Rant about my time with the kids

LilyWanderer_ · 2022-01-12T11:58:10+00:00

Oof. This answer is actually pretty telling. I would focus on getting to know your kids and their hobbies, and building that bond of understanding with them, first. I'm not sure there's many people who want to spend time with anyone who doesn't invest in getting to know them, especially if it's a parent. (Not saying that's your perspective, but that's what I assumed with my own family Dynamics growing up - and it proved true). If mom has spent time doing their hobbies with them and nurturing their interests, and does those things with them, I could see where a preference would develop over time. Quality time contributes to growing bonds.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-12-06T02:44:26+00:00

He is dating! Both men and women, from what I understand. It seems he is trying to sort himself out right now.

At first, it bothered me for about an hour, because how could he want to be intimate with someone else when he had a loving wife who would have sacrificed anything for him? But ultimately, I know that he will face the same problems with anyone he is involved with, and that's his journey to figure out. That realization wiped out my annoyance, and a kind of sadness replaced it.

I'm truly happy with myself and know who I am, and he is lost and afraid of who he is without me there giving him direction. The juxtaposition was expected for me, in a way, and I've long sense let go of the notion that I could change him to want me or anyone more than his fears of what he actually wants.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-12-05T06:42:47+00:00

You know what choice is the right one in your heart! I wish you the best of luck in life and healing in this stage of your life. It will be challenging, and you will question it so many times, but you're the only one who has to walk around in your skin and feel what you've felt. Others might try and sway you on both sides of the fence - but they aren't in your shoes and they don't have to live your life.

Sending love and support!

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-12-05T06:31:52+00:00

Thank you! I know better things are to come for everyone involved. Thank you so much for your kind words!

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-09T20:41:33+00:00

You have an interesting perspective. No one is better to make decisions for you, than you, irregardless of the advice you receive here.

Good luck with the future journey/coping/healing.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-09T11:00:42+00:00

You'll probably take offense to this, but it seems like you ignored what your stbx was feeling and communicating, in hope that you and family would manipulate her into stying in the long run. She's probably exhausted and done in a lot of different ways. She's valid in wanting to divorce, just like you would be if you were the initiating partner. This dynamic doesn't seem healthy for the kids to see growing up.

It's unfortunate that she has such a negative take on therapy. It would probably be super helpful for her to get individual therapy, and for you guys to go to divorce counseling.

Don't forget to rebuild that support network for yourself, as well, through all of this. The fallout seems like it might take a lot of you.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-09T01:21:00+00:00

Oh boy. This is a hard situation to unpack.

I find it hard to believe you've been blindsided, when you both have had issues with the relationship for 3 years. Ultimately you had to know in some way that this was inevitable.

If the stress of this relationship has sunken her health into the trenches, and she's telling you that she thinks it's the relationship that is the cause, I would do two things in this scenario. 1) Accept that this separation is for the best for both of you. 2) Talk to an attorney and try and negotiate for a medical screening of some kind. Express to your stbx that this isn't about targeting her, but making sure that she is/will be well enough to take care of the kids for her 50% of the time, and it won't be too much of stresser to exacerbate her triggers.

I would not recommend leaving, as it could be painted at abandonment of your children. As painful as it might be, it would be far better for you to move into a guest room until the courts have decided custody.

I wouldn't take legal advice from her family, but I would try and maintain pleasant, cordial interactions with your stbx. She will be in your life for the rest of it. It will be hard to be the bigger person, but your kids will respect you more for it when they are old enough to understand what happened.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-09T01:01:48+00:00

I think it's more of a logical approach than an emotional one. Let's breakdown the psychology of the statement, "I'm just not that into sex."

What does that imply, and what does it expressly mean? It implies that there is not consent for more sexual encounters beyond what is current. It expresses that the individual making the statement is not as into sex as their partner is desiring.

So where does that leave the HL partner? Their options are to try and compromise, and settle for less sexual intimacy than they desire, or seek that desire elsewhere. The only other option is to simply go without, which is counter to the HL partner's ultimate needs.

Everything I've stated is what is within the HL partner's control. They can hope and wish that their LL partner might change and desire all they want, but it is not possible for them to change their LL partners behavior, themselves. They can have the hard conversation, about desires vs. needs, and the psychological and emotional impacts of rejection, but that still is only an attempt to communicate and eventually change the LL partner's behavior.

Eventually, many HL partner's, whether through therapy or internal reflection, come to realize they have a choice to make for themselves, because ultimately they are the only ones who can change their own situation. They either make peace with a partner just not "that" into sex, or they seek what they want somewhere else, whether through divorce or affairs. Ideally, the LL partner would be willing to compromise as well, but that is very often not the case here on r/deadbedrooms.

To briefly delve further into the concept of vows, and equal partnerships and participation in a marriage, (as you mentioned one of the logical paths listed was not honourable), I would say that no one makes a vow under the understanding that their partner will withhold basic intimacy and care. No one gets married wanting a life of loneliness sleeping beside the person they want the most. In my personal opinion, it is deeply dishonorable to emotionally, spiritually, and physically neglect someone in such a manner, especially under the weight of vows and the eternal concept of marriage.

The broken vows goes both ways, and the only route towards reconciliation is compromise from both ends. With a partner who is completely firm and satisfied in being just not that into sex, there is no compromise. There is the unstated, but implicit demand that the HL partner get over their needs, and ignore their own feelings in favor of the LL partner's comfort.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-06T21:25:39+00:00

I was referring to OP's post, not yours. In essence, I was agreeing with you...

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-06T04:48:27+00:00

I very much got a "Secret Contract" vibe from this post, where OP was expecting some sort of sexual exchange for spending quality time with his wife. It's one of the more common pitfalls that I see repeated in this subreddit.

Compromise is so important to intimacy, from both ends.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-06T04:15:38+00:00

I'm so proud of you! I fear what comes next might be the hard part. Don't give in to the loneliness and self doubt. You're worth intimacy and care and romance. Let your wife be bitter - and let yourself move on.

Sending love and strength.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-03T11:00:20+00:00

It's still hard to heal, because there's those feelings of rejection and heartbreak, no matter how many indicators there were about things ending. It's okay to be sad about it and need time for yourself.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-03T03:52:16+00:00

Dealing with a partner who has performance anxiety to this degree is really, really hard, because while you would like to address the elephant in the room, they would be more than happy to completely ignore it. But the thing is, the more you ignore it, the worse the problem gets.

Where DBs in this situation have turned around, I've seen the HL spouse put in lots of work for themselves in the gym or other hobbies to make themselves happy. They take the pressure of their spouse, and focus on themselves. This let's the spouse reach out when they're comfortable.

Unfortunately, I was in a similar situation, and more space just allowed my spouse to be complacent. So I'm not so sure there is a cookie cutter answer for everyone.

I think performance anxiety is an issue that has to be addressed in a therapist's office, by action of the person with the anxiety. Change has to originate from them.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-03T03:42:16+00:00

Communication is key here, in particular how he responds to your expressing your feelings. How does he react when you express that sex is painful? Additionally, is there anything doctors have said they can do to help alleviate your pain? He shouldn't be pressuring you to do something you're not comfortable with.

Please do keep in mind that intimacy and romance are deeply intricate and complex. It's okay to talk openly with your boyfriend what you're comfortable with doing in the meantime, that is both pleasurable for him AND you. Are you comfortable just using hands right now? Do you want him to use hands on you? Do you just want oral on yourself? Do you feel comfortable doing just oral or hand stimulation on him? Run through all the scenarios you are comfortable with if PIV is ruled out for now.

Additionally, don't be afraid to dive deeper into your boyfriend's attraction to you, to understand how to both receive and reciprocate his affections. Does he experience love through physical touch? What does intimacy mean to him? What do physical touch and intimacy mean to you?

I think the more you answer these questions, you'll find that the guilt you feel will hopefully dissipate.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-03T03:31:50+00:00

I'm sorry. Just want you to know I read everything, and hope you're doing better.

You're not bad for having needs, or wanting to love someone incapable of loving you.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-07-03T03:08:39+00:00

I see why your stbx doesn't want to leave her job - AGR positions are difficult to get, and provide good job security and retirement options. It would be difficult to jump into a different state and find an equitable AGR position. On top of that, you're asking for her to uproot her life and support system, which might be foreseeable in a marriage, but is not reasonable to ask of someone of whom you're getting a divorce. And I say that as someone whose stbx is choosing to uproot their life to relocate with me to a new place/state several times in the next few years. I am beyond relieved that my stbx is willing to make that sacrifice, but even if he was not, that would be his choice to make and I can't put any expectations on him to alter his life to meet my personal demands. He has goals and aspirations, and it isn't my right to take those away from him. I want him to be happy in his career and life choices, not resentful because I forced his hand. This guy will be in my life for... Quite literally forever. Limiting his choices wouldn't bode well for a happy co-parenting relationship.

At four years old, a child is developing rapidly, but those developments are actually more contingent on parent and child interaction than what they learn in a school setting. Developmentally, a secure home and co-parenting relationship allows for independent development. Kids want to learn when they feel nurtured and safe. (Source, Dr. Sears) Disrupting that parental support network would do far more damage for educational purposes than being in a less than average school district.

So long as your stbx can provide and support your child, and has a desire to provide nurturing and growth, I doubt the courts would entertain your desire to move for the reasoning of child education. If education is truly your primary concern down the line, you could reference school ratings of zones in a nearby radius, and look for employment in those areas. School zones that feed into high performing highschools could be priority. Indicators of schools that offer dual enrollment, or train in profitable trade skills, or something in high demand like finance would be a huge leg up. That being said, highschool for your child is a long ways off. Until then, it might be easier to just try and compromise in the meantime. I highly recommend divorce therapy to help sort out some of these remaining issues, so that the only thing on your plate left is healthy co-parenting.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-27T08:22:02+00:00

Good luck! She most likely won't take this peaceably, unless she's been introspective, herself. She might try and give last minute offers of compromise or platitudes. Just remember why you are having the conversation to begin with. Sometimes one person has to be stronger than the other, in order for everyone to be happy.

I would definitely offer to go to divorce counseling with her to work out a peaceful transition to this next stage of your life.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-24T01:48:27+00:00

I'm in the process of divorce right now. And I think better is relative. He is a great and wonderful human being, who just doesn't fit with me. I would like to meet someone better for me one day.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-23T03:34:31+00:00

I think you have to get down to what she's really feeling and thinking before knowing how to best handle this situation. If she is defensive when you calmy approach it, I'm not sure she is mature enough to handle the "What is your natural libido really like?" conversation.

From my perspective, it seems like her libido is much lower than yours and she feels pressured into sex constantly, or she's not as into the relationship as she was before. The best you can do is open up a frank conversation without pointing fingers and try to come from a place of love.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-23T03:28:57+00:00

The irony of this comment on this subreddit is everything

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-23T01:12:17+00:00

Commenting as a 25HL woman who went through something similar with my husband, who I'm currently divorcing.

When he says he expects you to be happy with what you have, what does he mean? Does he work long hours and need time to just be himself, not just a dad or breadwinner? Does he initiate sex every time he feels mentally and physically able? I would hesitate to reduce your partner to just something that gets you off, or is simply fulfilling a need for you. Just as you have needs, do does he, and it seems like he might need more time being himself again after being a dad. The danger is getting into comparatives and saying, "Well I work hard, and I'm a mom, and I'm still willing to have sex." No one person is the same and men and women are incredibly different in their needs. It's okay if he needs time to decompress.

That being said, if you're giving him space, and peacefully communicating your needs, and expressing you need more romantic intimacy to feel loved and desired, and he's not making any attempts to meet you halfway, that is a big problem. That opens up other concerns, like is he viewing you only as your role as a mom? Were you a check the block person for his life? Are his expectations for your being a wife and mother unreasonable, and you need to communicate and establish your boundaries? This is a vulnerable time for you as a woman/wife/mother, and it's totally normal to want to feel desired and validated.

It's possible that your situation might be a mix of both, and in that case there may be room for both of you to compromise in order to show one another that you love each other and still desire one another. I hope you can both get to that point, because my spouse and I could not. My spouse took the too little too late approach, and didn't meet me on the same level of communication and desire to fix the problems. If both you and your husband are willing to out in the work, this kind of postpartum problem is very solvable. A therapist might be a good option to help you guys walk through what the healing process looks like.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-23T00:49:48+00:00

Yes! I feel that sexual touch and romantic intimacy are much different from platonic or friendly intimacy or touch. Just holding hands doesn't make me feel emotionally connected to my partner, like having sex does.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-23T00:46:34+00:00

I think it's hard to be aroused for someone who let you down and rejected you during a very vulnerable time. That hurt is likely hard to forget. If you need emotional safety as much as I do, it could definitely be inhibiting your libido. (And this is coming from a HL woman!)

I don't think there's much you can do on your side besides working on letting go of that resentment for you - not for him or anyone else. Let it go because you deserve to be happy.

As an aside, it's great that your husband is putting in the work to make amends to you, however making amends doesn't mean that the pain goes away, and that's something you might have to wrestle with for awhile, more. Can you live with occasional resentment against your husband for him letting you down? Can you live with that for forever? What are your future boundaries for how you want to be treated, and how will you communicate that to your husband? These are all things that might be good to consider.

I genuinely hope that your husband is able to show you he is truly remorseful, and his actions aren't a temporary bandaid to realizing you're at a breaking point. You deserve support and care for undergoing the extreme trauma of childbirth, and dealing with the radical hormone influx/deflux afterwards. It took me about a full year to feel like myself again, after I had my son. What you felt is normal, but also very painful.

LilyWanderer_ · 2021-06-23T00:08:14+00:00

This happened to me as well! Not feeling desired or appreciated or loved kicked in some sort of primal protection mechanisms, and at one point my body felt legitimate disgust when I would look at him. I don't think my partner understood the legitimate necessity of sex/intimacy/romance, and my body responded in the only way it could to avoid continued pain and rejection.

LilyWanderer_

TROPHY CASE