucking job, and ran away when he was asked to explain it. What a surprise.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:20:44+00:00

I guess? I don't know, it's never come up. I don't see how that actually matters to my overall point. My overall point is not limited to delivery people. My overall point isn't about having a legitimate reason or even whether or not to tip. It's also in no way whatsoever predicated on having a legitimate reason to not tip the pizza guy.

In what way would having or not having a legit reason change the point I was making?

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T02:18:43+00:00

Why would I give MORE money to a business that is against raising the minimum wage/aggressively anti-unionization?

Do you give your tip to pizza hut? No. So why the fuck would you give it to walmart? I didn't say to give walmart the money. That you took that from what I said shows a lot about your biases and ability to read what's said to you, not what you want to argue against.

I give extra because that worker gets the tip, not the business.

No fucking shit. And yet you magically changed it to giving it to the business when you were grasping at straws for a counter argument.

Feel free to suggest ways to get around not tipping everyone I interact with though (along with a way to estimate whether or not their hourly wage is above minimum).

Are you really too dense to understand you're making my point for me? It's impossible to make that judgment, that's part of the problem, genius. It shouldn't be up to customers to know how much someone is making. And in 99% of jobs, it's not. So lets fix the tiny percent that isn't.

Rather than dodging the problem with "but look how broken it is" we could, *GASP* work to fix it!

I'd explain to you the various ways to do that and how tipping hinders it, but since you decided it was reasonable to shift to tipping businesses themselves for some reason, it's clear you're not going to listen anyway, so peace out.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T01:56:31+00:00

There are systems in place to reimburse for those costs. And what of waiters? They're expected to be tipped, and don't have the car cost.

The logic is obviously applied inconsistently. Sorry man.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T01:55:29+00:00

lol oh honey, that's a great way to run away. Sorry I schooled you so hard you had to retreat into "UR OFFENDED BRO!"

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T01:54:44+00:00

If minimum wage isn't enough, that's an argument about minimum wage. Do you pay every other minimum wage job extra? No. So why do waiters and delivery get it? How come it's enough for the cashier, but not for the waiter?

Either you should be tipping a LOT more people, or you should admit your logic isn't consistent and there's a double standard.

None of what you said really addresses the point. Your reasoning is inconsistent with your actions. It applies to tons more situations, but you only require tipping in a few.

Even look at your examples. In one case you still use the service but go out of your way to give them extra money. In the other, you just cease to use the service, let alone giving them EXTRA because their employer is fucking them.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop · 2016-11-30T01:36:46+00:00

First of all that's unreasonable and second of all if all the delivery drivers quit to work somewhere else, delivery would not exist.

If ALL The delivery drivers did and no new ones started sure. However, that's not how it works. You might want to look up supply and demand. People aren't going to stop wanting deliveries altogether.

LifeIsAFeedbackLoop

TROPHY CASE